Thor vs Thanos

Originally posted by iceman24567
Much like you proved Thanos is powerful enough to destroy the destroyer hypocrite 😘

Originally posted by Silent Master
Just like you have only ever seen Odin and Thanos fight once, so if one fight is enough to say that Thanos is Odin's peer, the same should hold true for Jeff.

Considering the nature of his comment, everything.

You are trying to justify what happened in this comic by pointing to other comics. Doesn't work that way.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I think with the power he has displayed he could do so. I can't see the destroyer putting down Thanos especially if he erects shields.

Originally posted by iceman24567
So your just speculating and not proving anything? Weren't you just saying i do such things? 👇

Originally posted by quanchi112
I think with the power he has displayed he could do so. I can't see the destroyer putting down Thanos especially if he erects shields. I said they were peers with the exception of jeff losing.

You said they were peers for that match, which throws doubt on whether they are normally peers, you made no such comments when you said Thanos was Odin's peer.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are trying to justify what happened in this comic by pointing to other comics. Doesn't work that way.

When the comment includes his past fights, yes it does.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You said they were peers for that match, which throws doubt on whether they are normally peers, you made no such comments when you said Thanos was Odin's peer.

When the comment includes his past fights, yes it does.

Both examples are peers.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You asked about that particular match. I have explained this to you. I don't know their history together.

No, I used that match as an example(kind of like you use the Odin vs Thanos match as an example) and then I asked if they were peers.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Both examples are peers.

You have an odd definition of "peers".

Originally posted by Silent Master
No, I used that match as an example(kind of like you use the Odin vs Thanos match as an example) and then I asked if they were peers.

You have an odd definition of "peers".

Originally posted by quanchi112
I answered you. Claiming they aren't peers is ludicrous.

That is all I needed to know, thanks.

Originally posted by Silent Master
That is all I needed to know, thanks.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
You're stretching the limits of sensibility by taking the absolute extreme interpretation of his statement which is a salutation of his worthy tenacity, not an acknowledgement of his power. Thanos didn't even prove his power in his fight against Odin because Odin was holding back. How could Thanos possibly be the strongest foe Odin's fought when the Celestials, Seth, the Enchanters, Surtur, Infinity and others outclass Thanos by miles? Oh, now I remember. Because both you and quanchi112 value the plain presentation of the facts and circumstances of the comics far less than any pointless opportunity, no matter how outlandish, to highball Thanos.

Odin's salutation is almost directly analogous to when Namor salutes Daredevil after their first fight in Dardevil #7, where he states that he holds DD in higher regard then the Fantastic Four or Avengers because he wouldn't give up despite being outclassed. Thanos and DD both got romped by opponents who held back their full might. Both were worthy of salutation. But both were nowhere near the peers of their opponents. It's as plain as day. Nuff said.

You see the problem is you trying to pass off your own speculation as fact and then claiming we're doing the same thing while your not. Didn't you say the lack of collateral damage in a fight scene doesn't prove or disprove the amount of power used in a fight? I believe that is basically what you said and something I agree with. Now, doesn't that same logic apply to many things... Some writers might not show Odin needing the Odin sleep after a fight but that isn't a for sure indicator of how much power he did or didn't use. You can't argue with that point as that could very well be the case. I would say however, that in this instance I happen to agree with you that Odin wasn't going all out. I believe he was certainly trying and using more power then what your saying, but going all out I wouldn't say so. By the same token Thanos clearly wasn't going all out either. The point is you can't pass of your speculation as fact and must admit that writers do write things differently at times. Juggs invulnerability tied to his shield while others didn't is a great example. Again, though I do agree with your stance just think your not applying your own logic to your own stance.

