Originally posted by Darth TruculentThe Most Epic Fail I Have Ever Seen on This Forum. FAIL!
Okay here we go:Turning multiple Jedi to the darkside during the Mando Wars and then using them against the Republic during the Jedi Civil War is a major plus. Oh I forgot, didn't the Jedi Civil War nearly destroy the Order?
Plundering ancient Sith knowledge and rituals (one of which Bane used) from Malachor and Korriban
Most powerful Sith: Here we go -
1. Darth Sidious with Kyber Crystal
2. Darth Vader
3. Darth Bane
4. Darth Plagueis
5. Darth Tyranus
6. Darth Rage
7. Darth Maul
8. Darth Scarz
9. Darth Revan
10. Darth Imperius
11. Darth Ghore
12. Darth Vak
13. Darth Slane
14. Darth Vicrone
15. Darth Malak
16. Exar Kun
17. Darth Xio Jade (Best Female Sith Lord of All Time)
18. Darth Seer
19. Darth Thrax
20. Darth Secretus
21. Darth Skorch
22. Darth Craptar
23. Darth Arious
24. Darth Feroceous
25. Darth Mortronik
see: http://www.supershadow.com/starwars/powerful_sith.htmlAlso, wikipedia him up
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it.
Mandalore - The Ultimate was so powerful and skilled that very few could possibly contend with him in combat. He overpowered a promising Jedi (young Malak) with a single blow.
Originally posted by Publius II
The only Mandalore of his time.
Mandalore - The Ultimate was the leader of Mandalorians (in their prime time) and he led Mandalorian armies against the Republic in a war (known in the historical accounts as: The Mandalorian Wars) in an effort to conquer it. His armies won many battles against the Republic forces. Only the "Battle of Malachor V" changed the situation of the entire war (Thanks to Revan, being a great tactician). Once again! Read KOTOR comics.
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it.
Originally posted by Publius II
So a weaker Jango Fett? The guy who a pre-CW Obi-Wan was able to overcome?Please.
Calo Nord was also a powerful bounty hunter with count-less victories to comphrehend his skills in combat. Only Revan killed him.
Originally posted by Publius II
No one cares.
Originally posted by Publius II
Ventress killed seventeen.
The word "MANY" has no limits. Bandon might have killed much more. And so did Revan (according to Kriea).
Originally posted by Publius II
So he's on par with a Nightsister?
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it.
Originally posted by Publius II
Potential means jack shit here.
Read more below:
"So far, Darth Bandon has proven himself to be an excellent choice. Many Jedi have fallen beneath the blade of his lightsaber, and he has yet to meet his equal in combat. In time, Bandon may even challenge Malak for the mantle of Dark Lord, for this is the way of the Sith: the strong must rule, and when the apprentice surpasses the Master, the Master must fall." (Source: Darth Bandon' official profile)
Still have doubts about Bandon' power and skill?
Originally posted by Publius II
Sure, take at face value the self-evaluation of a Dark Jedi who, even when aligned with the Order, was considered headstrong and brash.And considering Malak was clearly capable of overcoming her without any additional assistance, I'm not too impressed.
Originally posted by Publius II
I already noted this.
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it.
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDBandon killing "many" Jedi is good. Very good. (Oh and many can be to or 10,000---without an exact number, speculation abounds as it's all there is). These were also KoTOR Jedi of unknown rank. Ventress killed 17 PT Jedi, and there were masters in that lot. And canon says PT>KoTOR. That fact and the [I]lack of[/] facts surrounding Bandon other than the ambiguous "killed many" does not put him above Ventress.
"So far, Darth Bandon has proven himself to be an excellent choice. Many Jedi have fallen beneath the blade of his lightsaber, and he has yet to meet his equal in combat. In time, Bandon may even challenge Malak for the mantle of Dark Lord, for this is the way of the Sith: the strong must rule, and when the apprentice surpasses the Master, the Master must fall." (Source: Darth Bandon' official profile)Still have doubts about Bandon' power and skill?
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Bandon killing "many" Jedi is good. Very good. (Oh and many can be to or 10,000---without an exact number, speculation abounds as it's all there is). These were also KoTOR Jedi of unknown rank. Ventress killed 17 PT Jedi, and there were masters in that lot. And canon says PT>KoTOR. That fact and the [I]lack of[/] facts surrounding Bandon other than the ambiguous "killed many" does not put him above Ventress.
Also it helps that we've seen Ventress skill level and power both in animation and the comics.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Bandon killing "many" Jedi is good. Very good. (Oh and many can be to or 10,000---without an exact number, speculation abounds as it's all there is). These were also KoTOR Jedi of unknown rank. Ventress killed 17 PT Jedi, and there were masters in that lot. And canon says PT>KoTOR. That fact and the lack of facts surrounding Bandon other than the ambiguous "killed many" does not put him above Ventress.
