The Old Republic Sith Empire vs the Yuuzhan Vong

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
It's only cause they ran outta Redbull/Energizers.

Like, Dark Viagra, liquid form. Or something.

Are you people...nuts?

First off: "You wish to know about the worlds of the Sith Empire? There were many, well over one hundred that were habitable and the Sith controlled the riches of a thousand species." (Seviss Vaa, The Essential Guide Through the Force, p.158)

Yet unlike regular planets, those worlds followed the rules of the Sith Empire, meaning that the strongest should rule. That would naturally have led to a more martial society than the Republic has ever seen, losely resembling the lifestyle of the Vong themselves.

And talking about "the Sith": You have an entire species of force users here, ranking from Massassi Warriors who wield their weapons with force aided strength and precission to Sith magic wielding priests, capable of summoning deadly illusions (see Aleema Keto). That's a fighting force equiped with a fury and determination that was completely unaffected by Jedi Battle Meditation (as seen during the Battle of Korbos in Tales of the Jedi: The Fall of the Sith Empire).

On top of that, you have the various warbeasts that the Sith and Dark Jedi before them did create. Even the original Exiles were a group of Dark Jedi that "discovered that they could use the force to transform creatures into mutant warriors, mounts and spirit-devouring Leviathans" (Vodo Siosk-Baas,Tedryn Holocron, The Essential Guide through the Force, p. 12). This before coming into contact with Sith Alchemy, that led to a nice advantage in that field. Simply imagine the battlefield being swarmed with Leviathans or mutated Massassi Warriors similar to the Nightbeast. Those being aided by tangible illusions capable of drastically raising the actual numbers of the Sith (as seen in The Fall of the Sith Empire). Add the Dark Reaper, a device so powerful that "it will mean the end of the Republic." (Mace Windu, Star Wars: The Clone Wars Video Game)

Then you can add the Sith Lords themselves as icing on the cake. As Kreia told the Exile in KotoR II: The Sith Lords when visiting Korriban: "If you were to face an ancient Sith lord in combat, you would learn that we are as children playing with toys compared to the prowess of the old masters." One could take Ajunta Pall as an example for that combat prowess, considering that he "personally slew more than a dozen of Jedi in the Battle of Corbus" (Tionne Solusar, Tedryn Holocron, The Essential Guide through the Force, p.12). Add their force aided technology (amulets, sceptres, talismans, whatnot) and I doubt that the Vong would win anything on the ground.

Space-battle? You must be joking. You are aware of the fact, that the Ancient Sith Empire - according to Ajunta Pall in KotoR - controlled the Star Forge, right? Infinite droid starfighters and capital ships anybody? That aside: If Naga Sadows corsair is a standard model of a Derriphan-class battleship - and there is nothing to suggest otherwise-, they have more than one hundred of those ships with all their destructive abilities and could, technically, create an infinite amount of them using the Star Forge.

A single of those ships alone could, potentially, wipe out a large part of the Vong fleet in a suicide attack. Hundreds of those? Even if commanded by lesser Sith Lord - those ships main weapon can be a quite powerful tool, even in the hands of a "lesser" force user like Aleema Keto as seen in Tales of the Jedi: The Sith War. If it works on the principles of telekinesis (which the comment on "ripping the core from a star" that is featured multiple times in Fall of the Sith Empire and The Sith War seems to imply - just like the on panel evidence of Aleema using it), it's entirely possible to destroy Vong ships with more "conventional" means - by ripping them apart.

And again the Sith Lords themselves could turn the battle in favor for the Sith Empire. Imagine huge illusional fleets summoned by Sadow and the Vong wouldn't even know what targets they must shoot, which would be pretty hard already, provided that the Star Forge could be used to produce countless small or capital ships that could be thrown into battle...

That aside:

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
And it's also largely irrelevant unless the Sith Fleet was away from the proximity of the supernova.

Sadow used his ship twice against enemies in close proximity to his own forces. Once to destroy his own meditation sphere, killing Gav Deragon in the process and another time to wipe out the ships following him during his escape to Yavin 4. In both cases, he did just trigger some massive solar flares in order to do the job. Yet that would still be enough to destroy an enemy fleet completely unaware of said weapon and - being "blind" in the force - without the ability to understand what was hitting them.

