Originally posted by StoicDidn't weakened Firelord one shot Ravenous, and destroy a shit ton of ships?
Wow I stopped reading Thor for a bit, I never knew he lost it. Even so, Firelord has lost cred with me, I think Annihilation cinched it for me, when a horde of thugs nearly tore him to pieces. Your points are noted, and valid.
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Actually, you're deflecting from the looming truth that there are perfectly valid explanations for what you thought was clear evidence in order to cover up the deficiencies of your overall assessment, e.g., Blood and Thunder was about the crisis of Thor being amped... twice, once off-panel, once on-panel, BRB has the single most PIS-filled feat in the arc or enjoyed a secret super off-panel amp, 20+ issues of nobody mentioning this amp = editorial mistake.He called them "pathetic." He also called BRB a "pale imitation" . . . right before BRB hit him four times and laid Thor out.
Fixed.
Which is a massive difference than what he said about Surfer's blast before(when we know for a fact Thor wasn't amped), true or false?
Yeah he got amped by Loki, but since he was only at a fraction of his true power before he was amped and had just gotten the better of Loki...
Originally posted by Stoic
Wow I stopped reading Thor for a bit, I never knew he lost it. Even so, Firelord has lost cred with me, I think Annihilation cinched it for me, when a horde of thugs nearly tore him to pieces. Your points are noted, and valid.
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
You have to open up your download folder?
No lol, I have the actual comic, but I can't find it. Anyways I forget who cleared the space pirates off of Firelord, but he was clearly about to be mangled. I can't see this happening to Thor, not when he was able to lift the equivalent of a planet, or tear through a Celestial's armor. Plus I don't have a scanner to put the books on my pc with me here.
Originally posted by darthgooberProviding a completely plausible and reasonable explanation for their comments is just that. Pointing out how nobody else throughout 20+ issues even comes close to saying anything of the sort throws doubt at your stance. Pointing out how no serious reader ever holds "Spiderman drawing strength from his peerless courage" as if it were an off-panel amp also throws doubt at your stance. Pointing out that BRB necessarily (i) enjoyed an even greater off-panel secret amp to topple Thor because Thor was amped, or (ii) was an even GREATER instance of PIS than Thor beating up Surfer and Warlock that nobody ever b1tches about, ALSO throws doubt at your stance.
I still do think it's clear evidence, you just happen to disagree. You're trying to throw doubt on my stance by saying that if Thor was amped there was crappy writing involved, but you're attempts fall short because if Thor WASN'T amped then there was even more crappy writing involved. You just happen to think that it's worse for BRB to be in possession of the single most PIS filled feat than it is for Thor to.
The fact that nobody b1tches about BRB's feat as being even more incomprehensible without assuming ampage is telling. And projecting your own dissatisfaction of Surfer/Warlock's beatdown onto me doesn't change that it only becomes a ridiculous super-amped/uber-PIS moment for Beta Ray Bill ONLY if you assume Thor was amped in the first place. If you don't assume that, it's completely within BRB's power to do so.
Originally posted by darthgooberCalling BRB a "pale imitation" is also a massive difference to what Thor has stated of BRB before as being his equal. True or false? Did that statement stop BRB from toppling him in seconds? No. So was Thor unfortunately talking out of his ass? Yes. Can insane and unhinged superheroes talk out of their ass? Yes. So what did you find so damningly probative about Thor's "pathetic" comment again? Hell if I know.
Which is a massive difference than what he said about Surfer's blast before(when we know for a fact Thor wasn't amped), true or false?Yeah he got amped by Loki, but since he was only at a fraction of his true power before he was amped and had just gotten the better of Loki...
Right. A fraction. And matching Loki's power beforehand, who isn't far off from Thor's own immortal power proves exactly what now? Nice attempt at trying to arbitrarily quantify Surfer's relative strength to Thor for the sake of deflecting from the descension into absurdity that your "Thor-was-amped-off-panel-during-B&T" myth necessitates, i.e., "BRB-was-amped-off-panel-even-more-at-one-point-during-B&T."
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
So the whole premise is him being irreparably insane and that means he didn't do anything under his own power? What premise does this rely on? That you can't be insane and do feats under your own power? Is that what you're trying to imply?Clearly, this makes perfect sense. 👆
Thor can't consciously function as he did in Blood & Thunder, unless you believe it's normal for him to have sex with figments of his insane mind and have said figment convince him to go on a murderous rampage and depose Odin. That arc was about Thor malfunctioning due to the years of manipulation of his mind and soul by Odin and the resulting insanity causing Thor to act out of norm. Said insanity was so severe that Odin had to enter Thor's mindscape and repair the damage himself, and while there, do battle with the embodiment of Thor's madness taking on form (Valkyrie).
