Gamora vs. Wolverine

Originally posted by cdtm
Gotta love Thor. He's the one character who fans will argue one moment he can smash Silver Surfer and Drax, and other fans will argue the next that he gets beaten down by Wolverine. 😄

ermmm..it's not a beat down - it's the fact that he has the tools, the reflexes, and skills. All he has to do - and this was proven in their last fight - is dodge a single strike from Thor and counter to the jugular - or the eyes or whatever. Then follow up as Thor is now either bleeding out or blind - with a series of claw strikes to the vitals. His claws are unbreakable remember so it's not far-fetched. Logan has dodged lazers and has a sixth sense which allows him to sense arrows coming at him from behind - why can't he dodge Thor long enough to tear open his neck? That being said, I will admit that if Thor hits him than Logan could very well end up in Canada from Texas. Logan gets hit often due to CIS.

Originally posted by cdtm
Gotta love Thor. He's the one character who fans will argue one moment he can smash Silver Surfer and Drax, and other fans will argue the next that he gets beaten down by Wolverine. 😄

Wolverine hanging with Thor in melee combat ≠ Wolverine beating Thor.

Originally posted by jinzin
hmmmm all good points.... And she IS super strong........ shit...

if only relegated to his basest means of combat, thor might have a problem.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
think about it this way: can wolverine beat storm? now add class 100+ strength and durability, an indestructible weapon, the ability to open portals and fire innumerable beams and effects from said weapon, etc to storm, and also give her thousands of years of battle experience against all types of opponents (gods to trolls). can he still beat her?

Yes, if she decides not to use her powers and goes with ONLY her unbreakable weapon, strength and durability. In fact, without super speed and reflexes, she doesn't even get to hit Logan once - despite her experiences. Being a god doesn't mean anything special in marvel. They can bleed and die for the most part.

Think of it this way - I can take out a lion with a gun - but without my gun I fail to take even a wild tabby cat? lol. Now imagine if that little old cat had unbreakable claws a healing factor, ninja fighting skills and human intelligence? How many people could that cat kill despite those people being like many times stronger? Even if you had on armor, you would get killed eventually by this little cat. Heck, he might even take out an army of humans. Think about it - he can't be hit - when he does, he heals - and he has unbreakable bones and claws with crazy fighting skills and human intelligence. Does it really matter how much stronger we are than the little cat? No. Even if we use weapons, we have to get around it's sixth ninja sense and ubber reflexes. You see how hard it becomes right? Just because you are stronger and possess far greater weapons doesn't garauntee you the win.

So if Thor doesn't use his powers he still beats Logan..because he's stronger and has an unbreakable weapon...yeah try beating up an ally cat with a pipe - don't actually try this - but if you ever did you would see that despite the fact the cat is a weakling compared to you, it has better reflexes and agility, speed etc so yeah..you might get hurt. And considering the cat is stupid and has breakable bones well...this is silly but I'm trying to explain to you our line of thinking. Why should Thor be able to beat someone who is a) a better fighter b) possibly faster and better reflexes or at least equal to c) has unbreakable claws and knowledge of vitals. Just try and remember that Thor isn't using his powers here.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Wolverine hanging with Thor in melee combat ≠ Wolverine beating Thor.

True, but I'm thinking more about how no one really argues Surfer can one shot Thor with his multi-planet shattering cosmic attacks, or knock his head off with a single cosmic punch, yet you'll get arguments (And comic book examples!) that Spider-Man uses superior speed and agility to pepper Thor with punches and actually hurt him...

How's Thor's durability to piercing damage? Is he bullet proof?

Originally posted by psycho gundam
if only relegated to his basest means of combat, thor might have a problem.

Okay, that has been our entire argument the WHOLE time. That if Thor basically uses only his strength and hammer he will lose more often than not. Or at least he's capable of losing. Logan has been hit by plenty of bricks via CIS. Even though he's capable of dodging he takes it anyay which often ends up in him losing the fight. So it could go either way.

It's basically Thor trying to reason with Logan and saying okay...I'm gonna try and melee him...shit I'm getting cut up - "sigh" okay Logan you're not listening - Blast! Logan wakes up and realises it's Thor. It should also be pointed out that once Thor started levitating, Wolverine was actually regretting starting the fight.

In a straight up fight with both characters using their full potential, Logan loses 10/10. So long as they are not confined to a small cage - Thor needs to be up high...or have the time to get up high in a hurry - say 10 meters at least.

Originally posted by cdtm
True, but I'm thinking more about how no one really argues Surfer can one shot Thor with his multi-planet shattering cosmic attacks, or knock his head off with a single cosmic punch, yet you'll get arguments (And comic book examples!) that Spider-Man uses superior speed and agility to pepper Thor with punches and actually hurt him...

How's Thor's durability to piercing damage? Is he bullet proof?

Well, if Thor decided to wade into melee with Spider-man for some unknown reason, Parker would in all likeliness land at least half a dozen unanswered blows. They wouldn't do anything, but he'd still land them. I know coming to this realization puts the squeeze real tight on the balls of fanboys, but Thor's actually combat speed isn't all that impressive. For all intensive purposes Thor's combat speed = Hercules = Namor = Ares with some slight differences between each of them. Obviously flight speed is a completely different matter, though.

