Don't ask, don't tell (DADT).

I fully support DADT. With it removed, its only a matter of time before someone, either straight or a homosexual, will cause a problem that cant be ignored.
It may be wrong of the antagonist to think the way they do about the other, but it is amazingly foolish to think that everyone is going to have a peaceful mentality about it.

As for the "issues should be brought to the surface and dealt with" argument, that may have some truth to it, but don't expect to handle these kinds of issues without some collateral damage.

Originally posted by LLLLLink
I fully support DADT. With it removed, its only a matter of time before someone, either straight or a homosexual, will cause a problem that cant be ignored.
It may be wrong of the antagonist to think the way they do about the other, but it is amazingly foolish to think that everyone is going to have a peaceful mentality about it.

As for the "issues should be brought to the surface and dealt with" argument, that may have some truth to it, but don't expect to handle these kinds of issues without some collateral damage.

Originally posted by Kinneary
That line of thinking is the same line of thinking that people used to endorse 'separate but equal.' Obviously there is still racial tension, but deciding not to give equal rights to a segment of the population because of something they cannot control is ridiculous. Backward, regressive logic.

Are you saying that I believe that way, or are you merely builiding off my comment? 😬

Originally posted by Peach
1. You have not given any legitimate reasons.

2. Women can and do serve in active combat.

3. Your personal misogynistic issues are off-topic.

I have before. And believe me I know it was risky.

However, as has been pointed out, two guys (even if one is gay) sharing a room is not even close to being the same as a guy and a woman sharing a room.

Women are not allowed to serve in the INFANTRY..be it Marines or Army. In the Army...all 11B's(Infantry) are trained at Ft. Benning...a male ONLY Basic Training Station. Women CAN serve in combat RELATED fields...security detail, for one. However, they can not classify as Infantry in any of the Army's 11 series MOS's.

Also, if you've never served...then, you don't know how things like homosexuality affect the morale of the troops. Homosexuality still isn't acceted by the majority of the U.S. population...especially among most young male soldiers...who tell dirty jokes(many gay one's at that). If open homosexuals were housed together with straight men, too many disciplinary problems would result. The gay men would be harrassed beyond reason, and it isn't rational to court-martial or give non-judiciary Article 15's to an entire platoon, company, or half a damn battallion, for that matter.

As a man who served, I agree with Don't ask, don't tell. It would create too many problems in the Armed Forces.

give her one, oorah!!!

or is it hooyah for you?
😎

some ppl dont want to look at the logistical nightmare they just want to toss their opinion and make it true and call everyone else names.

most ppl cant grasp the military concept of equal application of the rules and no favoritism which is why the dont ask dont tell saves a lot of headaches.

and your right on the button of a bunch of young kids and the gay jokes which is only half of the jokes..
as one vet to another i shake your hand.. b/c i dont salute unless i know you are just lazy and sit behind a desk..

Until majority of population accepts homosexuality, there will always be clashes especially within armed forces.

I think a collective mind frame needs to change, not only few individuals at the top.

see a lot of ppl think the population social standard mirrors the military ethics and sadly it does not nor should it.

military reqs are strict for a reason to make you better then a civilian.

come tomorrow if marijuana was legal it would still not be allowed in the military and i am fine with it b/c the standards are different.

some of the reqs have bn around for as long as the marine corps itself.. we live by those codes to honor our marine corps not the other way around where we choice which ones to take out b/c we dont agree.

if the day comes that gays can openly serve they will have to change the rooming situation and if they can do that i am fine if not then it shouldnt be allowed.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars

As a man who served, I agree with Don't ask, don't tell. It would create too many problems in the Armed Forces.

I 2nd that.

Originally posted by King Castle
military reqs are strict for a reason to make you better then a civilian.

I'm sure you didn't mean that to be homophobic but... wow, that was insanely homophobic.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
The gay men would be harrassed beyond reason, and it isn't rational to court-martial or give non-judiciary Article 15's to an entire platoon, company, or half a damn battallion, for that matter.

There must be ways to deal with harassment other than expulsion.

