Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Oh, I see that now. The bottom half of the Miracle Machine is similar to the Metron's pattern that resides on the body portion of his suit:
Yep! Why it did it take you so long to figure it out? The initial part you highlighted is similar to Miracles suit as well, but the rest of it is Metron's suit.
^ continued (yeesh, give me a chance to finish)
Originally posted by AllanklesAh. You anticipated my response. Because the upper half of the Miracle Machine resembles the face portion of Metron's suit and more importantly, clearly resembles the pattern on Mr. Miracles suit which you can see in the attached image. And as you say, he is the avatar of the Life Equation. Not only that, we know with Mr. Miracle's suit, his motherboxxx isn't woven into any pattern but into the shoulder of his suit and is detachable, as Sonny Sumo demonstrates when he yells at Mr. Terrific and holds up Mr. Miracle's motherboxxx.
EDIT: I already mentioned that it has several meanings. The sign matched against Miracles' suit and the Mirracle Machine look identical, as Miracle is the avatar of freedom and master of the life equation.
As such, the rest of your argument doesn't matter, because Mr. Miracle's suit pattern definitely does not represent his motherboxxx. As such, patterns that resemble the Miracle Machine do not represent motherboxes. Therefore, everything still stands: (i) you still have not presented any evidence to suggest that Metron's bodysuit pattern is actually a woven motherbox; (ii) I have shown you a scan whereby we see Metron holding his motherbox; and (iii) no motherbox has ever been shown on-panel with a pattern resembling the Miracle Machine. Therefore, you're still wrong.
Originally posted by AllanklesActually, Metron uses his chair for most of that.
The evidence was taken from the fact that Metron's suit functioned like an MB, showing a certain degree of technopathy, having boomtube capabilities etc There has to be room for interpretation for arguments
Originally posted by AllanklesIt doesn't mean that the suit pattern itself is the motherbox. It just wasn't depicted at the time he utilized technopathy/teleportation. The same way when Superman opens a boomtube when he carries Kara home or travels to the Source Wall when carrying Darkseid. Since we've seen Metron actually hold his motherbox separate from his suit, there's evidence against his body suit pattern being his motherbox:
Yikes! Why do people feel the need to educate me on what I already know? Metron's suit has been shown to function a bit like an MB as well. Some degree of technopathy and teleportation across dimentions etc
Nothing has changed the analysis here. In fact, you helped point out something that goes against your argument, Mr. Miracle's body suit pattern resembles the top half of the Miracle Machine. And you know that his motherboxxx is woven into the shoulder of his suit if you read Seven Soldiers, and clearly Sonny Sumo holds it up to show it to Mr. Terrific:
Therefore, since (i) the avatar of the Life Equation, Mr. Miracle, has a bodysuit pattern that resembles the top half of the Miracle Machine, and (ii) that pattern definitely does not represent his motherboxxx, since it's woven into his shoulder and is detachable; then (iii) without any evidence that Metron's bodysuit pattern is actually his motherbox; we can easily conclude that: the Miracle Machine's design is not patterned after a motherbox.
And if you take it further and try to figure out what the design is patterned after, you consider that: (i) the Miracle Machine resembles the bodysuit pattern of the actual avatar of the Life Equation; and (ii) the Miracle Machine actively calculates the Life Equation; then you should reasonably conclude that: any pattern similar to the Miracle Machine's design represents the Life Equation.
Originally posted by quanchi112
You also claimed you never said it was a motherbox and I watched as odg posted you contradicting yourself time and time again.
If I said it was an mb my bad. It was a case of misinterpreation I said it functioned like cargo-cult motherbox i.e. it had limited functionality and even then could only do one thing (which is what the terminology suggests), nothing more, nothing less. Everything else is just the typical banter I'd have with odg.
Originally posted by AllanklesNo, you changed your story and were called on it. Posts don't lie.
If I said it was an mb my bad. It was a case of misinterpreation I said it functioned like cargo-cult motherbox i.e. it had limited functionality and even then could only do one thing (which is what the terminology suggests), nothing more, nothing less. Everything else is just the typical banter I'd have with odg.
