Originally posted by Eminence
Take note of how terrifying he is in this picture.And by "series" I hope you aren't including Tartakovsky's Clone Wars. He was a demon in that, perhaps excessively so on the physical front but a truly threatening presence nonetheless.
Also, an awesome Darth Vader.
He's moar intimidating in his introduction in the novel than anywhere, ever. But those are cool pictures.
ESB is a great movie.
I accept the definition that "in the zone" Anakin is tapping his full potential. This makes his victory seem much more believable than a Makashi master simply being batted around. If Anakin's welling with the Force, he's probably harder to predict as well, so it makes his subtle maneuver that much more believable. Of course, you can't get any of this from the movie version, which is frustrating. And GL is hardly consistant in anything... Han shot first
But I still intend to point out that Anakin tapping his full potential is rare and almost entirely plot-driven in some cases. I remember in Jedi Trial he breaks loose and does a Force attack which is almost KotOR in scope. I wish I could remember details, but it's extremely difficult to want to re-read that book.
Without buffing himself with OMFG FUrce powah, I don't see Anakin typically overpowering Dooku with the Force.
Originally posted by DARTH POWERUndoubtedly. Why? Because Anakin easily beat Dooku, who easily beat Kenobi. Anakin >> Dooku >> Kenobi. This is a very rare case where ABC logic is correct.
The ease Dooku bested Obi-Wan with shows Dooku could probably have defeated 2 ROTS Kenobi's, without a scratch to show for it. Could you really say the same about ROTS Anakin??
Remember, it's not like Anakin bested Dooku by dumb luck. He won because he began tapping the "nuclear furnace" of force energy at his disposal - and with that degree of power combined with the degree of mental clarity Anakin had at the time, there is really no one who could have stopped him. Tbh, it's hard to imagine any other character throughout SW mythos (sans the ridiculousness of NJO Luke, and the like) trouncing Dooku as effortlessly as Anakin did. /shrug
Exactly. Dooku is one of the most powerful all-around characters to have ever graced SW continuity. So for Anakin to beat him at all, let alone as easily as he did, shows us how ridiculously powerful he [Anakin] was at the time. Imo, you could have put 2 Dookus' (Dooki?) in front of him, and he would have steamrolled them both just the same. The kid was just on a completely different level.
Again, the mental turmoil Anakin/Vader was going through at the time (ie. slaying numerous former Jedi colleagues, fighting his former master/best friend, feeling as though he was losing Padme, etc.) is why he was barely able to stalemate Kenobi. The film and novel depicted that much quite poetically, imo.
However, based on his previous battle with Dooku, we know that Anakin was capable of tooling guys VASTLY superior to Kenobi... When he wasn't letting his inner demons control him, that is.
Originally posted by truejediWe mentioned this before: Anakin only had one battle during RotS - and in that battle he showed us what he was capable of (trouncing Dooku is no small feat.) Once he adopted the guise of Darth Vader, however, his inner conflicts essentially neutered his power.... Made him unable to tap his full potential.
which was literally always except for a few seconds against dooku... that's like saying Luke can TK the galaxy at any given time...
Had Vader been able to enter "t3h z0n3" on Mustafar, he would have treated Kenobi like a Padawan.
Originally posted by Galan007
We mentioned this before: Anakin only had one battle during RotS - and in that battle he showed us what he was capable of (trouncing Dooku is no small feat.) Once he adopted the guise of Darth Vader, however, his inner conflicts essentially neutered his power.... Made him unable to tap his full potential.
I am thinking the time has come to re-consider the term RotS Anakin.
I mean, isn’t actually RotS Anakin = ZoN3 Anakin.
Anakin fights only once when he’s a lightsider, …and then we have Vader. Seems natural that the only fight Anakin has in RotS is a fight that RotS Anakin enters, no matter if in the ZoN3 state.
No more RotS Anakin vs. ZonE Anakin?
I think we should keep the distinction. "RotS" Light-side Anakin was being easily handled by Dooku. "RotS" Angry-Anakin was giving Dooku trouble. "Z0n3" Anakin is clear-headed and obliterated Dooku. And Vader is a hot-headed powerhouse.
Only two are ever worth mentioning (Z0n3 and Vader), but those other two still occurred. And since "Jedi" Anakin is what exists throughout the Clone Wars (for the most part), we can't very well write him off.
