Originally posted by leonidas
agreed.
Even allowing for the 'Hulk getting angrier' clause, he's not putting down Thanos. WWH level wouldn't even be enough.
Originally posted by Enyalus
😬 Don't agree to that. Under his own personal power he was shown fighting equally (which, I assume would also include strength) with a Power Gem amped Thor. And landed some solid blows capable of knocking around Champion with the Power Gem, too. He's overpowered Thing and Professor Hulk simultaneously, and Thing and Classic Thor simultaneously, too.Even allowing for the 'Hulk getting angrier' clause, he's not putting down Thanos. WWH level wouldn't even be enough.
QFT
Originally posted by Enyalus
😬 Don't agree to that. Under his own personal power he was shown fighting equally (which, I assume would also include strength) with a Power Gem amped Thor. And landed some solid blows capable of knocking around Champion with the Power Gem, too. He's overpowered Thing and Professor Hulk simultaneously, and Thing and Classic Thor simultaneously, too.Even allowing for the 'Hulk getting angrier' clause, he's not putting down Thanos. WWH level wouldn't even be enough.
meh. no reason savage can't match mindless hulk and he battled immortal herc, wonderman, namor and ironman all at once. thing and thor also ultimately overpowered thanos. knocking thing's head (who is hardly a true powerhouse) with prof isn't beating them, so who knows how the 2 would have done later. and all he did was hold his own against pg thor. hulk also stalemated wm thor as well. hulk's strength feats are unquestionable. to say he can't possibly match just strength with thanos makes no sense to me. ko'ing someone with thanos's durability is something else.
Originally posted by leonidas
meh. no reason savage can't match mindless hulk and he battled immortal herc, wonderman, namor and ironman all at once.
Originally posted by leonidas
thing and thor also ultimately overpowered thanos.
I have no idea where you got that notion from, but its flat out wrong.
Originally posted by leonidas
knocking thing's head (who is hardly a true powerhouse) with prof isn't beating them, so who knows how the 2 would have done later.
Originally posted by leonidas
and all he did was hold his own against pg thor.
Originally posted by leonidas
hulk also stalemated wm thor as well.
Originally posted by leonidas
hulk's strength feats are unquestionable. to say he can't possibly match just strength with thanos makes no sense to me.
Originally posted by EnyalusYes. And then was KTFO by Thor. Easily.
what? 😑
mindless was taken out by a whole HOST of heroes. thor had nothing to do with it. another time strange brf'd him. not sure what instance you're talking about.
Not. Even. Close.I have no idea where you got that notion from, but its flat out wrong.
😂
marvel 2in1 annual. thor and thing work together to pound him and thanos needs to use energy attacks. not sure--again--what you're talking about . . .
I'm assuming it would have been a double KO for Thing and Hulk, if Quasar hadn't stepped in to cushion it. He was taking on Thor, Herc, Thing, and Hulk at the same time. And he was standing, unarmed, at the end of it all. He was never in any danger of being KO'd, even by those four powerhouses.
assuming? hmmm . . .
and didn't thor end up ko'ing thanos and leaving him floating in space at some point in that arc . . .?
He also landed more blows and floored Thor more times than Thor floored Thanos.
landed more? and? thanos was bloodied. thor was never in danger physically.
That was Maestro Hulk, and I think that was while he was still amped by being a walking nexus of reality.
it was the very start of the maestro. no nexxus though i don't think.
That's cool. Two head-to-head matches say that doesn't make a lick of difference. Casually flooring Drax and Hulk at the same time with a backhand, and then owning Thing and Hulk together prove this.
he . . . knocked hulk down? a non-savage hulk? jawdrop
anyway, hulk's strength feats are plenty enough to go on. thanos never battled savage hulk, so what happened with prof hulk is irrelevent. i've seen morg take it to thanos physically. i've even seen friggin' STARFOX take it to thanos physically. no reason whatsoever hulk couldn't do the same.
Originally posted by leonidas
what? 😑mindless was taken out by a whole HOST of heroes. thor had nothing to do with it. another time strange brf'd him. not sure what instance you're talking about.
Originally posted by leonidas
marvel 2in1 annual. thor and thing work together to pound him and thanos needs to use energy attacks. not sure--again--what you're talking about . . .
Originally posted by leonidas
and didn't thor end up ko'ing thanos and leaving him floating in space at some point in that arc . . .?
