There will always be inconsistencies in showings of comic book characters. Posters who seek to discredit a character at all costs use these showings to their advatage. They reverse this method when attempting to support characters they favor.besides that they speend half their time throwing around personal accusations to opposing debaters.they have simply discovered that one can "interpret" things as they please and be as ridiculously skeptical as they wish. There is absolutely no way to argue with such a poster. So i wont.
Originally posted by namorsubby
Slade has smacked around nightwing with ridiculous ease. He has taken a hail of his blows willfully and backhanded him to the floor. Nightwing has admitted that slade could kill him with ease. Slade has said the same thing. NW once paid slade to leave a target alone because he knew he couldnt stop him. This is a perfect example of what posters like you do. You rather cite what you want as if it doesnt grossly contradict an established norm.
Of course Slade could kill Nightwing with ease. He has class 2 strength, one clean hit and fight is over and if it isn't over the damage has a given himself a nearly insurmountable advantage. That is essentially the entire reason why Nightwing opted to pay Deathstroke off, because he was already injured from the initial skirmish where Stroke shot him in the shoulder while he was trying to protect a fellow officer. He landed one clean blow in that fight and Dick was lights out, so he came back with cash the next time. But that doesn't change the fact that in instances where Dick instigated the fight on his own terms he has been able to completely overwhelm Slade - if only briefly - with his skill, speed and agility, and that doesn't bode well when you are legitimately trying to make the case that Slade is faster than Captain America.
But the reality of it is Slade simply outclasses nightwing in the majority of their encounters. Slade knows it. Dick knows it.......and so do you, but youd rather cite low showings because they are more beneficial to nyour arguement. Nw is not even a match for a serious slade, period.
Dick has already said slade is faster.
Originally posted by namorsubby
But the reality of it is Slade simply outclasses nightwing in the majority of their encounters. Slade knows it. Dick knows it.......and so do you, but youd rather cite low showings because they are more beneficial to nyour arguement. Nw is not even a match for a serious slade, period.Dick has already said slade is faster.
And the majority of those showings where Slade outclasses Nightwing are virtually irrelevant. They are Dick as Robin, or Dick in the his early days of Nightwing in his high collar baby blue and gold suit. There has been so much character development and improvement since then that he was practically a different character even before BFTC, after BFTC they aren't even worth mention in the same sentence. The last five arcs where they've fought one on one (with the exception of when Dick was shoot that was previously mentioned) Dick has held his own in melee. Am I supposed to ignore the more current and relevant examples and pretend that Deathstroke handing Dick his ponytail in the early 90s matters even slightly in regards to anything approaching modern Nightwing?
So slade hasnt outclassed dick in modern times? Lol you cant ackowledge anything opposite to your utterly illogical arguement. When dick paid him he was getting owned. Even in slades lower showings dick admitted his stats including speed were superior. Theres simply no reason to argue with someone who cant even acknowledge that slade is superior to nw in every physical stat despite 99.9% of evidence opposing their stance. Please stop grasping and ignoring the established consistent potrayal in comics. What evidence is their to suggest that dick has physically improved in speed? None. Hes always had about as much speed and agility as a peak human can......improving is basically not even an option. But nonetheless youll stick to this virtually baseless argument because you simply wish to discredit slade even when you know he has an advantage as shown in the majority of showings.
Originally posted by namorsubby
So slade hasnt outclassed dick in modern times? Lol you cant ackowledge anything opposite to your utterly illogical arguement. When dick paid him he was getting owned. Even in slades lower showings dick admitted his stats including speed were superior. Theres simply no reason to argue with someone who cant even acknowledge that slade is superior to nw in every physical stat despite 99.9% of evidence opposing their stance. Please stop grasping and ignoring the established consistent potrayal in comics. What evidence is their to suggest that dick has physically improved in speed? None. Hes always had about as much speed and agility as a peak human can......improving is basically not even an option. But nonetheless youll stick to this virtually baseless argument because you simply wish to discredit slade even when you know he has an advantage as shown in the majority of showings.
When Dick paid Slade off he was at a decided disadvantage, he a fresh bullet wound in his shoulder, he was hardly operating at optimal efficiency. The fact remains, virtually every single time they have fought in the past decade Dick has held his own (and in some cases had the advantage). Hell, Dick has even legitimately blitzed Slade, something which Deathstroke has never replicated. Slade constantly has trouble beating street level human mas, too much trouble to support a stance where he could conceivably take the majority against Captain America.
