The General Discussion Thread

Empathy is "the ability to understand and share the feelings of another" whilst sympathy means "feelings of pity and sorrow for someone else's misfortune", but sympathy also means "understanding between people; common feeling" so that second form of sympathy is kind of a bridge between the first definition and empathy

In fact the dictionary even lists "empathy" as a synonym for that definition of sympathy haha

Originally posted by Scribble
I mean I understand it's hard as a man to understand that fear or even recognise that it exists, but that's where empathy and being friends with women comes into it. After having heard stories about the way they've been treated (and having witnessed it on quite a few occasions) I can't help but take their side in it because it is actually happening all the time.

I've seen it too, but it doesn't give you the right to go out and say we live in a rape culture.

I guess what we're talking about ultimately is compassion

Originally posted by Bashar Teg
you should check out "mongol", if you haven't already. very similar tales.

Watched it a few years back, enjoyed.

Also watched "Marco Polo" on Netflix, was decent enough for what it was.

Originally posted by Surtur
I've seen it too, but it doesn't give you the right to go out and say we live in a rape culture.

Yet when a woman is raped, it's not crazy unusual for people to do some sort of "that's awful, but what did she do?" be it questioning the clothes she was wearing, how she was acting, where she was walking. ie rape culture.

When the fact is, none of that matters, a woman should be allowed to walk down a dark alley wearing nothing but a string-bikini and not fear getting rape or molested.

Originally posted by Scribble
I guess what we're talking about ultimately is compassion

I never said don't be compassionate. I'm just saying don't say we live in a rape culture. Because we don't.

Originally posted by Robtard
Yet when a woman is raped, it's not crazy unusual for people to do some sort of "that's awful, but what did she do?" be it questioning the clothes she was wearing, how she was acting, where she was walking. ie rape culture.

When the fact is, none of that matters, a woman should be allowed to walk down a dark alley wearing nothing but a string-bikini and not fear getting rape or molested.

It's not crazy often they do the whole "what did she do" as well. Instances like you described need to be called out and fought against, it does not mean we live in a rape culture.

Originally posted by Surtur
I've seen it too, but it doesn't give you the right to go out and say we live in a rape culture.

I can see why people in our countries see the US or UK as a "rape culture" but that's only because they haven't seen what a true one is actually like. But nonetheless, we still have a long way to go with our cultures, and I'm not hesitant to refer to them as "sexual assault cultures" because it does happen a lot, and creepiness and aggressiveness is often brushed aside as "having a laff" or "boys will be boys", which is awful.

I don't think you should stop confronting people on their usage of the term, but I do think it'd be better if you took a more compassionate approach, one where you actually express your positive beliefs and not just your negative ones, that way people wouldn't keep mistaking you for a misogynist, because no offence but sometimes you do come across as misogynistic even if your main point is some thing else.

Originally posted by Robtard
But don't you dare say the words "rape culture", or else it upsets the dudebros.

Originally posted by Scribble
I understand what you mean, but more in the sense that I think calling American (or British) culture a "rape culture" kind of devalues how far we've come in terms of equality. Like I get what you mean also when you talk about middle eastern cultures being genuine "rape cultures" where rape not only regularly happens but isn't really even that frowned on, marital rape is just a man having sex with his wife, and women being stoned to death for being raped, etc. etc.

I can see why people in our countries see the US or UK as a "rape culture" but that's only because they haven't seen what a true one is actually like. But nonetheless, we still have a long way to go with our cultures, and I'm not hesitant to refer to them as "sexual assault cultures" because it does happen a lot, and creepiness and aggressiveness is often brushed aside as "having a laff" or "boys will be boys", which is awful.

I don't think you should stop confronting people on their usage of the term, but I do think it'd be better if you took a more compassionate approach, one where you actually express your positive beliefs and not just your negative ones, that way people wouldn't keep mistaking you for a misogynist, because no offence but sometimes you do come across as misogynistic even if your main point is some thing else.

Lol, it's hard to be compassionate with the hypocrisy. Maybe your country is different, but people here blew a gasket over 3rd world nations being called shitty.

Yet calling our own country a rape culture is okay to some, because feelings.