Originally posted by leonidas
landed more? and? thanos was bloodied. thor was never in danger physically.
Originally posted by leonidas
it was the very start of the maestro. no nexxus though i don't think.
Originally posted by leonidas
he . . . knocked hulk down? a non-savage hulk? jawdrop
Originally posted by leonidas
i've seen morg take it to thanos physically.
Originally posted by leonidas
i've even seen friggin' STARFOX take it to thanos physically. no reason whatsoever hulk couldn't do the same.
Originally posted by EnyalusI was talking about Mindless and battling the West Coast Avengers and, I think, the Avengers. Thor comes along and ends it.
still don't know where you're getting that from . . . wasn't thor who ended it. immortal herc was ready to kill hulk when he was finally overcome by a group of heroes.
I know what you're referring to. I have it. Show me where they 'overpowered' Thanos. Anywhere during that fight.
when they combine their blows and floor him? 😕
then he starts blasting them.
Blood flew from Thor's mouth, too. And no duh Thor was in no danger, physically. That's the nature of the power gem.
so, if he never threatened thor and all he did was trade some punches, then . . .? not much of a feat.
I don't believe you. 😛
😠
You don't casually backhand two class 100+ and knock them on their asses without being thoroughly stronger than them.
or without them being retarded and standing there to get backhanded. all he did was knock them down. that's not even a fight. 😐
Jesus, dude. You're exaggerating everything. Morg ran through Thanos' first blast and tackled him. A far cry from 'taking it to Thanos physically.' Besides that, Morg would probably physically overpower a Savage Hulk, too. Savage Hulk's been easily overpowered by Surfer, for example. Who Morg virtually stalemates.
i'd doubt morg would overpower hulk like ss does. and it's not an exaggeration. morg had him pinned with his axe. how is that overexaggerating?
facepalm Again...not using strength. Using speed and fighting skill. And Thanos was really suffering after that abuse, wasn't he? 🙄 [/B]
he suffered no more than hulk would from a frickin backhand! come on . . . and it didn't look much like 'fighting skills' when starfox started battling him. and simple skill?? on a guy who taught GAMORA? 🙄
point is--others have lasted in physical brawls with him. hulk could do the same. ko'ing him is something different. but hulk's strength feats are too numerous and too great to say he can't possibly match thanos's strength.
you think thanos can duplicate any of hulk's strength feats? what proof do you have that thanos is definitively STRONGER than a mindless hulk?
Originally posted by Enyalus
I'll concede if you want. 'Cause I'm done arguing this. It's absolutely ridiculous to think any Hulk has a chance against Thanos. Especially if all you're going to do is ignore, downplay, or exaggerate things in order to help your case.
you don't have to concede anything if you don't want. and there was nothing to downplay because he never FOUGHT AN ANGRY SAVAGE HULK. so his showings against prof don't matter.
can he match all of hulk's strength feats iyo? what definitive proof is there that he is physically stronger than a mindless hulk? seriously.
i don't see why it's ridiculous to think hulk has a chance of matching JUST STRENGTH with thanos. thanos could vaporize him with a couple blasts, use tech to one-shot him, bfr him, maybe even use matter manip and turn him to stone or something. but straight -up brawl? based on hulk's history, of course i'd say hulk has a chance to match his physical strength.
Originally posted by leonidas
can he match all of hulk's strength feats iyo?
Yeah, he's stronger than any herald in Marvel. Hell, look at his grappling contest with DP Tyrant. He was stalemating him in it until that spaceship engine fired and blew shit up. DP Tyrant had enough strength to physically one-shot BRB, Gladiator, and Surfer. (He puts him on his back and out of the fight for a few minutes with a backhand.)
Regarding the 2in1 fight, he was taking both Thing and Thor on without trouble. Hell, Thing attempts to punch him at one point and gets knocked on his ass just from hitting Thanos' chest. And when Thing gets behind him attempting to restrain Thanos, Thor whacks him in the chest with Mjolnir to seemingly no effect. Then he tosses Thing off, etc. It's only briefly that they knock Thanos down, and he wasn't injured. It's the same exact scene as what you were saying didn't make a difference: Thanos backhanding Drax and Hulk to the ground. Except that we saw that Thanos wasn't injured, because he dropped Thing with one shot after that and Thor with another two, I think.
C'mon. It's ridiculous to think a herald is stronger than Thanos. Hell, in his first appearance, he shattered a planet with the friction he generated from grappling with Drax.