Conclusion: On the ground, the Sith Empire would be almost unbeatable as long as the illusions can be kept up - which shouldn't be a problem as the Meditation Sphere can be hidden at some remote location. In space battle, the Vong would have a better chance - but they are confronted with an enemy that capable of turning hundreds of ships in the Sith's navy into sun-system-killing superweapons. Imagine one faction of the SW Galaxy controlling 100 Sun Crushers...

Add the fact that the Sith Empire has a potentially unlimited amount of ground and space forces (droids / droid ships from the Star Forge), I really don't see how the Vong should be able to win this...

Originally posted by Borbarad
Are you people...nuts?

First off: "You wish to know about the worlds of the Sith Empire? There were many, well over one hundred that were habitable and the Sith controlled the riches of a thousand species." (Seviss Vaa, The Essential Guide Through the Force, p.158)

Yet unlike regular planets, those worlds followed the rules of the Sith Empire, meaning that the strongest should rule. That would naturally have led to a more martial society than the Republic has ever seen, losely resembling the lifestyle of the Vong themselves.

And talking about "the Sith": You have an entire species of force users here, ranking from Massassi Warriors who wield their weapons with force aided strength and precission to Sith magic wielding priests, capable of summoning deadly illusions (see Aleema Keto). That's a fighting force equiped with a fury and determination that was completely unaffected by Jedi Battle Meditation (as seen during the Battle of Korbos in Tales of the Jedi: The Fall of the Sith Empire).

A single of those ships alone could, potentially, wipe out a large part of the Vong fleet in a suicide attack. Hundreds of those? Even if commanded by lesser Sith Lord - those ships main weapon can be a quite powerful tool, even in the hands of a "lesser" force user like Aleema Keto as seen in Tales of the Jedi: The Sith War. If it works on the principles of telekinesis (which the comment on "ripping the core from a star" that is featured multiple times in Fall of the Sith Empire and The Sith War seems to imply - just like the on panel evidence of Aleema using it), it's entirely possible to destroy Vong ships with more "conventional" means - by ripping them apart.

Add the fact that the Sith Empire has a potentially unlimited amount of ground and space forces (droids / droid ships from the Star Forge), I really don't see how the Vong should be able to win this... [/B]

::::Giant Facepalm::::

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
All of which is irrelevant against superior numbers, superior technology, and a foe that can't be sensed through the force.

So the Vong are outnumbering the population of more than a hundred planets? I'd love to see your proof for that. Technology? See below. They can't be sensed? How the hell does that matter? Are they invisible, too?

Tell me, how many warbeasts out there, because they're not "limitless", and what are they going to do against the various types of ground troops genetically created by the Vong?

They are pretty much limitless, if you take the illusions into consideration which are "turned into reality" as the narrator in the comics happily proclaims. So the Sith do pretty much have unlimited ground forces, unless somebody finds the meditation sphere hidden somewhere in the Galaxy and attacks it.

Great, because Kreia lived a thousand years earlier and would definitely be able to back that statement up. Hmmm or is it flat out bias? And Ajunta Pall? Who gives a monkey's ass? There is absolutely NO information on the Jedi he slew. For all you know, they were above average at best, and it took him a full day to slay 12 of them. This is all irrelevant.

But of course Kreia is biased. She didn't spend a nice portion of her life with studying Sith lore at illustrious places like Malachor V. Studies that enabled her to wipe three Jedi Masters from existance with a mere handmovement. Do you see any link there?

And he needed a day to slay more than a dozen of Jedi? Name one Sith with a kill count in a similar timespan that even comes close. Anakin needed a legion of Clone Troopers to archive something similar and I bet Pall didn't face younglings...

Oh Jesus Christ, you have reached a level of reaching I didn't think was possible on this forum. At the VERY BEST, Ajunta Pall alluded to something that COULD have described the Star Forge. There is NO proof or any kind of deduction stating that they had access to it, or even knew where it was. Come on Nai, I'm starting to get the feeling that this is all just a sarcastic troll, in which case, kudos. If not, please stop doing drugs.

Quite funny that somebody who comes up with totally unmotivated antagonizing calls me troll. That aside:

- Pall speaks about their "greatest secret" that is "burried on this world (Korriban)" when the only important thing we see burried is the Star Map
- said Star Map is located in the tomp of the last Dark Lord. Why would they hide it there (beyond some nice traps) if it wasn't anything specials
- what other "old place" should Pall refer to that was "the source of our (the Sith Lords) power"? We know that they were placed into a ship and shot directly to Korriban after the Battle of Corbos. So that "old place" was reached from Korriban.

