The Unstoppable Juggernaut vs. The Flash

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor didn't use physical force. Hulk on the other hand was amped, and stopped him using his amped physical strength.

Thor used magic, Hulk used Celestial technology

Flash stealing his speed isn't an extreme method?

You mean when compared to a Godforce blast and Celestial technology? You tell me.

Of course he cannot duplicate those methods, but as we have seen Juggernaut is not unstoppable. He can be stopped. So saying Flash couldn't steal his speed simply because Juggernaut is not unstoppable isn't a solid argument.

It's a very valid argument since you're suggesting Flash can stop the unstoppable using a method that doesn't come close to the 2 times Juggernauts been stopped before.

Neither are Flash's abilities. They are part of his power set just like Juggernaut's powers. Just because you don't like them don't make them ridiculous. I don't like his Force Field, but I still accept it.

Tell me how many times Flash has dumped a character into the Speed force or sent them into Entropy?

Originally posted by carver9
He was stuck there because he wanted to be stuck there. The question was, how did he get back to earth?

He was trapped there. That's why he still wanted to get back to Earth, but couldn't, so he made due by taking over that place.

I don't recall. Do you?

Flash 10/10

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Thor used magic, Hulk used Celestial technology

Thor in a weakened state used his God Blast. Hulk was amped physically by Celestial technology that was available to Apocalypse. Hulk stopped him physically with his amp as I recall.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You mean when compared to a Godforce blast and Celestial technology? You tell me.

Thor was extremely weakened, and the God Blast depends on how much of his own Godly energy he uses. Hulk was amped by the Celestial technology available to Apocalypse.

Speed stealing is an extreme method even when compared to the two. Flash is powered by the Speed Force, an extremely powerful extra dimensional power source.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
It's a very valid argument since you're suggesting Flash can stop the unstoppable using a method that doesn't come close to the 2 times Juggernauts been stopped before.

Dude, of course the method is not close to the two times he was stopped. Even those two methods, are not close to each other at all. They were performed by two completely different characters, using two completely different methods. My point is, he is not unstoppable as shown, so basing you're argument that he cannot steal speed because Juggernaut is supposedly unstoppable (Although as shown he isn't.) is faulty.

Flash could steal his speed. No he can't because Juggernaut is unstoppable. That's you're argument right there. It's faulty for different reasons. First and foremost being that Juggernaut isn't actually unstoppable. The second being, that just because he has an enchantment placed, that means it's very difficult to stop his movement, it doesn't mean squat in relation to Flash using the Speed Force, to steal Juggernaut's powers.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Tell me how many times Flash has dumped a character into the Speed force or sent them into Entropy?

Into the Speed Force? His done it before.

Entropy? Never.

He can do it. He just doesn't choose to. Hence why I said it's "out" of character.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
He was trapped there. That's why he still wanted to get back to Earth, but couldn't, so he made due by taking over that place.

I don't recall. Do you?

Cytorrak teleported him back.

Originally posted by carver9
Cytorrak teleported him back.

I thought so.

Anyways you're point is?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I thought so.

Anyways you're point is?

So you really dont get the moral of the story. Your entire argument has been based on flash transporting Juggernaut someone, basically bfring him.

How is flash going to bfr someone that cant be bfred? 😕

Originally posted by carver9
So you really dont get the moral of the story. Your entire argument has been based on flash transporting Juggernaut someone, basically bfring him.

How is flash going to bfr someone that cant be bfred? 😕

Juggernaut can be defeated through battle field removal. Thor defeated Cain through battle field removal, and he was stuck there for how long?

So you're argument is, that Cytorrak will teleport him back?

This is "The Unstoppable Juggernaut vs. The Flash". Not the "The Unstoppable Juggernaut with assistance from Cytorrak vs. The Flash".

Juggernaut has never shown to teleport under his own power. He needed Cytorrak according to you. Cytorrak isn't here.

Juggernaut in both

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Juggernaut can be defeated through battle field removal. Thor defeated Cain through battle field removal, and he was stuck there for how long?

So you're argument is, that Cytorrak will teleport him back?

This is "The Unstoppable Juggernaut vs. The Flash". Not the "The Unstoppable Juggernaut with assistance from Cytorrak vs. The Flash".

Juggernaut has never shown to teleport under his own power. He needed Cytorrak according to you. Cytorrak isn't here.

😘

That doesnt make sense, cytorrak is the juggernaut, they are one (juggernaut doesnt have the full extent of cytorraks power though). Every amp that jugs get while fighting is from cytorrak, the power is there when needed.