The moment Nightwing's speed and agility became arguably peak human was the start of his solo title when Dixon and McDaniel got control of the character... which is around the same time Dick started giving Slade as good as he got. Late 90s. The idea that his speed had plateaued in the late 80s early 90s is pretty absurd.
Show me has nw speed has increased since he became nightwing or cease your nonsense. And i mean show me, with feats.
you know good in well that extinuating circumstances almsot always contribute to slade "having trouble" with these characters. Like usually slade not even being interested in fighting them and being focused on completing a misson. He straight up owns them when actually attempting to 99% of the time but you act as if you dont see that....hell, hes even casually owned them....and people at a higher level than nightwing at that. Youll use any inconsistency or lowshowing to discredit slade and try to pass it off as the norm. Slade is faster than nw, batman, and other peak humans because he has been displayed as such in the majority of those showings and specifically stated so even by them. He also has better speed feats.....which of course youll just discount even though hes been performing these type of feats since day 1. You use low showings and not consistent ones. You make silly excuses for why you use those low showins.....excuses that you undoubtedly cant back up with actual evidence.
Originally posted by namorsubby
Show me has nw speed has increased since he became nightwing or cease your nonsense. And i mean show me, with feats.you know good in well that extinuating circumstances almsot always contribute to slade "having trouble" with these characters. Like usually slade not even being interested in fighting them and being focused on completing a misson. He straight up owns them when actually attempting to 99% of the time but you act as if you dont see that....hell, hes even casually owned them....and people at a higher level than nightwing at that. Youll use any inconsistency or lowshowing to discredit slade and try to pass it off as the norm. Slade is faster than nw, batman, and other peak humans because he has been displayed as such in the majority of those showings and specifically stated so even by them. He also has better speed feats.....which of course youll just discount even though hes been performing these type of feats since day 1. You use low showings and not consistent ones. You make silly excuses for why you use those low showins.....excuses that you undoubtedly cant back up with actual evidence.
Show me an example of Nightwing matching the absurd agility and speed feats he started having when McDaniel took on the art. He basically became Millar's Daredevil over night, I mean, Chuck Dixon even said that was his intention. Little to nothing prior to that moment would have support Dick being able to operate on those levels. Half a decade ago Dick literally couldn't even lay a finger on Batman or Cassandra Cain in h2h, during Battle for the Cowl he went shot for shot with Cass. I really don't see how you could argue he hasn't gotten faster since he first became Nightwing, he has improved markedly in every conceivable way.
Dick has never shown the ability to beat Deathstroke in a fight. Even sans healing factor, Slade's enhanced durability would make it extremely difficult that some like Dick (or even Bruce) could get a ko in a h2h fight before they themselves were put down. But I'm not arguing that Dick can beat Slade in a fight, I'm merely pointing out that he can and has consistently given Slade a whole heap of trouble in melee combat (and we both no he isn't the only street level human to do it, not by a long shot). I have no illusions that Dick could beat Deathstroke in a fight, he would lose that is pretty clear. All the instances where Dick has put the boots to Slade are small snapshots if a fight, not accurate representations of how it would end if it was allowed to play out to its natural conclusion. It's like the first two minutes of Enter The Dragon, where Chuck Norris walks all over Bruce Lee, except Nightwing usually runs away before the moment when Bruce Lee makes his comeback. The fact remains that Dick has the speed and agility to briefly dominate Slade in a fight if he chooses his moment right, he simply lacks the stamina to keep it up and the strength to bypass Slade's durability. Steve has those same advantages as Nightwing (more so) and lacks those handicaps.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Show me an example of Nightwing matching the absurd agility and speed feats he started having when McDaniel took on the art. He basically became Millar's Daredevil over night, I mean, Chuck Dixon even said that was his intention. Little to nothing prior to that moment would have support Dick being able to operate on those levels. Half a decade ago Dick literally couldn't even lay a finger on Batman or Cassandra Cain in h2h, during Battle for the Cowl he went shot for shot with Cass. I really don't see how you could argue he hasn't gotten faster since he first became Nightwing, he has improved markedly in every conceivable way.Dick has never shown the ability to beat Deathstroke in a fight. Even sans healing factor, Slade's enhanced durability would make it extremely difficult that some like Dick (or even Bruce) could get a ko in a h2h fight before they themselves were put down. But I'm not arguing that Dick can beat Slade in a fight, I'm merely pointing out that he can and has consistently given Slade a whole heap of trouble in melee combat (and we both no he isn't the only street level human to do it, not by a long shot). I have no illusions that Dick could beat Deathstroke in a fight, he would lose that is pretty clear. All the instances where Dick has put the boots to Slade are small snapshots if a fight, not accurate representations of how it would end if it was allowed to play out to its natural conclusion. It's like the first two minutes of Enter The Dragon, where Chuck Norris walks all over Bruce Lee, except Nightwing usually runs away before the moment when Bruce Lee makes his comeback. The fact remains that Dick has the speed and agility to briefly dominate Slade in a fight if he chooses his moment right, he simply lacks the stamina to keep it up and the strength to bypass Slade's durability. Steve has those same advantages as Nightwing (more so) and lacks those handicaps.
