Star Wars vs. Wanted & Push

Nick Gant (Chris Evans' character in 'Push'😉
Victor Budarin (Neil Jackson's character in 'Push'😉
Sample clip of Victor and Nick - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZ7I-fIL2yU&feature=related

Fox ('Wanted'😉
Wesley ('Wanted'😉

-all four are armed with 2(each) matchmaster .45's http://www.imfdb.org/images/1/13/Wanted_21.JPG
-each starts with 2 reloads(each)

vs.

Obi Wan ('RotS'😉
Anakin ('RotS'😉

-both armed with their lightsaber.

_____________________________________________

-fight takes place where Yoda fought Palpatine in "RotS"
-there are ammo (not weapon, just ammo) caches evenly spaced in the arena
-the teams start out together, on opposite sides of the arena than there opponents
-arena - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inTbUf5Swfc

Can the Jedi take the others guns away and use them?

sure, why not... and the other's can take the jedi's lightsabers.

I think Jedi battle precog and force speed win in the end here. Been a while since I saw Push.

facepalm Obi Wan and Anakin slice and dice

I heard that "Jedi precog" ability thrown around as a fact early in the "Twilight vs Star Wars" thread, but that thread turned to shit so i didn't pay attention to see if it was explained... Where are you getting this from? To my understanding, that battle precog ability was something only 2 or 3 people could do. Any evidence that supports Anakin and Obi Wan can see attacks before they happen?

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
facepalm Obi Wan and Anakin slice and dice

Originally posted by marwash22
I heard that "Jedi precog" ability thrown around as a fact early in the "Twilight vs Star Wars" thread, but that thread turned to shit so i didn't pay attention to see if it was explained... Where are you getting this from? To my understanding, that battle precog ability was something only 2 or 3 people could do. Any evidence that supports Anakin and Obi Wan can see attacks before they happen?

ya think so? I was kinda thinking Jedi win, but I'm not so sure. There will be bullets flying from all kind angles, then there's the two dude's coming at them with tk force.

well since precog will alert them and guide them to avoid said bullets, i don't see a problem.. also Obi and Anakin can certainly deflect the bullets since they so easily deflected blaster bolts..

so i am thinking either slice and dice... or deflect bullets back to the Wanted and Push folks where they die

Nick and Victor toss them Jedi around like ragdolls.

And I almost forgot that Wesley has active control of his adrenaline abilities. So he can slow the jedi down to the point where he can really do some damage.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
I think Jedi battle precog and force speed win in the end here. Been a while since I saw Push.

yeah same, I haven't watched Push in a couple months

i understand how the force works, but you haven't proved that they have "battle precog", where they can predict where attacks are coming from. deflecting laser fire isn't "battle precog", it's reflexes. also, you can't deflect bullets with a lightsaber, if anything, the bullets would melt when they come in contact with the lightsaber... but there's no chance that Obi Wan and Anakin send the bullets back like they do to Droid fire.

Another thing, blaster fire travels in a straight line, Wanted bullets don't.

Obi Wan versus Zam Wessell. Anakin sensing danger in Padme's room. Battle precog. They sense danger, where and when it is forming, and where it will be coming from. It's more than just "good reflexes", dude.

No, Jedi cannot send lead bullets back to the shooter. Then again, the Wanted shooters have zero chance of hitting the Jedi if the Jedi use force speed.

THey didn't show any advanced combat speed aside from blocking blaster bolts.

Wesley however, can slow speed up his perception of time, making the Jedi seem extremely slow in comparison.

And like I said, the Movers can just toss them around like ragdolls. Hell, they're shield could probably take saber strikes.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Obi Wan versus Zam Wessell. Anakin sensing danger in Padme's room. Battle precog. They sense danger, where and when it is forming, and where it will be coming from. It's more than just "good reflexes", dude.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
Then again, the Wanted shooters have zero chance of hitting the Jedi if the Jedi use force speed.

Originally posted by marwash22
See, you keep saying that, but you're not proving it. I'm not even saying it's false 'cause I'm not the biggest Star Wars buff, but sensing danger is NOT "Battle Precog". You're making it seem as if they have the ability to pinpoint the location and angle of where an attack will come from. When they deflect/block droid fire, yes, the force is involved because it guides them and amps their reflexes, but if i sit 100 yards away with a sniper rifle, they do not have the ability to sense where the bullet is coming from. If they do, just show me.

How did Obi Wan know Zam was behind him, blaster drawn?

How did Anakin know there was pending danger in a room he wasn't even in?

How did Yoda sense the Clones behind him about to blast him?

How did Anakin know, when jumping from the speeder in AOTC, that Zam was passing beneath him?

Anakin "I can sense everything going on in that room."

Qui-Gon Jinn "He can see things before they happen. That's why he appears to have such quick reflexes. It's a Jedi trait."

There's your proof.