That aside: Do you really want to suggest that the Sith didn't develop the idea to follow the Star Map that they had right in front of them for almost 2,000 years, especially when the must have had plenty of information about the Infinite Empire, given that Adas was kind enough to leave his holocron around? May I also point out that each of the Star Maps pointed straigth to Lehon before the Infinite Empire remotely sabotaged them, which means that every damn individual being alive on one of the planets with a Star Map knew the location of Lehon and, therefor, the Star Forge - including the original Sith people on Korriban.

And maybe it's also coincidence, that the Star Forge, even at times of Revan and Malak, produces Derriphan-class battleships (mentioned in the Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide), which were the spine of the Ancient Sith navy. Did Revan and Malak fed the Star Forge with 2000 year old plans to create outdated ships? Makes much sense. That, of course, is still ignoring the question what other "old place" that is the source of the Ancient Siths power Ajunta Pall could possible refer to. But it's nice to know that I am reaching...

The numbers of the sith empire don't even begin to compare to the numbers of the entire Vong, and that's before we get into the discussion of the Vong being technologically superior in every aspect.

First: Give me some numbers for the forces of the Sith and Vong. In short: Prove up or shut up. We're dealing with entire races in both cases, but the Vong didn't have hundreds of worlds to prosper on for about 2,000 years - had they?

Second: Stop ignoring that Sadow managed to summon "real" armies out of nothing on three seperated planets simultaneously making the Sith forces appear "innumerable" (according to Odan-Urr).

Thirdly: Technologically superior in every aspect? I must have missed the weapons capable of triggering supernovas in the Vong's arsenal. I also missed those nice amulets they use as ranged weapons, capable of creating room sized blasts and tearing entire buildings down. Did it ever occur to you, that Naga Sadow had a reason to label the blaster he took from the Deragons a "primitive weapon"?

Lastly: Instead of using a red-herring to draw attention away from the original point, you could at least attempt to counter it. Vong fleet in system X, Sith ship flies in and core of star comes flying at the Vong, Vong go down hard. Anything to contradict that idea?

::::Giant Facepalm::::

Thanks for ignoring the only point that was adressed at you. And now you can calm down. I didn't want to provoke you by pointing out your severe lack of knowledge once again. If you want to add anything to the debate, do it. Otherwise shut up. I'm not in the mood to deal with your pointless rants.

I'm sorry Nai, I got carried away by your inability to use actual facts in this debate. I realize that you're thrilled with Germany in the World Cup but that doesn't give you a pass to be totally clueless.

Edit: I wanted to humor myself by responding to some of your hilarious post. I didn't want to respond to the whole post because I know how quick and relentless you are with your House-esque sarcasm.

Sadow used his ship twice against enemies in close proximity to his own forces. Once to destroy his own meditation sphere, killing Gav Deragon in the process and another time to wipe out the ships following him during his escape to Yavin 4. In both cases, he did just trigger some massive solar flares in order to do the job. Yet that would still be enough to destroy an enemy fleet completely unaware of said weapon and - being "blind" in the force - without the ability to understand what was hitting them.

Conclusion: On the ground, the Sith Empire would be almost unbeatable as long as the illusions can be kept up - which shouldn't be a problem as the Meditation Sphere can be hidden at some remote location. In space battle, the Vong would have a better chance - but they are confronted with an enemy that capable of turning hundreds of ships in the Sith's navy into sun-system-killing superweapons. Imagine one faction of the SW Galaxy controlling 100 Sun Crushers...

Add the fact that the Sith Empire has a potentially unlimited amount of ground and space forces (droids / droid ships from the Star Forge), I really don't see how the Vong should be able to win this...

I'm going to take all the Vong have to offer in ground battle over the Massassi anyday.

That aside: Do you really want to suggest that the Sith didn't develop the idea to follow the Star Map that they had right in front of them for almost 2,000 years, especially when the must have had plenty of information about the Infinite Empire, given that Adas was kind enough to leave his holocron around? May I also point out that each of the Star Maps pointed straigth to Lehon before the Infinite Empire remotely sabotaged them, which means that every damn individual being alive on one of the planets with a Star Map knew the location of Lehon and, therefor, the Star Forge - including the original Sith people on Korriban.