Ventress killed some Jedi Masters too, which is very impressive and I do rank her among high-profile Dark Jedi. However, Bandon won't be a push-over.
Regarding this PT > KOTOR gimmick, it could be because of following reasons:
A) Big names like Yoda, Mace, Dooku and Anakin
B) Better Education
C) More Organized Order System
However, in the bigger picture:
KOTOR era Jedi (over-all) were more martial and battle-hardened than the PT era Jedi (with exception to a few big names). KOTOR era Jedi have faced proper armies of Sith (comprising of Sith Force users, Droids, and Elite Troopers) and also the Mandalorian Forces. Additionally, most Light Saber combat Forms were invented by the Ancient Jedi.
The PT era Jedi mostly faced armies of Droids and Clone Troopers. Many among them were used Niman users and weren't capable enough to survive in long battles involving lots of Blaster Fire.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDOr because GL says the PT Jedi are Top of the list.
Regarding this PT > KOTOR gimmick, it could be because of following reasons:A) Big names like Yoda, Mace, Dooku and Anakin
B) Better Education
C) More Organized Order SystemHowever, in the bigger picture:
KOTOR era Jedi (over-all) were more martial and battle-hardened than the PT era Jedi (with exception to a few big names). KOTOR era Jedi have faced proper armies of Sith (comprising of Sith Force users, Droids, and Elite Troopers) and also the Mandalorian Forces. Additionally, most Light Saber combat Forms were invented by the Ancient Jedi.
The PT era Jedi mostly faced armies of Droids and Clone Troopers. Many among them were used Niman users and weren't capable enough to survive in long battles involving lots of Blaster Fire.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Bandon killing "many" Jedi is good. Very good. (Oh and many can be to or 10,000---without an exact number, speculation abounds as it's all there is). These were also KoTOR Jedi of unknown rank. Ventress killed 17 PT Jedi, and there were masters in that lot. And canon says PT>KoTOR. That fact and the [I]lack of[/] facts surrounding Bandon other than the ambiguous "killed many" does not put him above Ventress.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDSorry legend but quit your whining kotor fanboyism, lucas, the god of star wars canon specifically made it clear that the PT jedi are the "prime of the jedi" aka they > the kotor jedi.
IKOTOR era Jedi (over-all) were more martial and battle-hardened than the PT era Jedi (with exception to a few big names). KOTOR era Jedi have faced proper armies of Sith (comprising of Sith Force users, Droids, and Elite Troopers) and also the Mandalorian Forces. Additionally, most Light Saber combat Forms were invented by the Ancient Jedi.The PT era Jedi mostly faced armies of Droids and Clone Troopers. Many among them were used Niman users and weren't capable enough to survive in long battles involving lots of Blaster Fire.
I know, but legend is trying to overpower his favourite era jedi trying to make the PT jedi look shit and i am sick of his rampant kotor fanboyism.
Anyways i think ill concede on our little debate in the kreia/malak vs dooku thread, i am so sick of debating that i can barely even form a proper argument.
I'll stick to trolling on kotor fanwankers for now.
Originally posted by Publius II
You sound like S66 now.You made a claim: "Revan [will] rape Ventress with the Force for fun!"
I told you to prove it: "Prove it!"
You said that since it had already been proven [it hasn't] you don't need to [you do]. You then asked "Who does have [the proof]?" That is a clear indicator that you do not have any concrete evidence necessary to make objective claims about the character's ability in a versus scenario. Therefore, [b]you have no case.
[/B]
No one cares about your interpretation of my statement. If you did not understand correctly the context of the statement that is not my fault. I already re-phrase for your understanding which you never answered the question.
Right, Revan who knowledge and mastery was the reason why Bane became as powerful as he did. Who display great force mastery in force lighting, force bonding (which he specialized in), the ability to ripped a language from one’s mind and implant basic (something Darth Caedus could not do). Revan also knew force drain which Ventress has no defense against. Neither any of the other force abilities mention for Revan.
To defeat in hand to hand combat (notice the term hand to hand) Mandalore the Ultimate. Revan was not Mandalore first encounter with a Jedi. Revan defeated the greatest warriors of his time. Ah! You already knew this but it is not enough for you.
If you want to say that the warriors that Revan defeated were weak, prove it, vecause Star Wars history states they were great and extraordinary warriors.
Originally posted by Publius II
No one has ever proven a damn thing about Revan's ability with the Force. Not once. That's why all of the intelligent people continuously label him an "unknown" and insist that he not be used in the versus forum, because we [b]don't know what he's capable of. [/B]
Originally posted by Publius II
Don't try to be a smartass with me, kotor. I've been ridiculously patient with you considering the garbage you've thrown my away. Get back to me when you've learned how to form a coherent argument. Until then, shut up and don't waste my time.