This appears yet again when your trying to say Odin was saluting Thanos Tenacity but not his worthiness as an adversary or peer. Let me say this... At that time I don't think Odin was a peer per se. I think he was in the ballpark but was certainly portrayed as being weaker and I think that showed through. However, your interpretation of what odin meant is even more speculation on your part then what I discussed in the previous paragraph. In the instance Odin's words and my interpretation is more logical then yours. When someone says... I haven't fought a foe like you in eons pretty much is indicative of how strong how worthy and adversary they were. You can claim well Odin has fought him and them and this and that and thus he couldn't mean what he said. Sorry one but it's all there on panel and clearly this particular writer was trying to give the impression that Thanos was better then anybody Odin had fought in Eons. Your whole tenacity thing is no where to be found and is pure speculation on your part. However, going by what was on panel and clearly laid out by the writer it's pretty clear and more logical he was saying exactly how I viewed that statement. So, while you can claim I am using speculation and stretching things... I just pointed out how your doing that exact same thing in your arguments.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You see the problem is you trying to pass off your own speculation as fact and then claiming we're doing the same thing while your not. Didn't you say the lack of collateral damage in a fight scene doesn't prove or disprove the amount of power used in a fight? I believe that is basically what you said and something I agree with. Now, doesn't that same logic apply to many things... Some writers might not show Odin needing the Odin sleep after a fight but that isn't a for sure indicator of how much power he did or didn't use. You can't argue with that point as that could very well be the case. I would say however, that in this instance I happen to agree with you that Odin wasn't going all out. I believe he was certainly trying and using more power then what your saying, but going all out I wouldn't say so. By the same token Thanos clearly wasn't going all out either. The point is you can't pass of your speculation as fact and must admit that writers do write things differently at times. Juggs invulnerability tied to his shield while others didn't is a great example. Again, though I do agree with your stance just think your not applying your own logic to your own stance.

You have to ignore what happened in the fight, ignore all the fights Odin has in his career and wildly interpret a single statement in isolation to the furthest extreme possible to support your position. I read their fight and accepted the plain presentation of the entire duration and outcome of the fight, while recognizing that Odin's past dramatic battles were starkly distinct from his nonchalant attitude here and freely interpreted his statement in tandem with all of this. Slight difference, slick.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
This appears yet again when your trying to say Odin was saluting Thanos Tenacity but not his worthiness as an adversary or peer. Let me say this... At that time I don't think Odin was a peer per seu. I think he was in the ballpark but was certainly portrayed as being weaker and I think that showed through.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
However, your interpretation of what odin meant is even more speculation on your part then what I discussed in the previous paragraph. In the instance Odin's words and my interpretation is more logical then yours. When someone says... I haven't fought a foe like you in eons pretty much is indicative of how strong how worthy and adversary they were. You can claim well Odin has fought him and them and this and that and thus he couldn't mean what he said. Sorry one but it's all there on panel and clearly this particular writer was trying to give the impression that Thanos was better then anybody Odin had fought in Eons. Your whole tenacity thing is no where to be found and is pure speculation on your part. However, going by what was on panel and clearly laid out by the writer it's pretty clear and more logical he was saying exactly how I viewed that statement. So, while you can claim I am using speculation and stretching things... I just pointed out how your doing that exact same thing in your arguments.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Only, I have already told you why Thanos was not Odin's peer because Odin was holding back his power and Thanos didn't harm him at all while Thanos was shakily standing up after having his face planted in rubble. The simplicity of this fact does not diminish the truth it underlines: Odin, while holding back, wrecked Thanos. Whereas you would wish to take one statement in isolation, whilst ignoring that simple on-panel outcome, whilst ignoring all the feats and fights that Odin has and blow his salutation out of all proportions.

You have to ignore what happened in the fight, ignore all the fights Odin has in his career and wildly interpret a single statement in isolation to the furthest extreme possible to support your position. I read their fight and accepted the plain presentation of the entire duration and outcome of the fight, while recognizing that Odin's past dramatic battles were starkly distinct from his nonchalant attitude here and freely interpreted his statement in tandem with all of this. Slight difference, slick.Odin was in the ballpark? Weaker? 🤨Except by applying my logic to me and then on you, I'm completely right and you're absolutely wrong.