***ownage this, sarcasm that, you got pwned, etc***

I was going to bring up Nai's point about Revan manufacturing Derriphan-class battleships via the Star Forge, meaning they couldn't have been technologically outdated even though the ships' design were more than a thousand years old. It took six Republic cruisers to destroy one of them, they were so heavily armored.

I can't decide whether Nai's reaching or not regarding the Ancient Sith having access to the Star Forge. If not, that seals the victory for Sadow's Empire...

Makes one wonder when, despite the Ancient Sith Empire's total and insurmountable uberness, populated with a hundred planets worth of Force-sensitive warriors, they managed to be defeated by the Old Republic and a numerically inferior Jedi Order. Makes you wonder how the Vong have any chance at all.

😐

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Makes one wonder when, despite the Ancient Sith Empire's total and insurmountable uberness, populated with a hundred planets worth of Force-sensitive warriors, they managed to be defeated by the Old Republic and a numerically inferior Jedi Order. Makes you wonder how the Vong have any chance at all.

😐

Not just any Jedi Order. A Jedi Order consisting of 3-4 Jedi and a neophyte. I mean with all of those unlimited ships, the graphics in FOTSE must have been shitty enough to be misleading. Once the illusions disappeared, there were hardly enough ships to be considered an "armada". But then again, why would you want to have unlimited ships if you can keep up the illusion of having unlimited ships?

Edit: Then again, it's entirely conceivable that it was Kressh that possessed all those "unlimited" ships and just wouldn't give them to Sadow🙂

Originally posted by Enyalus
I was going to bring up Nai's point about Revan manufacturing Derriphan-class battleships via the Star Forge, meaning they couldn't have been technologically outdated even though the ships' design were more than a thousand years old. It took six Republic cruisers to destroy one of them, they were so heavily armored.

I can't decide whether Nai's reaching or not regarding the Ancient Sith having access to the Star Forge. If not, that seals the victory for Sadow's Empire...

There's nothing conclusive about the Sith's ownership of the Star Forge beyond Pall's cryptic words. He could just have easily been referring to the Star Map itself and the Dark Side aura surrounding it (like that of the Star Forge). I'd also like to hear the exact quote that states that Revan and Malak found the Derriphan plans in the Star Forge or on Lehon.

The Derriphan ships themselves seem rather unimpressive when compared to Imperial+ era capital ships: It's 215 meters long, no shields, and boasts an impressive six "autolasers". Autolasers, according to Wookiee: "As with modern blaster cannons, the autoblaster produced a high-intensity particle beam that was propelled from the barrel at a target. However, unlike its modern equivalents, the autoblaster fired a salvo of wild bolts, powerful but not extremely accurate."

I'm far from impressed with that ship when compared to say, a Dreadnought-class heavy cruiser.

I'm far more impressed with the abilities and firepower of the Vong ships.

Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
I'm sorry Nai, I got carried away by your inability to use actual facts in this debate. I realize that you're thrilled with Germany in the World Cup but that doesn't give you a pass to be totally clueless.

I realize that you must be sad, because your boys went home. That doesn't give you a pass to be totally clueless.

Edit: I wanted to humor myself by responding to some of your hilarious post. I didn't want to respond to the whole post because I know how quick and relentless you are with your House-esque sarcasm.

Hello, Gideon. It's nice that you made a sock to talk to yourself. A little bit disappointing how you still can't win debates and still attempt to point to my "House-esque" sarcasm in order to gloss over that fact.

Great. So you're resting the entire Sith Empire's victory on one ability that the Vong will pick up on eventually, completely ignoring that for it to work against the Vong and NOT the Sith, Sadow's forces would have to place a considerable distance between himself and the supernova. But then we can include the numerous abilities the Vong possess that will devastate the Sith Empire. However, that would be too obvious.

I'm kind of astonished how you can quote what I've written down just to ignore it with your comment entirely. Sadow used the weapon twice while remaining in close proximity to his target. Facts > your suggestion that they need to be "far away".

Note also that I wrote "suicide attack". I thought the word "suicide" could give you a hint. Sacrificing one ship to take out an entire fleet is not exactly a great loss.

And the Vong are going to do what against the Ancient Sith? Toss moons around against opponents that can toss the cores of stars around. You maybe want to think about that scenario again...