Originally posted by Kotor3Specialty in certain techniques is not conducive of a greater combatant and/or Force-user.
the ability to ripped a language from one’s mind and implant basic (something Darth Caedus could not do). Revan also knew force drain which Ventress has no defense against. Neither any of the other force abilities mention for Revan.
Originally posted by Kotor3You actually make a good point here. Nice.
If you want to say that the warriors that Revan defeated were weak, prove it, vecause Star Wars history states they were great and extraordinary warriors.If Revan is an unknown then your answer in this thread should be I do not know. Not Ventress will win. Stop stating your opinion as if it is fact.
Originally posted by Kotor3I can't even understand the last sentence.
No one cares about your interpretation of my statement. If you did not understand correctly the context of the statement that is not my fault. I already re-phrase for your understanding which you never answered the question.
And stop being an idiot. Your statement was rather clear, and I'll post it a third time for everyone to see:
Revan will continue to Force rape Ventress for fun!What about that requires special interpretation?
Right, Revan who knowledge and mastery was the reason why Bane became as powerful as he did.Revan's knowledge. Nothing is said of his mastery.
And Bane became as powerful as he did because he was uniquely powerful, ambitious, and a prodigious learner. Revan's holocron appears to have been more useful as a philosophical guidebook than anything.
Who display great force mastery in force lighting,Probably blocked by lightsabers.
force bonding (which he specialized in),Relevance to a combat situation?
the ability to ripped a language from one’s mind and implant basic (something Darth Caedus could not do).Against a non-Force-user.
Relevance to a combat situation?
Revan also knew force drain which Ventress has no defense against.You have a semblance of a point here.
Neither any of the other force abilities mention for Revan.See the above.
To defeat in hand to hand combat (notice the term hand to hand) Mandalore the Ultimate.Prove it was hand-to-hand.
Revan was not Mandalore first encounter with a Jedi. Revan defeated the greatest warriors of his time. Ah! You already knew this but it is not enough for you.Correct.
If you want to say that the warriors that Revan defeated were weak, prove it, vecause Star Wars history states they were great and extraordinary warriors.Don't put words in my mouth. His defeat of those three does not put him on the level of someone like Ventress, who is likely one of the greatest duelists of her era. You know, the PT era, prime of the Jedi and all that.
If Revan is an unknown then your answer in this thread should be I do not know. Not Ventress will win. Stop stating your opinion as if it is fact.Go find where I said Ventress would win. Go ahead, quote me.
Lies are sort of hard to pull off when everyone can see what's actually been said.
Faunus you will defend Kreia and Malak in force abilities against Dooku in another threadContext is good. Also, both Traya and Malak have actual cutscenes depicting some application of the Force. Revan's cutscenes consist of him taking his mask off, twirling his lightsaber, or getting blown up.
Guess what you don’t have to be patient anymore I will simply stop responding to your bias statements.I rofl'd.
I repeat:
Originally posted by Me
Get back to me when you've learned how to form a coherent argument. Until then, shut up and don't waste my time.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDNope.
Have you read KOTOR comics?
Mandalore - The Ultimate was so powerful and skilled that very few could possibly contend with him in combat. He overpowered a promising Jedi (young Malak) with a single blow.Okay.
In the Mandalorian order, only one warrior can attain the position of Mandalore and for that to happen, he should be most powerful among the Mandalorians.I gathered.
Mandalore - The Ultimate was the leader of Mandalorians (in their prime time) and he led [b]Mandalorian armies against the Republic in a war (known in the historical accounts as: The Mandalorian Wars) in an effort to conquer it. His armies won many battles against the Republic forces. Only the "Battle of Malachor V" changed the situation of the entire war (Thanks to Revan, being a great tactician). Once again! Read KOTOR comics. [/b]Relevance to a combat situation?
Yusanis was a powerful echani warrior. His daughters (revealed and shown in KOTOR 2) spoke highly about him. According to the historical accounts, the only person to defeat and slay him in the battle was Darth Revan. (Source: KOTOR games)Okay.
Had he ever dueled a Force-user before?
Jango Fett was killed by Mace Windu and that too after he was heavily wounded by a beast and his Jet Packs failed to start. Obi-Wan failed to sub-due him.Obi-Wan was being shot at by the cannons of a starfighter.
Calo Nord was also a powerful bounty hunter with count-less victories to comphrehend his skills in combat. Only Revan killed him.Had he ever fought a prominent Force-user prior to his confrontation with Revan?
You may not care, but those 3 were powerful and skilled warriors, who couldn't be tackled by "average" Jedi or others. Specially the Mandalore - The Ultimate was no push-over for even powerful Jedi. So such victories do speak highly about Revan' combat skills.Kit Fisto and Obi-Wan ring a bell?