Some times he is, some times he isn't. I come down on the "he is bullet proof" side of the fence.

Originally posted by cdtm
True, but I'm thinking more about how no one really argues Surfer can one shot Thor with his multi-planet shattering cosmic attacks, or knock his head off with a single cosmic punch, yet you'll get arguments (And comic book examples!) that Spider-Man uses superior speed and agility to pepper Thor with punches and actually hurt him...

How's Thor's durability to piercing damage? Is he bullet proof?

Yes, and Wolverine's claws only do superficial damage at first - Logan would need more time to reach the organs - hence why I say he needs to hit the throat or the eyes. But yeah, the first strike Logan gave Thor paper cuts - that's pretty epic durability considering that

a) Logan has eviscerated Grey Hulk

b) Logan has cut Savage Hulk up, Red Hulk up, and WWH up...he was causing WWH to gush blood

c) He wasn't causing Thor to gush blood and Thor wasn't seriously hurt - just flesh wounds that were not that deep.

Insane durability right there.

looked like Wolverine stabbed him in the end there... could be wrong. but yeah his durability is pretty good.

As for bullet proof.. like Srank said, sometimes he is, sometimes he isn't... but we have seen him stabbed and sliced... a lot actually..

I think if Wolverine tried to land more straight shots and less glancing swipes he'd probably stab right into Thor.

Gamora doesn't have any speed feats on par with Wolverine's.

Gamora doesn't have any healing factor feats that suggest she would be capable of dealing with Wolverine's potential damage output.

The effectiveness of God Slayer is entirely theoretical, all we actually know about it is that it broke on Thanos' skin.

So how does Gamora win? If Wolverine tags her he is going to mess her up, if she tags Wolverine, he'll be fine. Wolverine has taken far worse than the best Gamora can dish out and kept going. The opposite isn't true. So what? Is she going to fight Wolverine with out getting hit... because... even Ronan was tagging her without to much problem, and he isn't exactly the king of hand to hand. Class 70 strength isn't huge shakes compared to the heavy hitters Wolverine has thrown down with, and Wolverine has tanked dozens of instant kill pressure points to non effect. So just what do people think is going to happen here? Quite frankly the assertion that Gamora could not only beat Wolverine for the majority but that it is something she could easily accomplish is absurd.

Heres a question. Who would win in a fight Wolverine with class 70 strength, midtier durability, with a sword and dagger in place of his claws and his healing factor operating at 10%, or standard Wolverine. Because thats the fight more or less.

Thats crazy that people are basing their judgement off of one fight with Gamora doing well against Ronan. Everyone has their shining moments at least once in their entire career but that doesnt mean that it will be something consistent.

Look at the entire history of both and that should help you with your judgement.

Compare their speed feats, fighting skills, everything that has been shown in a comic featuring them and you will have your answer.

That is EXACTLY why I am saying Wolverine wins this and I'm not basing this off of Wolverine having a good showing against Thor or Gamora having a good showing against Ronan.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin

"Full Capacity
It is assumed that each contestant will fight to his/her best ability, but still within the character's personality, unless specified otherwise. That means they will use any powers at their disposal. For example, even though The Flash doesn't clock each of his own opponents in the first millisecond in his own comic, it is assumed that is a viable tactic on this board since it is a proven fact that he possesses that level of speed.
It is also assumed that the characters fight at their optimum levels of ability - not explicitly weakened or unusually powered up for those who have variable power levels."

Except we're NOT arguing about a forum fight between Ronan and Gamora. We're arguing about the validity of the fight itself as it is presented on panel. PLEEEEEEASEEEE DISTINGUISH THE DIFFERENCE...!!!!

Full capacity applies to FORUM FIGHTS NOT ON-PANEL COMIC FIGHT VALIDITY.

/facepalm

Forgive me, but this debate is getting exasperating...

Geez, i leave for a few hours and this thread sprouts 4 pages...!

edit: forget it.

I can't believe the level of stupidity this thread has reached... Why are people discounting that Wolverine said that Gamora healing factor is on par with his? Again this was put in there FOR A REASON by the writer. Sorry you don't like it but it is there. Are you honestly arguing that the writer was trying to use trickery so we could decipher what he really meant? He put that line in there hoping we would then read that and say… Oooo Wolverine can't really know if that is true or not and thus…. her HF isn't on par with Wolverine… WTF!!! No… it was put in there to ILLUSTRATE in plain english that her hf is on par with his. Period. Now Wolverine beats Thor in a h2h fight... even with his hammer? My God!!! I'm really unclear about what is going on here... is there a contagious wolverine wanking disease spreading across the forum? It's just lunacy. Next thing we know they will say Wolverine makes Thanos bleed out in a h2h fight... only I'm sure it's easier since he has no melee weapon...

Wolverine

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Next thing we know they will say Wolverine makes Thanos bleed out in a h2h fight... only I'm sure it's easier since he has no melee weapon...

^ Thats what he said.

wolverine already beat gamora so whats the big deal