Uh, what about the other dudes?... ya know, the guys with TK? The Jedi are gonna fend off TK blasts and deflect bullets?

Been a while since I saw Push.

Wow. good thread, marwash22.

And, yes, RJ is right about battle precog. The best way to describe them is enhancing your senses with a 6th sense of reflex. It's like what Spiderman has except better: they can sense danger before it happens and actualy react to it. Of course, there are limits and the limit is more or less the speed of the attack.

A blaster bolt travels between 100-300 Mph. We have multiple frame by frame break downs on this. Between 100-300 is the average.

What is a bullet? John and I talked about this and we both concluded that a bullet should be able to be blocked by a Jedi, by their saber, just the same as a bolt. The speed of these bullets is about 1200feet per second or about 820 Mph. The round used is most likely the 9x19mm parabellum ball round (it's absurdly common...edit - but I reread the op and they are using the matchmaster...those are around 1000fps...so I'll amend if you guys want).

So we've got a "round" that travels between 2.7 and 8 times faster than almost all blaster bolts seen on screen. Can a Jedi react to a round that is 8 times faster than a most of the blaster bolts? Most likely. It's hard to say, really.

Can a Jedi react to a "round" that travels 2.7 times faster? Definitely.

Can a Jedi react to a 2 sources of bullets that travel 8 times faster than a blaster bolt? Definitely not. Even a Jedi master gets overwhelmed at those numbers (we see them actually get taken down, on screen.) Why do I conclude this?

Simple: one source of bullets means they have to react between 2-8 times faster.

Two sources of bullets means they have to react 4-16 times faster. It's like facing down 4-16 clone troopers and we know that between 4-16 troopers, all but the very very best Jedi went down very fast.

Now, the Wanted shooters are, by far, better gunmen than the clone troopers. Sure, the clone troopers are probably among the best because they are clones of Jango made better, but they do not have "superhuman" abilities when it comes to firing bullets.

Bending a bullet would DEFINITELY not matter to a Jedi as they are not going to use the battle precog to move their saber to the location that a straight shot will be but they will move it to the location the curved bullet will be (which isn't very far off, at all, as I showed in another thread with a diagram.)

Four gunners is definitely too much. The TK abilities of Nick and Vick are definitely better than the Jedi's...but "mass" moving? I'd have to watch the movie again because I want to give pure mass moving ability to the Jedi.

Well...I may have to amend because Obi Wan is legendary on his defensive abilities with a saber. He was NEVER hit with a blaster bolt in all 6 films...ever. We could say that no amount of gun fire would hurt him....lol!

But that'd be too unreasonable. He'd go down to gunfire, too.

What do you guys say? Agree or disagree with the gun fire to blaster bolt analogy? What is the limit? Etc.

After thinking about more, I think the combo of 2 'Wanted' shooters, plus the two Movers from 'Push' is too much. Even if the Jedi block every single bullet shot by Fox and Wesley, the Movers can "grab" and fling them with TK.... or take away there sabers.

Maybe, alter the thread to make it...

Wesley and Victor vs. Anakin and Obi Wan?

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as far as the bullets are concerned, yeah, i definitely think a Jedi can block bullets, but maybe not from 8 different sources.

If they have knowledge of each other, the Jedi go force speed (they covered at least 200 feet in one second in TPM), four quick decaps, end of story. Besides, pushers being force choked= Shit filled undies. The shooters? Force pull their guns away. Easy cheesy.

This really comes down to the Jedi versus the pushers. They both have TK, but the Jedi have battle precog, lightsabers and force speed.

another alternative is that anakin can force crush all of their skulls at the same time like how he nigh instantaneously crushed all the droids and metal in his recovery room at the end of rots

That was a Vader feat.

Originally posted by Rogue Jedi
If they have knowledge of each other, the Jedi go force speed (they covered at least 200 feet in one second in TPM), four quick decaps, end of story. Besides, pushers being force choked= Shit filled undies. The shooters? Force pull their guns away. Easy cheesy.

This really comes down to the Jedi versus the pushers. They both have TK, but the Jedi have battle precog, lightsabers and force speed.

Don't try and use that speed feat here RJ. You and everybody knows that they only went that fast running away from the droidekas, they were never shown using that speed in combat....if they had, all those Jedi wouldn't have been killed during Order 66 would they?

Anakin never used Force Choke in battle, he only used it on Padme. Besides, even if he could use it in battle, he couldn't focus enough with four people shooting at him, Wesley and Fox moving so fast he couldn't touch them, and Nick/Victor blasting them and tossing them around. On top of that, the TK shields may stand up to a saber strike.

Has a Jedi ever Force pulled a blaster from anybody in all 6 of the movies? That's a real question, I can't remember.

And while the Jedi have precog and lightsabers, how can they react to the Mover's level of TK, which was pretty damn amazing.