My boy Srank is back. We needed you a couple of days ago for a Wolvy thread.
Cap has beaten daredevil senseless many, many times. It's concrete fact that Cap is his superior,There is almost always some circumstance as to why he beats him, Im almost certain they have never had a legit fight but DD has beaten black panther who has Cap like stats. Im not saying DD would beat cap.
Originally posted by namorsubby
lol im not and i never have been "anti-cap". I love the invaders and virtually every chracter from the group. Namor, torch, cap......some of my all time favorites. Just because i disagree with you here doesnt mean im biased. Check the poll. Im not the only one obviously( of course all those guys are ignorant cap haters too, right). I think the rest of the guys whon sided with Slade here simply realize the futility in arguing with the few radicals here. I should adopt the same mentality as ive been here for some time and i know neither of our stances will change.
Those other fans are fine to say that Slade wins. I don't care that you think Slade wins.
But when you start spouting illogical statements that Slade is superior to Cap in everything across the board on all stats. You better be prepared to back that up. (which you haven't here)
I even debated some of the other ones.
First when I debated with you. You tried to hide behind Cap's label of Peak Human. But fact of the matter is I trapped you good with Slades own label of being called almost superhuman.
Second then you run off on a different tangent and say Batman strength feats are just as good as Steves(which there not) and then you say because Batman are then Slade must be stronger. Yet that fails badly for you since A. Batman isn't as strong nor are his average portrayal of strength feats in comparison too Cap.
B. Slade being stronger then Bruce doesn't matter since Cap is stronger then his own peers as well. Plus I noticed you didn't even touch the Cap stalemating superhuman's in strength and looked terrible by bringing Batman into it. As I brought him in as well with him matching Slade.
You failed in every attempt to prove that he's stronger.
Forgive me, but I just find it difficult to find a reason to argue with posters who seriously try to push things like cap being a supersonic speedster or immortal due to regeneration. Or posters who say Slade is slower than nightwing despite several admitted statements from both characters to the contrary and 90% of showings saying otherwise. Posters who spend more time attempting to personally antagonize rivals with lowbrow tactics rather than actually support their stance or disprove an opposing stance(like you mummy). Anyone can cite low showings or inconsistencies or mention instances that they know have extinuating circumstances to discredit a character. Then reverse that method for character they side with. I should know better than to think i could have a clean debate with the same few posters who have employed these tactics since day 1. No more though.
Im not saying it wont be a fight. Im not saying one couldnt easily go the other way. Just look at the poll, it shows just how good of a fight this is. I honestly feel the poll would be much more slanted in Caps favor if not for the thread(Slades always been lowballed on KMC). Nonetheless, im going with Slade for reasons ive already stated and supported. And i wont continue to revisit the same arguements with the same posters over and over. Weve been at this for years and theirs nothing new about why we disagree. So i ask, what is the point?
Slade ftw
Well obviously there are many who side with me. How many posters do you think actually believe slade has a skill advantage? I dont. Theyre siding with him due to his physical advantages.
Just because i cant post feats here doesnt mean i havent backed my beliefs with feats. The instances ive mentioned have all been posted by me before. You can all check it out, but youd rather stick to your illogical allegations.
I'm talking about this statement (I honestly feel the poll would be much more slanted in Caps favor if not for the thread(Slades always been lowballed on KMC). ).
There hasn't been anything posted in this thread that would cause someone to change their mind(on either side) so your feeling is completely unfounded and only exists so that you can pat yourself on the back for defending Slade's honor on a board that "lowballs" him.
The notion that just because one has not posted feats in this particular thread due to sheer inability, but already has feats posted in an accessible location and mentions them here is simple moronic. You keep bringing up the fact that i have not posted them here when you know i cant. How does one argue with such lunacy?
Slade getting a majority vote here is the same as him getting one oN the marvel boards. I consider it a major step.