You can say your logic makes more sense but that doesn't make it so. I pointed out exactly how you were using speculation and there was no proof of what you were saying. You tried to apply things to my arguments also apply to yours and I pointed out and you can't dispute. Now the real reason I wanted to wrtie this is because of your middle paragraph you quoted. What I was saying is that I don't think Thanos was a peer of Odin at that time. Since then he's been upgraded and I believe is now or certainly pretty close. However, back then I believe it was certainly the writers intentions to portray Odin as a notch above Thanos.

^ What speculation am I offering? That Odin was holding back? I bolstered this by showing several epic fights where Odin uses his full power. And you already concede that Odin was not using his full power when fighting Thanos anyway.

What other speculation am I offering? That Odin wasn't hurt at all? You only have to look at the fight and events immediately thereafter to see that Odin was never depicted as being visibly hurt, damaged, or exhausted.

What other speculation am I offering? That Thanos had his face buried in rubble and that he shakily stood up while Odin was busy pontificating? You only have to look at the conclusion of the fight to see how accurate that description is.

What do these non-speculative, but conclusive and plain facts obviously suggest? That Odin, while holding back his power, was not hurt or taken to task by Thanos at all, whereas Thanos got faceplanted and shakily stood up. How can you use this to suggest that when Odin saluted Thanos as a foe, he meant to suggest that Thanos was his peer? That's a blatant twisting of words to contradict what Odin and Thanos both experienced at that time. My interpretation that Odin was saluting his tenacity and determination and not his power is not contradicted by the plain facts of the fight.

Therefore, I am not using speculation to support my arguments, I'm using the facts. You're projecting. Any suggestion that Thanos became upgraded after the fact does not change the inquiry, "What did Odin mean at the time?" Odin did not mean Thanos was his peer. Therefore, you cannot twist such a statement to bolster your theory that an upgraded Thanos might rise to Odin's equal by suggesting that they were close in might when they first fought.

They weren't close. Because Odin held back, and was not visibly hurt or strained, whereas Thanos got faceplanted and shakily stood up. Odin never said they were close. Relying on unquantified and ambiguous upgrades now and suggesting that these upgrades could somehow match the erroneously concluded "close power differential" is baseless speculation.

I love how you go on this whole tangent and talk about stuff I never said just to try and sound smart anc cute. I'll illustrate this points one by one and then maybe you'll get it. I'm sure though you'll still talk about stuff I never said.

1. You commenting that Odin was clearly not going all out, giving it his all or even fighting an epic war based on the art depicted, based on odin not needing sleep. So, then in each one of the scans you posted did Odin need the Odin sleep after these epic battles? The answer is no. Therefore, it's speculation that because Odin didn't need his sleep after his battle with Thanos thus he wasn't going all out. Although even in your own scans that also ocurred.

Furthermore, it's also speculation in regards to the art depicted because many times art and battles are protrayed much different. So, collateral damage or lack there of isn't proof of anything correct? Thus trying to compare battles from different writers can always be used in determing power levels right? While your making a logic assumption it's still an assumption and speculation none the less correct? Are you getting this now... I don't even entirely disagree with some of the assumption and speculation your using but don't call it something that it's not.

2. Your speculating on what Odin meant by his statement and of that there can be no dispute. No where does it mentioned Odin praising his tenacity or determination not one panel or words says such a thing. So, that is by far your biggest speculation. In other instances your logical assumptions are probably true ( i feel odin wasn't going all out) however in this guy mine is more the logical assumption. He say's he going to kill thanos, asgard is being invaded, his son is trapped, he says Thanos draws from a source almost as great as mine, the very famous quote which were talking about saying he hasn't fought a foe like him in eons. All his other statement and then that statement make mine the more logical assumption because NO where and I repeat NO WHERE does it say his tenacity or determination. That is pure speculation on your part on what he meant and clearly going by the other things he said and that statement he clearly thought thanos was a worthy foe and BETTER then anybody he fought in eons. You may not like it and have reason why it's not true but sorry it was said on panel and other statements support that statement.

Now hopefully I laid out exactly what your speculation and assumptions are and there is no doubt that they are exactly that. Now some might be logical and reasonable to you but don't try and pass it off as fact is my only point.

Let's make this simple.