All of these factors and all of the subsequent ramifications can all be accomplished by Thor consciously and of his own will when he deems it necessary? He can tamper with his own soul for years and do irreparable damage to his mind and soul to the point where his insanity takes on corporeal form at will?
Originally posted by illadelph12you're just saying thor is insane...which is acknowledged
Thor can't consciously function as he did in Blood & Thunder, unless you believe it's normal for him to have sex with figments of his insane mind and have said figment convince him to go on a murderous rampage and depose Odin. That arc was about Thor malfunctioning due to the years of manipulation of his mind and soul by Odin and the resulting insanity causing Thor to act out of norm. Said insanity was so severe that Odin had to enter Thor's mindscape and repair the damage himself, and while there, do battle with the embodiment of Thor's madness taking on form (Valkyrie).All of these factors and all of the subsequent ramifications can all be accomplished by Thor consciously and of his own will when he deems it necessary? He can tamper with his own soul for years and do irreparable damage to his mind and soul to the point where his insanity takes on corporeal form at will?
you're not really showing that thor gained any new powers or amps as a result of that madness
^ Correct f@cking answer. Thank you. 👆
Originally posted by illadelph12And?
Thor can't consciously function as he did in Blood & Thunder, unless you believe it's normal for him to have sex with figments of his insane mind and have said figment convince him to go on a murderous rampage and depose Odin. That arc was about Thor malfunctioning due to the years of manipulation of his mind and soul by Odin and the resulting insanity causing Thor to act out of norm. Said insanity was so severe that Odin had to enter Thor's mindscape and repair the damage himself, and while there, do battle with the embodiment of Thor's madness taking on form (Valkyrie).All of these factors and all of the subsequent ramifications can all be accomplished by Thor consciously and of his own will when he deems it necessary? He can tamper with his own soul for years and do irreparable damage to his mind and soul to the point where his insanity takes on corporeal form at will?
And Thor requires his mind to be completely f@cked to completely draw forth his might in a vicious onslaught against his foes?
Guess Thor must have figured out how to unlock this awesome mind-f@cked insanity power amp against Mangog when he killed him. Ooh! He must have also unlocked this awesome mind-f@cked insanity power amp when he took down Durok!! I love this theory! It's not completely arbitrary at all!
I'm simply saying that the events of Blood & Thunder can't be reproduced because there are additional factors which can't be ignored. That wasn't mere insanity, which was the premise of the arc and reason for Odin's intervention. In my opinion there's no reason to believe that Thor could accomplish those same feats outside of the extraordinary circumstances of that scenario. The manipulations of his soul had, in my opinion, obvious effects on his behavior and abilities. Effects I don't believe he can spontaneously replicate.
^ Anti-Surfer aura. Just like Drax's anti-Thanos aura. Clearly. You can only see this aura in-between panels though. Author and artist thought it would be so plain to see they didn't bother wasting page space.
uhuh
Originally posted by illadelph12Nobody argues that this Thor was completely vicious and blood-lusted. But stop trying to take the obviousness of that premise and confuse it with a power-amp. Because you're still making a Super Mario-worthy jump from Thor's soul was in torment -------> Thor enjoyed an off-panel power amp that isn't mentioned through 20+ issues.
I'm simply saying that the events of Blood & Thunder can't be reproduced because there are additional factors which can't be ignored. That wasn't mere insanity, which was the premise of the arc and reason for Odin's intervention. In my opinion there's no reason to believe that Thor could accomplish those same feats outside of the extraordinary circumstances of that scenario. The manipulations of his soul had, in my opinion, obvious effects on his behavior and abilities. Effects I don't believe he can spontaneously replicate.
And, like darthgoober, you're arbitrarily ignoring the absurdity that ensues once you lock in that position that cannot be avoided: a hurt, beat up BRB must have enjoyed a SUPER off-panel amp to lay out this ambiguously amped Thor.
Awesome.
Originally posted by illadelph12IMO thats not correct before Thor received the gem during this time Thor insanity was not amping but more letting go all out. We have seen Thor a few numbers of time cut-loose and destroy his enemies when he reaches that point. When Thor killed hulk and thing, Thor going into the warrior maddness over Sif. When he fough magnog, Thor is fully capable of repeating the same level when he is push hard enough. Durok for example and many many others.
I'm simply saying that the events of Blood & Thunder can't be reproduced because there are additional factors which can't be ignored. That wasn't mere insanity, which was the premise of the arc and reason for Odin's intervention. In my opinion there's no reason to believe that Thor could accomplish those same feats outside of the extraordinary circumstances of that scenario. The manipulations of his soul had, in my opinion, obvious effects on his behavior and abilities. Effects I don't believe he can spontaneously replicate.