For goodness sake we can overcome the taboo against killing but we can't break a person down until he stops harassing people?

nah in the military we refer to civilians regularly as nasty, garbage or sh$# bags regardless of sexual orientation but, overall its mainly attitude and standards.

anyways not everyone is broken into killing most want to get some when they join... also i wasnt broken i just played along that way i didnt get singled out. i was smart. 😖mart:

but i like to think i was a very tolerant man and even i made homosexual jokes in my 1st year in plus i also picked on the nancy marines who didnt act like a marine is suppose to. actually after a while it wasnt picking it was correcting all these soft spoken marines who i had a suspicion might be homosexual.

also military discipline is very strict few options but after a while it would be expulson or briq time after losing rank.. there really arent second chances in the military other then very special occasions. zero tolerance

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I'm sure you didn't mean that to be homophobic but... wow, that was insanely homophobic.

There must be ways to deal with harassment other than expulsion.

For goodness sake we can overcome the taboo against killing but we can't break a person down until he stops harassing people?

It's not just a problem with the lower ranks of the military. High ranking NCO's and CO's look negatively at homosexuality and do contribute to the problem. I know countless E-7's and higher that would give hell to an openly gay soldier. Drill Sergeants, Instructors, etc...lol...all I need to say is take a look at Gunny Sgt. Hartman in Full Metal Jacket. His attitude still mirrors what DS's and DI's do today. Trust me, they would make an openly gay recruit want to go AWOL.

Our culture still has to change dramatically for homosexuality to be acceptable in the Armed Forces. We still have a long way to go. Look how long it took African Americans to gain Civil Rights. We had to go through a Civil War, Reconstruction, Jim Crow Laws, and a Civil Right's movement to get where we are today..and there are still many people who still advocate "separate" but "equal" when discussing black/white issues. The Gay Rights movement hasn't had nearly as much time to mature..and, in my opinion, it will take much longer because of our Christian culture..and the viewpoint of homosexuality as a sin.

In sum, right now..in today's Armed Forces..a homosexual will not be given a fair chance, and the persecution he/she will receive will be horrible. It would even be horrible to allow them to be put in that situation.

we had one staff Sgt that was accused of being gay and that wasnt very cool for him... he opted for legal admin and lawyers.. after that whether he was gay or not which i would have pegged him for a yes his life wasnt the same with the accusing eyes and whatnot.

Originally posted by King Castle
we had one staff Sgt that was accused of being gay and that wasnt very cool for him... he opted for legal admin and lawyers.. after that whether he was gay or not which i would have pegged him for a yes his life wasnt the same with the accusing eyes and whatnot.

I would imagine not..lol

i was all why did it have to be a hispanic? and started thinking about my friend making gay jokes about hispanics..facepalm

i was all why couldnt it have bn a white guy or an asian maybe even blk always a hispanic..

also him wanting to teach MA and wrestle aka grapple started to make more sense after the accusation.

YouTube video in his defense he was married to a hot chick but ppl had bn sayin he did it for the money and to cover up his homosexuality

Originally posted by LLLLLink
With it removed, its only a matter of time before someone, either straight or a homosexual, will cause a problem that cant be ignored.

That already happens with DADT in place: gays are beaten or abused and straights and closet gays are the ones doing it.

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Until majority of population accepts homosexuality, there will always be clashes especially within armed forces.

I think a collective mind frame needs to change, not only few individuals at the top.

Yup. I'd say that pretty much captures the entire thread's answer.

I'd take it a step further and say that the "change" must come from the military and the population, both, before any progress can be made.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
In sum, right now..in today's Armed Forces..a homosexual will not be given a fair chance, and the persecution he/she will receive will be horrible. It would even be horrible to allow them to be put in that situation.

Originally posted by dadudemon
That already happens with DADT in place: gays are beaten or abused and straights and closet gays are the ones doing it.

Yup. I'd say that pretty much captures the entire thread's answer.

I'd take it a step further and say that the "change" must come from the military and the population, both, before any progress can be made.

Yes, I agree. But we must remember that USA is a huge country, with many different people and many with different opinions and such change will not happen without a shit storm.

Perhaps education? But as I understand some parents may not want their children to be talked to about homosexuality. It's just one of those social things that may, actually, take time.

Gradualism just doesn't work. All the top people in the civil rights movement recognized this and understood that changes had to happen NOW, or they never would.

I support DADT

Originally posted by majid86
I support DADT