Taking away cytorrak assistance is like taking away the speed force from wally. Cytorrak and Cain are one and him teleporting is something that Cytorrak could grant him during a battle against the flash (even though i dont think the flash could bfr him anyway). 🙁

Originally posted by Uxas Khan
Juggernaut in both

YouTube video

Originally posted by carver9
😘

That doesnt make sense, cytorrak is the juggernaut, they are one (juggernaut doesnt have the full extent of cytorraks power though). Every amp that jugs get while fighting is from cytorrak, the power is there when needed.

Taking away cytorrak assistance is like taking away the speed force from wally. Cytorrak and Cain are one and him teleporting is something that Cytorrak could grant him during a battle against the flash (even though i dont think the flash could bfr him anyway). 🙁

facepalm

They are not one. Juggernaut is simply an avatar of Cytorrak with a fraction of his power. You cannot contribute a power showed by Cytorrak to Cain. That's completely faulty analogy. Taking away Cytorrak's assistance from Cain is not like taking away the Speed Force from the Flash. Now taking away the power Cytorrak granted to the Juggernaut would be like removing the Speed Force from Wally.

They are not one and contributing, what Cytorrak did as something Cain did is completely illogical.

Saying, that Juggernaut cannot be battle field removed, because in one instance, Cytorrak intervened and teleported him, is just....wrong.

Why the hell couldn't the Flash battle field remove the Juggernaut? I thought I already addressed this.....

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
YouTube video

Originally posted by Uxas Khan
your arguments fail on every lvl and have been proven to be lacking enough evidence to support them.

Clearly, as I was obviously trying my hardest to dispute you're points....

🙄

I'm out. It's morning and I'm not in bed yet. Later, KMC.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Clearly, as I was obviously trying my hardest to dispute you're points....

🙄

I'm out. It's morning and I'm not in bed yet. Later, KMC.

Flash on average.

Ok then I want to clear some things up.

Firstly Thor during his fight, his "sickness" was an on again off again type scenario.

And when he blasted Cain with the Godforce he seemed healthy at the time. The fact is even when Thor was healthy in their other encounters he still had to resort to exotic powers to net a win or a semblance of a win through BFR.

Next the Godforce blast is still way mystical in nature, hence why it had an effect at all on Cain.

As to War Hulk. It was the Celestail Technology itself, and not Hulk's strength at the time that allowed him to stop Cain.

If you need any real evidence of this then simply refer to the recent World War Hulk encounter between the two. In that series it was clearly stated numerous times that this version of Hulk was the strongest he had been ever.

Whether you believe that statement or not, the point remains that this was intended to be a pretty powerful, physically dominating version of the Hulk.

And the best this version was able to do was redirect Cain's momentum so that he he wasn't getting teh brunt of it. He himself admitted he wouldn't be able to stop Juggernaut and had to resort to using that own ability against him having him remove himself from the field of play.

So it was the tech not the person inside of it that was able to do anything to Cain.

Next in no way has Cain ever demonstrated the ability to dimension hop on his own. While I personally feel that it well within his power to do so. There are a number of examples showing this. The fact remains Cain hasn't quite used his powers like that.

So a good BFR would work on him.

As to the match. That is the only way the Flash can win, via BFR. Without this is in definite stalemate or until Flash runs out of juice.

Or they combine to become the Flashernaut.

Originally posted by Uxas Khan
I don't have to make any ponts plenty of other posters have made better points than you have, thanks for conceding

Yea, I've obviously have had my ass handed to me here, and haven't been able to make any points, and address any points made. I've obviously conceded.......

😆

Originally posted by Newjak
Ok then I want to clear some things up.

Firstly Thor during his fight, his "sickness" was an on again off again type scenario.

And when he blasted Cain with the Godforce he seemed healthy at the time. The fact is even when Thor was healthy in their other encounters he still had to resort to exotic powers to net a win or a semblance of a win through BFR.

Next the Godforce blast is still way mystical in nature, hence why it had an effect at all on Cain.

When he fought the Juggernaut, it just got worse and worse, to the point he was weak throughout 95% of the fight.

When he started to fight the Juggernaut, he had a wave of weakness hit him, and from that point on, it kept growing worse, and worse, and seemed like a constant thing. He first got weak, when he stopped that flying bus, and he could barely stand. From there it got worse, and Juggernaut smacked him around, and knocked him out easily. It was so bad Thor was down for like 5 pages of the second issue; he couldn't even get up himself, and couldn't walk without support. After getting assistance, as he wasn't able to stand up straight alone as I recall, he then hit Juggernaut with the lighting and then with the God Blast. He even says, right before he attacks Cain, that he was in a weakened state. After he did the God Blast, you can even see Thor using his left arm to support his right arm, in holding Mjolnir as I recall; probably couldn't even lift it straight.

So from what I recall, from the point where he stopped the bus, he was weakened throughout the rest of the fight, and it just got worse.

if you guys aren't going to use the search function, then threads'll just be closed from now on...

merging...