Originally posted by Scribble

I can see why people in our countries see the US or UK as a "rape culture" but that's only because they haven't seen what a true one is actually like.

On this point, while true, the US and UK aren't nearly bad as say Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan, but being far less of a rape culture doesn't negate its existence in of itself

edit: Though I will say your use of "sexual assault cultures" is pretty good and it would likely not trigger as many dudebros into heaving fits of denial. Though really, we shouldn't be afraid to call things what they factually are because some people flip out. So imo, f88k those dudebros and their feelings.

But it's not just that we aren't as bad as Saudi Arabia, it's also that we actually aren't a rape culture.

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol, it's hard to be compassionate with the hypocrisy. Maybe your country is different, but people here blew a gasket over 3rd world nations being called shitty.

Yet calling our own country a rape culture is okay to some, because feelings.

But I get your point in terms of the context; double standards, etc.

Originally posted by Scribble
Well yeah, there's no need to call entire countries, ones with deep cultural heritage and histories, "shitholes". It's just plain uncalled for. Like sure, if I went to one of my mate's houses and it was a tip I'd probably call it a shithole to them, but because they'd know I was saying it both jokingly and with genuine concern. The countries have issues, some of them have many issues (and many in the question have issues directly because of past US foreign policy), but that doesn't give any world leader the right to dismiss an entire country and their people in that way. It's childish, unprofessional, not helpful to the situation, and doesn't serve any other purpose than to insult. Personally I don't see the point in saying it.

But I get your point in terms of the context; double standards, etc.

I understand, and let us say you and a good friend came upon a strangers home one day, they invite you in. The house is a shithole. Your host leaves you and your friend alone for a second and goes into the kitchen. Your friend says to you the place is a shithole.

When the host comes back, do you inform them of your friends comment?

Originally posted by Robtard
On this point, while true, the US and UK aren't nearly bad as say Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan, but being far less of a rape culture doesn't negate its existence in of itself

edit: Though I will say your use of "sexual assault cultures" is pretty good and it would likely not trigger as many dudebros into heaving fits of denial. Though really, we shouldn't be afraid to call things what they factually are because some people flip out. So imo, f88k those dudebros and their feelings.

But again, that doesn't mean we're off the hook, assault and harassment are still rife and rape is still obviously an issue, it's not like it's gone away and the way that we handle the problem is often far below the standard it should be. But due to it not being truly endemic, I would hesitate to define the entire culture by it.

Originally posted by Surtur
But it's not just that we aren't as bad as Saudi Arabia, it's also that we actually aren't a rape culture.

The US literally elected a man who has a long history of being accused of sexual predatory tactics from repeated unwanted comments all the way to rape and then was caught unknowingly bragging about it, we heard it in his own words. Why, because it was brushed off as "locker room talk" ie 'boys will be boys'. But sure, you go with your feelings, Surt.

Originally posted by Robtard
The US literally elected a man who has a long history of being accused of sexual misconduct from repeated unwanted comments all the way to rape and then was caught unknowingly bragging about it, we heard it in his own words. Why, because it was brushed off as "locker room talk" ie 'boys will be boys'. But sure, you go with your feelings, Surt.

The US is a nation of innocent until proven guilty. It doesn't mean we're a rape culture. But you cling to that notion.

Originally posted by Scribble
I just wouldn't describe the UK or the US rape cultures, personally. Rape isn't institutionalised and the vast populace condemns it, and we are trying our best as a people to overcome it, as opposed to a country where rape is legal. Hell, those countries are founded on a religious doctrine that encourages and excuses rape. At least all the rape in the Bible is portrayed as bad.

But again, that doesn't mean we're off the hook, assault and harassment are still rife and rape is still obviously an issue, it's not like it's gone away and the way that we handle the problem is often far below the standard it should be. But due to it not being truly endemic, I would hesitate to define the entire culture by it.

It is exactly because you aren't "off the hook" so to speak that I find it wrong to call it a rape culture. There are still genuine issues that need solving, and this kind of thing just does not help.

Originally posted by Surtur
The US is a nation of innocent until proven guilty. It doesn't mean we're a rape culture. But you cling to that notion.

We heard it in his own words, backing up the decades of accusations and it was dismissed as 'boys bantering'. That happened.