Originally posted by Galan007
Exactly. Dooku is one of the most powerful all-around characters to have ever graced SW continuity. So for Anakin to beat him at all, let alone as easily as he did, shows us how ridiculously powerful he [Anakin] was at the time. Imo, you could have put 2 Dookus' (Dooki?) in front of him, and he would have steamrolled them both just the same. The kid was just on a completely different level.
I used to think this too. But it's kind of contradicted by Lucas's statement "you have to be either mace or yoda to compete with the emporer"..
Also we never saw ROTS Anakin at any point Light or Dark, Uber or not, defend himself against a Force attack of the type Dooku is capable of unleashing. So there isnt actually any evidence he could defend against it.
Whilst we do know Dark Side Anakin could not overpower Obi-Wan in the Force, and Jedi Anakin got Force choked by Ventress
Originally posted by truejediThat wouldn't be RotS Anakin, that would be TCW Anakin. Remember, RotS Anakin is a very specific 'version' of the character.
except we have all of the CWC material to consider when discussing ROTS anakin as well... it isn't like we look at the fight with dooku in a vacuum.
Originally posted by DARTH POWEROkay? I didn't say Dooku was "the" most powerful force user throughout the mythos, I said he was "one of" the most powerful. Big difference.
I used to think this too. But it's kind of contradicted by Lucas's statement "you have to be either mace or yoda to compete with the emporer"..Also we never saw ROTS Anakin at any point Light or Dark, Uber or not, defend himself against a Force attack of the type Dooku is capable of unleashing. So there isnt actually any evidence he could defend against it.
As was mentioned before: the novelization made it pretty clear that Dooku's power was, essentially, rendered useless against the "nuclear furnace" of force energy that was Anakin. Had Dooku felt that using his offensive force powers against Anakin would have turned the tide (assuming he would have gotten the chance to use said powers, of course) he surely would have attempted to do so... Instead of, you know, dying.
Originally posted by Galan007
Okay? I didn't say Dooku was "the" most powerful force user throughout the mythos, I said he was "one of" the most powerful. Big difference.As was mentioned before: the novelization made it pretty clear that Dooku's power was, essentially, rendered useless against the "nuclear furnace" of force energy that was Anakin.
Yes but you must admit anyone that can make Count Dooku's power rendered useless should be capable of competing with Sidious right??
Originally posted by Galan007
Had Dooku felt that using his offensive force powers against Anakin would have turned the tide (assuming he would have gotten the chance to use said powers, of course) he surely would have attempted to do so... Instead of, you know, dying.
You see thats my point, did he even get a chance to use his Force powers offensively against Anakin??
Dooku was busy disposing of Obi-Wan, and as soon as he was finished Skywalker was all over him with his blade.. At least that seemed to be the case as in the movie.
Even when the novel states Dooku's knowledge of the Force is useless, it could be because Dooku was not getting a chance anymore at this point in the fight to use his superior command of the Force.
Originally posted by DARTH POWER
Yes but you must admit anyone that can make Count Dooku's power rendered useless should be capable of competing with Sidious right??You see thats my point, did he even get a chance to use his Force powers offensively against Anakin??
Dooku was busy disposing of Obi-Wan, and as soon as he was finished Skywalker was all over him with his blade.. At least that seemed to be the case as in the movie.
Even when the novel states Dooku's knowledge of the Force is useless, it could be because Dooku was not getting a chance anymore at this point in the fight to use his superior command of the Force.
So far as the novel is concerned, I think this stamenet was made after Anakin had approached zone status, and therefore after a very prolonged duel in which Dooku had consumed most of his Force reserve. Remember Dooku decided well into the battle that he had had enough playing around, and decided to turn it up several notches. Dooku had probably burned much of his reserve by this time, not expecting such a surge in power by Anakin. Had Dooku decided to go all-out from the get-go, then perhaps we would have had a different outcome. Remember I mean this within the context of the novel, not the movie.
Anyway, I don't have a great deal of time to formulate much of a response to anything as it is beautiful outside today, and I'm about to fire up the grill then hit the swimming pool. You ppl need to take advantage of the weather too. Barbeque chicken Get in mah belly!!!!!!!!