Taking into account all of Odin's fights, which is the more likely

1) Odin was going all out in the Thanos fight, IE he was his full power
2) Odin wasn't going all out in the Thanos fight, IE he wasn't using his full power

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
1. You commenting that Odin was clearly not going all out, giving it his all or even fighting an epic war based on the art depicted, based on odin not needing sleep. So, then in each one of the scans you posted did Odin need the Odin sleep after these epic battles? The answer is no.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Furthermore, it's also speculation in regards to the art depicted because many times art and battles are protrayed much different. So, collateral damage or lack there of isn't proof of anything correct? Thus trying to compare battles from different writers can always be used in determing power levels right? While your making a logic assumption it's still an assumption and speculation none the less correct?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
2. Your speculating on what Odin meant by his statement and of that there can be no dispute. No where does it mentioned Odin praising his tenacity or determination not one panel or words says such a thing. So, that is by far your biggest speculation. In other instances your logical assumptions are probably true ( i feel odin wasn't going all out) however in this guy mine is more the logical assumption.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Now hopefully I laid out exactly what your speculation and assumptions are and there is no doubt that they are exactly that. Now some might be logical and reasonable to you but don't try and pass it off as fact is my only point.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Actually, the answer is yes for some of the fights . Also, in the fights against Surtur, Odin actually died. And in the fight against Doom, Odin lost and Reed uses the Cosmic Cube to undo all the events. Try reading the comics.
You asked for proof that Odin was going all out, in those examples, Odin is either desperate, states he is using all his power, goes into Odinsleep after, or outright dies after an epic battle. Such results suggest that he exerts himself mightily. If you can't understand that, that's your problem. Don't project.This is the only pertinent part of your long-winded paragraph. You keep ignoring the fact that it's the results that should help you interpret Odin's statement. And the only thing that makes sense for Odin to praise, when Odin is holding back, was never hurt or exerted himself,whereas he thought Thanos defeated and smoking on the ground, is Thanos' tenacity and determination. He could not possibly be praising Thanos' power as beyond those of his past opponents because we know for a fact, that his past opponents were far more powerful than Thanos, much as you don't want to admit. Fact.You're simply projecting your own speculative logic onto my arguments. My interpretation and arguments are not fact, they're just exceedingly more supported than yours.

I underlined the key part of your post. He didn't need the Odin sleep after each one of those fights. Nothing I said was incorrect and you actually proved my point. Lack of Odin sleep or not isn't proof of how much Odin exerted himself or not. Neither is the art depicted or collateral damage proof of powers used. You agree with it and thus while it's logical to assume (I agree) that he wasn't going all out doesn't make it fact. I believe he was certainly trying to kill Thanos and using a good amount of power to try. Your ignoring the context of the fight as well.... Was his son not trapped..... was asgard not being invaded... did he not say thanos was drawing from a power source almost equal to his own.... pulling out gungir? All that sides with my view that he was trying to put thanos down with a good amount of force. All out probably not but certainly trying. You act like he wasn't trying and joking around. So, actually now that I think about it the story and Odin words side with my version as opposed to yours. The fact is, all that I said you were speculation about,you were and admitted such. Some stuff it was a logical assumption and others were well... left a lot to be desired.

edit

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I underlined the key part of your post. He didn't need the Odin sleep after each one of those fights. Nothing I said was incorrect and you actually proved my point. Lack of Odin sleep or not isn't proof of how much Odin exerted himself or not.

facepalm

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
It is proof when Odin isn't dead or all the damage is reversed by Reed with a Cosmic Cube.

facepalm

So, then are you saying that lack of Odin sleep in any one of this fights means he wasn't exerting himself? Is that your new statement? 🙄 I hope not because you no that is not definitive proof like collateral damage or lack there of

Also, what does... him saying he draws from a source equal to his own, calling him a villian, his son trapped, asgard being invaded, saying he hasn't fought somebody like him in eons, and pulling out gungir, and saying he was going to kill thanos all point to? It all points to my side being the more reasonable and logical which is that he was trying to put thanos down and using a good amount of force to do so. that is why more logical when looking at the comics then your.... he was taking it easy and not really trying or caring.