Frank is a bit of a gun nut so I'm going to assume he has some Browning M2's in his warehouse, the have a maximum effective range of 1.8 kilometers max range of 7.4Km (according to wiki) and can perforate 1.34 in (34 mm) of HHA (high hard armor, or face-hardened steel plate) at 500 meters, 0.91 in (23 mm) at 1,200 meters, and 0.75 in (19 mm) at 1,500 meters (once again from wiki). Rate of fire 450-575 rounds/min (sustained rate of anything under 400per min).
From what I can gather these specs are for the ground mounted/tripod version of this weapon.
I don't think the orc/uruk-whatevers will get anywhere near Helm's deep, none of their weapons could fire are that range.
Also combine this with the pre-setup mine's, a few others with sniper rifles and other guns, and 150 ninja's to take out anyone that might happen to get through I think this is an easy win for the crew.
Originally posted by mrcharlieo
Frank is a bit of a gun nut so I'm going to assume he has some Browning M2's in his warehouse, the have a maximum effective range of 1.8 kilometers max range of 7.4Km (according to wiki) and can perforate 1.34 in (34 mm) of HHA (high hard armor, or face-hardened steel plate) at 500 meters, 0.91 in (23 mm) at 1,200 meters, and 0.75 in (19 mm) at 1,500 meters (once again from wiki). Rate of fire 450-575 rounds/min (sustained rate of anything under 400per min).
From what I can gather these specs are for the ground mounted/tripod version of this weapon.
I don't think the orc/uruk-whatevers will get anywhere near Helm's deep, none of their weapons could fire are that range.
Also combine this with the pre-setup mine's, a few others with sniper rifles and other guns, and 150 ninja's to take out anyone that might happen to get through I think this is an easy win for the crew.
Originally posted by mrcharlieo
they wouldn't get close enough in large enough numbers to fire a volley, how far to you think an arrow can go?
however, I still think they will get there. Keep in mind, it's night, so it's harder to aim. Uruks are fast!!! They have shield, armor and can use meat shield.
Also, they would need large numbers. Just a hundred, or less. Once you take down about 50 of the ninja's(wouldn't take much effort imo), it will take even less effort to scale the wall, or get archer up there.
the uruks all stood shoulder to shoulder all clumped into one giant group, not a lot of need to aim accurately to begin with, once the numbers have thined out then they can start aiming.
As for the Ballista's, they realistically would have a range of something like 400-600m, we can be generous and say 1km, by the time they get to that range the ballista's would likely have been ripped apart by the M2's.
Originally posted by mrcharlieo
the uruks all stood shoulder to shoulder all clumped into one giant group, not a lot of need to aim accurately to begin with, once the numbers have thined out then they can start aiming.
As for the Ballista's, they realistically would have a range of something like 400-600m, we can be generous and say 1km, by the time they get to that range the ballista's would likely have been ripped apart by the M2's.
The army was lined up for a reason. I am not sure, but that specific formation is used to help stop range attacks. For example; the guy in the front(first line) will get hit the most, however, the guy behind him won't get hit because there is a body blocking him. It's hard to explain it, but those formations help when facing fire.
The .50 cal rounds would rip right through the uruk likely taking body parts with them and into the guys behind them. the formation they used would help with arrows and small caliber rounds but against a .50 cal round from a M2 the formation is actually going to get them killed a lot faster and with less rounds needed.
Originally posted by mrcharlieo
The .50 cal rounds would rip right through the uruk likely taking body parts with them and into the guys behind them. the formation they used would help with arrows and small caliber rounds but against a .50 cal round from a M2 the formation is actually going to get them killed a lot faster and with less rounds needed.
Re: My Crew vs Orcs in LOTR
Yeah, Browning M2s are also anti-aircraft-grade heavy weapons that can be used for anti-armor or anti-infantry weapons. I'm also confident that the heavier versions of these weapons can easily rip through armor, meat, bone for quite a distance before running out of energy. A pair positioned properly can rip thru hundreds of orcs like a knife thru butter (ammo willing, these things eat ammo like no1's business).
But why do people keep bringing up these heavy weapons??? Helloooo!
Originally posted by Phantom Zone
3 One of Punishers warehouses. Use your imagination but nothing more powerful than a rocket launcher is allowed no armoured vehicles either.
I'd say an AA (oftentimes) vehicle-mounted weapon qualifies as heavier than a rocket launcher.
We REALLY need to establish what "nothing more powerful than a rocket launcher" means.
It's not going to rip through the entire army but it would have enough power to go through a few uruks at a time. The closer they get to the keep the more uruks it will go through.
I think give the punisher the M2 to mow down the ranks of the uruk.
Bullseye can have a .50 cal sniper rifle to take out the balista's and some random other guns to take out som uruks.
Hawkeye can have his fancy bow and arrows to take out guys that get close.
Deadshot can have an M240 on a tripod to take out anthing within 1.1km (fires 650-950 rounds/min) and some randow other guns.
Solo can have the same as Deadshot and maybe the rocket launcher.
All have grenades incase uruks get close (which I don't see happening) and handguns.
Originally posted by mrcharlieo
I meant the M2 shown in the pic
I still think those should be categorized as "more powerful" than a rocket launcher.
We'd have to assume that they will have limited ammo, tho. Also, Uruk's (or at least their leaders) aren't really stupid, they'd prolly spread out accross a wider area once they see the first wave getting mowed down while bunched up.
Originally posted by Obadiah Horn👆
OK when I worked as an Ammo Troop you could put almost 10,000 20mm rounds on a single pallete. Now each Ammo box only holds 250 20mm rounds but it can hold around 3000 7.62 rounds (M16) To think that the Punishers Where house cant hold enough Ammo for only 10,000 Urakai(sic) is ridiculous I mean 1 pallet can hold almost 100,000 rounds of M16 ammo and another can hold 8,000 20mms which each could rip an Orc in half.Not to mention High explosives and RPGs hell claymore mines could easily take out more than 20 orcs a pop, this is no contest.You dont even need the crew for the masses.Equip about 110 Hand and let the other 40 just work as load toads. 50 Hand ninjas with M16s can let off more than 1000 rounds in 30 seconds alot more in both number and killing power than any volley by the elves.Then put 30 with High powered Machine Guns and 20 with RPGs, Rocket Launchers and any other exotic weaponry the Punisher has and the Orc ranks start to take Heavy losses in a hurry.Hell you even have 10 left over to act as support in case any get killed by bowfire.
Punisher and Hawkey can just sit back with rocket launchers and take out seige weapons. While Solo ports to each Seige Ladder and takes them out with a grenade a piece. Bullseye can easily take out all the Orc Comanders.Deadshot will pick off Nay Beserkers coming at the Sewer entrance.
Given the open area and the massed formations of the Orcs I say the crew wins in less than 2 hours.
Obadiah Horn's post made a lot of sence to me but didn't seem to get much attention so I though I'd try an alternative attack with the M2's.
I agree also that the M2's could arguably be considered more powerful than a rocket launcher but it would be debatable. However I'll take back the M2's and have all equiped with M240's, or other long range machine guns, they may not take out as many uruk as quickly as the M2's but I think they'd still get the job done.
The Uruk lose due to the range and power advantage of the weapons the crew can have access to.