I'm sure you know what a Non Sequitur is Nai, because how you got that conclusion is beyond and rational human being. Again, their "lolz supernova" plan is about ALL they have going for them, and that's assuming they have distance on their side. Even then, the sheer numbers of the Vong are completely staggering. Yea, I glanced over your really humorous "numbers" argument, completely ignoring the fact that they possessed a limited number of ships. I think I honestly stopped when you claimed the Sith Empire were in the possession of the Star Forge.

I'm sure you know what "glossing over inability to form an argument" means, DS, as you are an master of the art. Some facts for you:

- the Baanu Miir worldship held a total of 12,000 Vong. You would need 500,000 of them to contain the population of the Earth (one planet)
- even taking the Baanu Rass as example, one of the largest worldship, it held about the population of the first Death Star, resulting in about 1 million Vong. You'd still need 6000 of that ships to fit the population of one planet in.

So unless you're suggesting that the Vong's navy actually dwarved that of the Galactic Empire, which would be hilarious, I suppose you're pretty much wrong.

I'm going to take all the Vong have to offer in ground battle over the Massassi anyday.

I'm afraid. Uttering your personal opinion doesn't win debates. The Sith forces have Massassi Warriors, Priests, Sith Lords, elite warbots, slayer droids, sentries, Chrysalide, Sith war behemoths, Sith warbirds, Sith war rhinos, Sith war mountaineers, Sith war worms, and Silooth, coupled with illusions. The Vong have...

Also, this reminded me of lightsnake. When arguing a point where you have to reach to come to a conclusion, you start playing psychologist, asking me questions. I enjoy our debates Nai, I think you need to stop drinking.

I'm still not reaching, DS. And instead of your pitty attempts to insult me, you could try to come up with a single argument. Or counter one of mine. It's not funny to look at your posts and the first picture popping up in my mind is a turtle that lies on his shell, feets in the air, helpless. That isn't funny, man. It makes me sad. 🙁

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Makes one wonder when, despite the Ancient Sith Empire's total and insurmountable uberness, populated with a hundred planets worth of Force-sensitive warriors, they managed to be defeated by the Old Republic and a numerically inferior Jedi Order. Makes you wonder how the Vong have any chance at all.

😐

You mean just like the Galactic Empire wasn't able to overcome the Rebellion after the Emperor died, despite of having hundred or even thousand times more ships and possibly billions of troops?

The Ancient Sith Empire pretty much saw the loss of its entire governing body during the Great Hyperspace War. Most of Sadow's followers died in battle or were killed in the fleet battle back in Sith space. That faith was shared by Kressh and the Sith Lords loyal to him. That was the Ancient Sith Empire's "Battle of Endor" if you will...

And we don't know how the Jedi defeated the Sith. If they used the tactics they applied against Exar Kun (or the Sith used those that Kun himself did apply), I don't find it surprising that the Sith were taken down almost entirely...

The great thing about Star Wars is that the pithy ground forces that universe seems to boast make up for it in their space capabilities. For the Vong especially. They have no home planets to be secured for themselves. The Sith meantime have ONE HUNDRED worlds to defend. It's lucky for them that Sith illusions would terrify the Vong to the extent that they would refrain from bombarding the world from space. Besides, there's no way the Vong could obliterate the surface of ONE HUNDRED planets.

Originally posted by Borbarad
You mean just like the Galactic Empire wasn't able to overcome the Rebellion after the Emperor died, despite of having hundred or even thousand times more ships and possibly billions of troops?

Originally posted by Borbarad
The Ancient Sith Empire pretty much saw the loss of its entire governing body during the Great Hyperspace War. Most of Sadow's followers died in battle or were killed in the fleet battle back in Sith space. That faith was shared by Kressh and the Sith Lords loyal to him. That was the Ancient Sith Empire's "Battle of Endor" if you will...

Originally posted by Borbarad
And we don't know how the Jedi defeated the Sith. If they used the tactics they applied against Exar Kun (or the Sith used those that Kun himself did apply), I don't find it surprising that the Sith were taken down almost entirely...

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
The great thing about Star Wars is that the pithy ground forces that universe seems to boast make up for it in their space capabilities. For the Vong especially. They have no home planets to be secured for themselves. The Sith meantime have ONE HUNDRED worlds to defend. It's lucky for them that Sith illusions would terrify the Vong to the extent that they would refrain from bombarding the world from space. Besides, there's no way the Vong could obliterate the surface of ONE HUNDRED planets.

No. They have thousands of worldships flying their entire species through space. There is no way that the core of a star being tossed at them would have any considerable effect here, just like flying straight through a supernova.