So what?Prove he did, or it's irrelevant. Then prove that the quality of the Jedi killed by Bandon was comparable to the quality of those that fell to Ventress.The word "MANY" has no limits. Bandon might have killed much more. And so did Revan (according to Kriea).
So according to your logic, every Sith Lord who knows Force Lightning is on par with a Nightsister but couldn't be better? 🙄No, smartass, according to my logic simply knowing Force-lightning isn't an indicator of prominence or power.
"His great strength in the Force, his natural cruelty and his absolute ruthlessness in his quest for power soon set him apart from his fellow students, and drew the calculating eye of Lord Malak himself." (Source: Darth Bandon' official profile)I still have doubts that they make him comparable to Ventress.Read more below:
"So far, Darth Bandon has proven himself to be an excellent choice. Many Jedi have fallen beneath the blade of his lightsaber, and he has yet to meet his equal in combat. In time, Bandon may even challenge Malak for the mantle of Dark Lord, for this is the way of the Sith: the strong must rule, and when the apprentice surpasses the Master, the Master must fall." (Source: Darth Bandon' official profile)
Still have doubts about Bandon' power and skill?
You and some others under-estimate Malak too much. Dude! He was the strongest Sith alive in his time. Very few could possibly contend with in combat. Even the Jedi Masters of his time avoided direct confrontations wih him. Malak could take on and defeat multiple enemies simultaneously. If Bastilla fell against him, it does not means that she was weak.I never said she was weak. But she isn't necessarily special in the grand scheme of things. Ventress decidedly is.
And it proves that Revan was likely among the most powerful Jedi in Star Wars history because few have displayed combat feats that may rival or exceed Revan'.Plenty have, even those who aren't so prominent. Kit Fisto single-handedly overpowered General Grievous in about a minute; all evidence points to Grievous >>> Calo Nord or Yusanis.
What do you think Revan was doing in the Star Forge? Drinking Martini! 🙄Prove that he fought past everyone and everything to get Malak instead of, say, sneaking past most of them.
When Ventress will take on and defeat a powerful Dark Lord of the Sith, than you will have a point. However! You don't have one as of yet.
Originally posted by Me
Get back to me when you've learned how to form a coherent argument. Until then, shut up and don't waste my time.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Specialty in certain techniques is not conducive of a greater combatant and/or Force-user.
Then we separate Sidious who not only specialize but who’s knowledge of the force both light and darkside made him the most powerful Sith Lord ever. The techniques in which we know that Revan specialize in gives us some insight into how powerful he was in the force. We also know he had a massive amount of knowledge both light and darkside.
I do not see how someone who displayed power in TK and speed can compete with a force user who’s knowledge and mastery changed Bane’s life forever. Ventress no matter how good she is in saber combat has not shown the ability to counter force lighting or the other techniques I’ve mention.
Everyone who Ventress defeated force mastery and knowledge is not greater than that of Revan.
Originally posted by Publius II
And Bane became as powerful as he did because he was uniquely powerful, ambitious, and a prodigious learner. Revan's holocron appears to have been more useful as a philosophical guidebook than anything.
Right someone who is describe as the heart of the force, strong in the force, subjugated everyone during his time, had everyone in awe of his power including Kreia (Before and after she became a Sith Lord) and Sion, had the same teachings as Bane and more but was not more powerful than Ventress?
Originally posted by Publius II
Probably blocked by lightsabers.
Originally posted by Publius II
Relevance to a combat situation?
The more you bond with someone the more effect you have on them influential wise and can help you with your force attacks on them.
Originally posted by Publius II
Against a non-Force-user. Relevance to a combat situation?
Shows a level of mastery and power in the force which you seem to deny.
Originally posted by Publius II
You have a semblance of a point here.
Good!
Originally posted by Publius II
Prove it was hand-to-hand.
It is late I will get back to you on this one.
Originally posted by Publius II
Correct.
Originally posted by Publius II
Don't put words in my mouth. His defeat of those three does not put him on the level of someone like Ventress, who is likely one of the greatest duelists of her era. You know, the PT era, prime of the Jedi and all that.Go find where I said Ventress would win. Go ahead, quote me.
Lies are sort of hard to pull off when everyone can see what's actually been said.
You’ve been implying that Ventress is greater and would win since we don’t have enough info on Revan from the start of the conversation. If you are not saying that then what are you saying?
Originally posted by Publius II
Context is good. Also, both Traya and Malak have actual cutscenes depicting some application of the Force. Revan's cutscenes consist of him taking his mask off, twirling his lightsaber, or getting blown up.
So the game makers of Kotor did not center on showing all of Revan’s techniques but let the user hear about them. So Malak knows and he was taught by? Kreia knows and learned where? But Revan who is described and having a hungry for knowledge never learned those techniques or used them during a time of war?
So your best argument is I did not see so I don't know.