Jelena doesn't think it matters who can muster the force to invade Thalos.
"I believe that this should be taken as an opportunity to proactively prevent this drawing from becoming reality," Jelena says. "I believe it depicts an invasion. That does not mean an invasion will happen. You can make efforts to prevent it from occurring. Opening relations with the Republic may allow for an alliance, if not necessarily Thalos joining as a member world. Forging an alliance could give Thalos added protection, perhaps even closer relations with the Jedi Order.
"Otherwise you will sit and develop your army, waiting for something awful to come about. I say look at this as change, not doom. "
In that case Wentar has nothing really to say about the vision. He would rather suggest they turn their eyes to their immediate worries instead of what may come many, many years down the track.
Perhaps in the future there will be hints leading up to the prophecy, clues to show that it is nearing it's time. That would be the moment to take a step back, look at the state of the galaxy and decide what to do.
Not very helpful I know but Wentar has never been one to rely on force visions, being the 'Living Force' type.
Nope, I am afraid neither of the last two responses are any good to us. The drawing WILL happen. What it represents is unclear but it cannot be avoided.. But it must be prepared for as soon as possible- not to prepare is effectively a failure for Thalos no matter what it means.
It's either a danger- in which case they must defend themselves- or an opportunity- in which case they must open themselves. The two cannot be in any way mixed. It's a straight-out two way call. I highly advise against the temptation of the Golden Mean Fallacy- a common roleplayer disease where people obsess with trying to find a mythical 'better' option between two opposed choices.
It's either defend or open up.
Jelena is right- it is irrelevant who it is. It's also utterly impossible to know what it represents so a decision on that sort of logic is no good.
Vera has based her case on broader ideas rather than trying to 'beat' the prophecy (it cannot be beaten), and that's reasonable. After all, they'd have made a decision long ago if it could be worked out, in that sense. The nature of the debate is that no-one knows what it is- so the decision is down to philosophy.
Alright then *puts Philosophy Hat on*
Well lets look at this issue. What does each side mean?
The Invasion Interpretation would mean that Thaos remains very similar to the way it is now. A harsh, militaristic society, constantly afraid of any outsiders, and willing to respond to anyone with overwhelming force. This seems bad for the individual inhabitants of Thaos as their lives under Aquilla were not great. It would also seem to invalidate any gains we may have made here. Thaos would be as bad as it was when we came here.
The Alternate side of this is the Change Interpretation, in which case Thaos continues to move forward to a more modern existence, and accepts any outsiders as inevitable, and beneficial change. The downside to this is that if the outsiders were to be hostile, there would be significantly less resistance and Thaos could possibly be destroyed.
Now, we can add in our own Meta-Interpretation. We (as players and Star Wars fans) know that these triangle shaped ships are most certainly Star-Destroyers, or something of the like. And we also know (from reading the Dark Side thread) that when the Emperor does not want to, or cannot, send a whole fleet he sends a special task force to the place. This is what he has been using Osokans for. And we know that the Osokan use is specifically designed to hunt down any force-wielding opposition to the Emperor. So I feel it is a safe assumption (like I mentioned in the discussion thread) that the Emperor will send Osokans to Thalos.
Now the question remains. How do we act? It seems like we can do it in two ways. We can act purely as Jedi, and in character. That would be encouraging Thaos to accept change. That is a main reason why we supported Thea (besides the fact that she actually helped us first) and it is the just thing to do. We would be helping the citizens of Thaos, as far as we could know.
The other way would be in a purely Meta-gaming sense, where we encourage the residents to hold the Invasion Interpretation, and prepare for an attack by the Emperor (we could even teach them to hate Pig-like things and prepare them for an Osokan invasion... But I digress [Also, I'm kidding here]) This seems to be acting rather out of character for Jedi as it basically sacrifices the good of the people for a survival that we do not actually know is in jeopardy.
The final way we could act is a mix of the two. We could encourage the Ladies to accept the Change Interpretation, but then keep the secret of Thaos as force wielders to ourselves, and hope the Emperor does not catch wind of it. Sort of like what happened on Zeiton. This is a bit of Meta-Gaming yes. But it should be easy enough to understand why Thaos needs to be protected from the Empire. And on that level, it seems to be the best we can do. We can do our best to protect Thaos from the Republic/Empire and encourage them to change and become a healthier society.
Maybe thats trying to have my cake and eat it too. But I don't know.
Personally I wouldn't consider it meta gaming if Roan strongly suggested to the Council to keep Thalos a secret, after all he was at Zeiton and saw what kind of madness can happen to a large society of force users when outsiders get involved.
Anyway, as for my personal view on the vision. It's hard to say... Thalos is very far out. What is more believable? Someone coming all this way to invade or someone coming all this way to trade? I'm unsure really...
Originally posted by Mithlond
Iffa wonders if there are any vaults different from the others. Either by shape, size, purpose or location. Any that are away from others? Also, any transit of goods occurring soon?
Indeed. Also, how goes G8's scan for dead zones? I'm quite sure I've picked up more net guns and tracers by this point if they're available. Gator's scan is the only other thing going on.
Well, shall we take a Jedi vote on it? Vera says open, Jelena abstains... others?
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They are all unique, Iffa- of all varieties of sizes and, aside form the basic structure of joined hexagonal blocks, different shapes.
Goods transit all the time- thousands an hour. It is a very busy planet.
Nothing yet on the dead zones.
Hmmm, Thalos is so far out, that an alliance with any other civilization seems far more unlikely then a power hungry man seeking war or pirates raiding for fun.
There is also the fact that Adelmo is still out there, who knows what she's planning. It may be her that is building up a force to come and invade Thalos or even a third party responding to the actions of Adelmo...
Wentar will vote invasion, he sees too much cause for invasion then he does an alliance with anything right now.
It is interesting to see that some of our past experiences determine our ideas.
For example, Gallagher is going to vote change and openness because he does not want Thalos to end up with another Aquila. Keeping Sienar in mind, it is never healthy for a world to possess a Dark Side force with accumulated political power. And if the Thalosians decided to prepare for invasion, that is exactly who would lead them.
Aquila might even regain her seat for her accomplishments in building a strong fighting force.