And the Sith are known to be extreme carebears, that would defend each and every planet even if they had to sacrifice a tactical advantage. It's not that Naga Sadow "would sacrifice an entire star-system in order to ensure his own safety", as the narrator in the Fall of the Sith Empire seems to suggest.

Also the illusions can't be used to reproduce ships, as it just happens when the Sith attack the three worlds...

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I didn't know that the galactic Empire was involved here.

And that will surely not happen this time.

The Great Hyperspace War is full of subjective opinion and ambiguity you say?

I'm not sure if there's a point responding to Nai anymore. He'll type up anything, claim "lolz its an argument", and continue responding with half assed insults and poor attempts at sarcasm.

Oh and Nai, I'm not sad that my "boys" went home. Anything other than a First or Second Round for the Americans would be wishful thinking.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I didn't know that the galactic Empire was involved here.

I didn't know that this was an answer to what I've written. You wondered how that could have happened - I introduced a greater military force with less powerful enemies who lost in a similar fashion. I don't see people doubting the military strength of the Galactic Empire.

And that will surely not happen this time.

Of course: One of the Sith Lord discovers that he still loves one of the Vong's world ship, because he grew up there. And of course, he will be sad of losing his Vong-sister because of his actions. As a result, seeking redemption, he will first destroy the Meditation Sphere(s) of the Sith Empire and then lead the enemy forces straigth into the heart of the Sith Empire...

The Great Hyperspace War is full of subjective opinion and ambiguity you say?

No. What I say is that one shouldn't confuse 800 years of Sith hunting with "one battle".

Originally posted by Borbarad
No. They have thousands of worldships flying their entire species through space. There is no way that the core of a star being tossed at them would have any considerable effect here, just like flying straight through a supernova.

And the Sith are known to be extreme carebears, that would defend each and every planet even if they had to sacrifice a tactical advantage. It's not that Naga Sadow "would sacrifice an entire star-system in order to ensure his own safety", as the narrator in the Fall of the Sith Empire seems to suggest.

Also the illusions can't be used to reproduce ships, as it just happens when the Sith attack the three worlds...

And considering how this is the entire Yuuzhan Vong armada descending on only one hundred worlds (home and infrastructure of the Sith Empire), how many supernovas and obliterated Sith planets is it gonna take for him to declare victory?

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Out of curiosity (as I've never read the comics), why didn't Naga Sadow blow up every fleet he encountered via supernovae? Surely he wasn't some sort of space environmentalist.

And considering how this is the entire Yuuzhan Vong armada descending on only one hundred worlds (home and infrastructure of the Sith Empire), how many supernovas and obliterated Sith planets is it gonna take for him to declare victory?

You have a few hundred sith ships at best. And Naga Sadow didn't blow up every fleet he encountered because he was able to do his "supernova" only once, and he took a lot of his own ships down as he fled, making the strategy rather useless. You also have a large number of sith lords who have shown us absolutely nothing, so I'm still trying to figure out which of these "strategies" are going to work against the Vong. We can rule out force related feats as we haven't seen the sith lords of that time perform anything spectacular and they wouldn't be able to sense the Vong. We can rule out "lolz Supernova!" because that would work only under a very special circumstance. We can rule out the "unlimited"(LOL) number of ships in the sith empire, seeing as how that doesn't even come close to the true number(a few hundred), and we can rule out "LOLZ starforge" because there's no evidence of that.

I didn't know that this was an answer to what I've written. You wondered how that could have happened - I introduced a greater military force with less powerful enemies who lost in a similar fashion. I don't see people doubting the military strength of the Galactic Empire.

Similar fashion? lol.

Originally posted by Borbarad
I didn't know that this was an answer to what I've written. You wondered how that could have happened - I introduced a greater military force with less powerful enemies who lost in a similar fashion. I don't see people doubting the military strength of the Galactic Empire.

Originally posted by Borbarad
Of course: One of the Sith Lord discovers that he still loves one of the Vong's world ship, because he grew up there. And of course, he will be sad of losing his Vong-sister because of his actions. As a result, seeking redemption, he will first destroy the Meditation Sphere(s) of the Sith Empire and then lead the enemy forces straigth into the heart of the Sith Empire...

Originally posted by Borbarad
No. What I say is that one shouldn't confuse 800 years of Sith hunting with "one battle".