^ No. Just. No:
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Again, it's speculation that the pattern Tatooed Man bore on his skin is motherbox circuitry. It appears that the symbol represents an aspect of the Life Equation as I argued on the previous page. Also, I have no idea what you're speaking of in terms of the pattern destroying force-fields or transporting Ray. I'll have to read it again, but IIRC, the Justifiers destroyed the force-field in the Hall of Justice in Final Crisis #4 and Ray's own power transports him around as a beam of light throughout Final Crisis.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ No. Just. No:
Reading a bit more, it is a circuitry that is what we know, the Life Equation is not a circuitry. We can clearly see the Tattooed Man with the suit being used either destroying the force field or trying to slow down the Justifiers from coming in. In 6 while talking to him she says "We need to get Ray back to Earth with that circuit of yours.." The symbol on his face is the Life Equation to protect against Anti-Life, on Metrons chest is his symbol of the MM. This seems to be the most correct possibility. 😮💨
Originally posted by kevdude1) Black Lightning and Tattooed Man called it a circuit. They never called it "circuitry." A circuit can mean a region enclosed by a line or a path/route, e.g. racecar circuit. It does not necessarily mean electrical circuitry, which is presumably the connotation you would like to imbue it with.
Reading a bit more, it is a circuitry that is what we know, the Life Equation is not a circuitry. We can clearly see the Tattooed Man with the suit being used either destroying the force field or trying to slow down the Justifiers from coming in. In 6 while talking to him she says "We need to get Ray back to Earth with that circuit of yours.." The symbol on his face is the Life Equation to protect against Anti-Life, on Metrons chest is his symbol of the MM. This seems to be the most correct possibility. 😮💨
If it's a circuit, as in a path/route accessing the Life Equation, then calling the Life Equation that would comfortably fit. Additionally, Mr. Miracle called it an alphabet from the language of the New Gods. Metron called it knowledge. Both of those terms denote the Life Equation much more comfortably. And a motherbox clearly does not. I'm going to take Mr. Miracle's and Metron's clearer terminologies over your strained speculative use.
The reason being, you simply cannot support that when they said "circuit," they meant "electrical circuitry" of a motherbox. As Allankles and I have now clarified, Mr. Miracle's bodysuit pattern definitely resembles the pattern (which is wholly separate from his motherbox) and he is the actual avatar of the Life Equation. It can't represent a motherbox.
2) As for Tatooed Man destroying the forcefield, I have no idea how you came up with this idea. Why would Tattooed Man destroy the force-field that was protecting the Hall of Justice? It never slowed down the Justifiers either, Ollie slowed them down. All the heroes were simply arguing that Tattooed Man had to leave because he held an important key to winning the war on his skin.
3) As for "We need to get Ray back to Earth with that circuit of yours," they are referring to their plan to have Ray go back to Earth while possessing the circuit so that he could draw it all over the place. Which he in fact does in Final Crisis #7. You must remember that Ray, under his own power, was transporting himself all over Earth delivering supplies and the Daily Planet newspaper. He also used his power to teleport all the heroes (bar Ollie) to the JLA Watchtower. He didn't need the circuit for any of that.
4) Mr Miracle has a bodysuit pattern that clearly resembles the top half of the Miracle Machine, but that patternry is definitely a representation of the Life Equation because, it bears repeating... he is the avatar of the Life Equation. And Mr Miracle was neither responsible for it's design, nor getting it to Superman. So we have at least one person that has a partial Miracle Machine design on him that has nothing to do with Miracle Machine directly. The Miracle Machine is based on the Life Equation, which is represented by the patterns. You want to have it the other way around, where the patterns are based on the Miracle Machine. That just wouldn't make sense with respect to Mr. Miracle. He's not the avatar of the Miracle Machine.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos has the soul and the mind gem. The ale also doesn't work on those "wired differently." It's been downgraded. At least Morrison did something right.
Originally posted by manx422
Yup it overrides free will which can not be done IG
The completed IG gives one absolute mastery over the soul backed with unlimited power. So no, an IG user would not lose his free will to anyone wielding the ALE.