Originally posted by EnyalusYou don't casually backhand two class 100+ and knock them on their asses without being thoroughly stronger than them.
Jesus, dude. You're exaggerating everything. Morg ran through Thanos' first blast and tackled him. A far cry from 'taking it to Thanos physically.' Besides that, Morg would probably physically overpower a Savage Hulk, too. Savage Hulk's been easily overpowered by Surfer, for example. Who Morg virtually stalemates.
[/B]
You, uh, contradicted yourself there. A lil bit. Backhand versus tackling. You say the backhand shows obvious superiority, but a tackle shows nothing?
Furthermore, as has been explained, Prof's showings don't count in any way towards the REAL Hulk. That is, Savage Hulk. The same Hulk that Thanos himself explicitly said he's cautious to fight. Now why would Thanos be concerned about Hulk? Well, what's Hulk KNOWN for more than anything? Strength. Hulk IS Marvel's goto strength guy. Like Onslaught's armor, the big mountain in Secret Wars, and many of Hulk's other feats that no one else managed to pull off.
Next, the durability thing. I probably can't crush a solid five pound rock in my bare hands, but I can lift it, throw it pretty far, and even kick it around. Thanos pimpsmacked Hulk(nevermind Thing, he's a second rater), and Hulk was indeed smacked. Great. It wasn't a strength contest though. It just means Thanos' strength is enough to challenge Hulk's DURABILITY.
Here's my point; If Thanos is leagues above Hulk in every way, why in the Hell would Thanos be cautious of Hulk? In his own words, he said that over the years he's sought to avoid an outright battle against the Hulk. Well, is he cautious Hulk might be him in the hop-skip-jump contest in the Olympics? The only offensive power the Hulk has is his strength. Logically, that HAS to be what Thanos is cautious of. Apocalypse himself, after measuring Hulk with the Celestial's technology, said that Hulk may actually have the potential to generate enough power to challenge the Celestial's themselves. Without taking that too much out of context, an ancient savvy dude like Apoc would know what he's talking about. I'm not saying step on Hulk's toes and he'll level the whole damn lot of them, but there's some kind of potential there. END POINT: Hulk's physically stronger than Thanos. It's the only explanation for these instances in question.
Hand to Hand; Really. How often does a guy like Thanos resort to fist fights? Hulk has experience dealing with whole armies, gods, cosmic entities, and all other manner of ultra-high powered beings. And given the nature of the Hulk, and his lack of versatility in the power department, almost all his battles are fist fights. He has no power blasts, no speed blitz, no telekinesis or telepathy. And he's beaten ALL of his enemies and opponents at least once. This includes Thor, Surfer, Namor, Hercules, the hordes of Hulk-villains, Sentry, entire teams of super heroes, sometimes multiple teams. As WWHulk, he proved that if Hulk simply did a little planning, he could take over the world. Not to mention he did so as Maestro as well. Hulk also took over Sakaar. So hand to hand? Thanos doesn't have much over on Hulk.
Thanos is a cosmic being with OTHER powers, and those are what he'll need to deal with the real Hulk. Cosmic power has always saved Surfer's ass in the past, and when he couldn't use it in Sakaar the Hulk dominated him. Same deal with Thanos, regardless if Thanos is greater than Surfer. If Thanos simply uses his other powers, he should deal with Hulk without much grief.
All that said; the stips in THIS fight SUCK! A Hulk that can't get stronger? Like Prof Hulk? Or Abomination? Wendigo? Sasquatch? Thing? These powerhouses that get leveled by anyone that feels like getting a warm-up? Hulk's power is limitless strength. Take that away, it's not Hulk. It's A Hulk. And Thanos can still use his cosmic powers? Unless this thread is simply for those guys that utterly adore Thanos and love to agree with themselves, you need to rethink the stips. I mean, Thanos already wins withOUT capping Hulk's strength, so why take it away? If Hulk has his capless strength, then a fight can actually be debated, but here we are simply comparing their powers... Why? Because we know Thanos wins with these stips. Remove them, and it's something I can work with.
Originally posted by EnyalusYes. Again, he's fought both Champion w/ PG and Thor w/ PG to a standstill. Both are more powerful than any Hulk. And I hate the people who claim, "Oh, it was his durability that allowed Thanos to hang with them." I don't know if you're one of them or not. Because it's not just his durability. He was trading blows. He was giving as good as he was getting in those battles. That takes strength. Even before Thor had the Power Gem, he one-shotted Drax w/ PG twice. I mean, that's insane, right? Taking out the entire IW, Surfer, and Strange at once...yet not able to gain any advantage on Thanos physically.
Yeah, he's stronger than any herald in Marvel. Hell, look at his grappling contest with DP Tyrant. He was stalemating him in it until that spaceship engine fired and blew shit up. DP Tyrant had enough strength to physically one-shot BRB, Gladiator, and Surfer. (He puts him on his back and out of the fight for a few minutes with a backhand.)
Regarding the 2in1 fight, he was taking both Thing and Thor on without trouble. Hell, Thing attempts to punch him at one point and gets knocked on his ass just from hitting Thanos' chest. And when Thing gets behind him attempting to restrain Thanos, Thor whacks him in the chest with Mjolnir to seemingly no effect. Then he tosses Thing off, etc. It's only briefly that they knock Thanos down, and he wasn't injured. It's the same exact scene as what you were saying didn't make a difference: Thanos backhanding Drax and Hulk to the ground. Except that we saw that Thanos wasn't injured, because he dropped Thing with one shot after that and Thor with another two, I think.
C'mon. It's ridiculous to think a herald is stronger than Thanos. Hell, in his first appearance, he shattered a planet with the friction he generated from grappling with Drax. [/B]
and mindless battle immortal herc, namor, wonderman, ironman and shehulk simultaneously for an entire issue and more.
the tyrant battle really wasn't much of a strength test as it was a blast test. again, matching for a second isn't much of a feat. i DO think it took strength to match thor, but a lot was durability too. hulk has shaken dimensions with his strength among other gawd-awful yet canonical feats. breaking a planet while battling another herald isn't much considering some of hulk's feats. and what caused that planet to shatter isn't even clearly shown. friction? huh? 😕
and i never anywhere said hulk was stronger than thanos. i said it is not impossible to think he could match thanos's physical strength. hell, even the beyonder was impressed by hulk when he said:
"You are nothing but power incarnate! An infinity of power with no finite element inside!! Worse yet, you remind me of someone (himself)."
marvel has made a point of making hulk the paragon of strength. they've given him feats to back it up. just because he's thanos doesn't mean he has infinite strength, nor does it mean his strength cannot be matched.
Originally posted by Master Court
You, uh, contradicted yourself there. A lil bit. Backhand versus tackling. You say the backhand shows obvious superiority, but a tackle shows nothing?Furthermore, as has been explained, Prof's showings don't count in any way towards the REAL Hulk. That is, Savage Hulk. The same Hulk that Thanos himself explicitly said he's cautious to fight. Now why would Thanos be concerned about Hulk? Well, what's Hulk KNOWN for more than anything? Strength. Hulk IS Marvel's goto strength guy. Like Onslaught's armor, the big mountain in Secret Wars, and many of Hulk's other feats that no one else managed to pull off.
Next, the durability thing. I probably can't crush a solid five pound rock in my bare hands, but I can lift it, throw it pretty far, and even kick it around. Thanos pimpsmacked Hulk(nevermind Thing, he's a second rater), and Hulk was indeed smacked. Great. It wasn't a strength contest though. It just means Thanos' strength is enough to challenge Hulk's DURABILITY.
Here's my point; If Thanos is leagues above Hulk in every way, why in the Hell would Thanos be cautious of Hulk? In his own words, he said that over the years he's sought to avoid an outright battle against the Hulk. Well, is he cautious Hulk might be him in the hop-skip-jump contest in the Olympics? The only offensive power the Hulk has is his strength. Logically, that HAS to be what Thanos is cautious of. Apocalypse himself, after measuring Hulk with the Celestial's technology, said that Hulk may actually have the potential to generate enough power to challenge the Celestial's themselves. Without taking that too much out of context, an ancient savvy dude like Apoc would know what he's talking about. I'm not saying step on Hulk's toes and he'll level the whole damn lot of them, but there's some kind of potential there. END POINT: Hulk's physically stronger than Thanos. It's the only explanation for these instances in question.
Hand to Hand; Really. How often does a guy like Thanos resort to fist fights? Hulk has experience dealing with whole armies, gods, cosmic entities, and all other manner of ultra-high powered beings. And given the nature of the Hulk, and his lack of versatility in the power department, almost all his battles are fist fights. He has no power blasts, no speed blitz, no telekinesis or telepathy. And he's beaten ALL of his enemies and opponents at least once. This includes Thor, Surfer, Namor, Hercules, the hordes of Hulk-villains, Sentry, entire teams of super heroes, sometimes multiple teams. As WWHulk, he proved that if Hulk simply did a little planning, he could take over the world. Not to mention he did so as Maestro as well. Hulk also took over Sakaar. So hand to hand? Thanos doesn't have much over on Hulk.
Thanos is a cosmic being with OTHER powers, and those are what he'll need to deal with the real Hulk. Cosmic power has always saved Surfer's ass in the past, and when he couldn't use it in Sakaar the Hulk dominated him. Same deal with Thanos, regardless if Thanos is greater than Surfer. If Thanos simply uses his other powers, he should deal with Hulk without much grief.
All that said; the stips in THIS fight SUCK! A Hulk that can't get stronger? Like Prof Hulk? Or Abomination? Wendigo? Sasquatch? Thing? These powerhouses that get leveled by anyone that feels like getting a warm-up? Hulk's power is limitless strength. Take that away, it's not Hulk. It's A Hulk. And Thanos can still use his cosmic powers? Unless this thread is simply for those guys that utterly adore Thanos and love to agree with themselves, you need to rethink the stips. I mean, Thanos already wins withOUT capping Hulk's strength, so why take it away? If Hulk has his capless strength, then a fight can actually be debated, but here we are simply comparing their powers... Why? Because we know Thanos wins with these stips. Remove them, and it's something I can work with.
that's a lot more effort than i would have expended, but . . .
😗
Originally posted by leonidas
and mindless battle immortal herc, namor, wonderman, ironman and shehulk simultaneously for an entire issue and more.
Originally posted by leonidas
the tyrant battle really wasn't much of a strength test as it was a blast test. again, matching for a second isn't much of a feat.
Originally posted by leonidas
and what caused that planet to shatter isn't even clearly shown. friction? huh? 😕
Originally posted by leonidas
and i never anywhere said hulk was stronger than thanos. i said it is not impossible to think he could match thanos's physical strength.
Ah, forgot about another strength feat for Thanos. During Infinity War, he was fighting his duplicate. This duplicate was created by the Cosmic Cubes and, for the fight against the real Thanos, was powered directly by the Power Gem. Thanos even admitted that the duplicate was stronger than him. The duplicate still got wrecked. 🙂
Originally posted by dawsey28[/thread]
http://img234.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img234&image=hulkthing0mf.jpg
Originally posted by Master Court
You, uh, contradicted yourself there. A lil bit. Backhand versus tackling. You say the backhand shows obvious superiority, but a tackle shows nothing?
Originally posted by Master Court
Furthermore, as has been explained, Prof's showings don't count in any way towards the REAL Hulk. That is, Savage Hulk. The same Hulk that Thanos himself explicitly said he's cautious to fight. Now why would Thanos be concerned about Hulk? Well, what's Hulk KNOWN for more than anything? Strength. Hulk IS Marvel's goto strength guy. Like Onslaught's armor, the big mountain in Secret Wars, and many of Hulk's other feats that no one else managed to pull off.
Originally posted by Master Court
Here's my point; If Thanos is leagues above Hulk in every way, why in the Hell would Thanos be cautious of Hulk?
Originally posted by Master Court
Hand to Hand; Really. How often does a guy like Thanos resort to fist fights?
Originally posted by Master Court
Thanos is a cosmic being with OTHER powers, and those are what he'll need to deal with the real Hulk. Cosmic power has always saved Surfer's ass in the past, and when he couldn't use it in Sakaar the Hulk dominated him.
not sure where you're getting that i'm 'low-balling' thanos. when he stood up with tyrant for a second, that's hardly proof that he was physically as strong. especially when we nkow he WASN'T as powerful as tyrant.
Originally posted by Enyalus
Is it possible for him to surpass Thanos' strength? Sure. I can concede that. But we aren't really arguing hypotheticals. [/B]
that's what i'm saying. 🙂 and we're EXACTLY arguing hypotheticals because this battle has NEVER HAPPENED. so we have been looking at just feats. savage's best strength feats are ridiculous. has there been a hulk as strong as thanos? hmm, not sure about that. i think for brief periods there probably has been. were i truly interested in debating this with you i'd have loads of hulk feats to parade around, but . . . i'm not that interested. 🙂
you conceded my main point, so i'm happy. 😄
