PIS vs Typical Feats

Originally posted by leonidas
i agree it's NOT the only factor, but i also think bentley's right--CIS on FLASH'S part plays a role (usually) in slade hitting flash). that is NOT the same as calling PIS because slade hit him. an in-character flash has been shown to be susceptible to slade's attack, with some consistency. imo, that makes it a non-pis issue.

if we said all CIS is off, i don't think anyone would argue slade could still hit him.

i like the discussion though. i think people on the forum confound these issues far too often. in typical forum settings, characters ARE in character. a result of that is that some of the cries of PIS are unfounded. at least imho.

the feats i mentioned above (and there are several others i HAVEN'T mentioned) are different from what we're talking about in that i'm not sure how consistently THAT level of feat is portrayed.

As far as the rules go, they also say a character operates at their best.

So, even if you consider Superman being hit as CIS and not PIS, that doesn't automatically make it a valid argument in the forum, because Superman also has plenty of examples of not standing there like a statue and allowing himself to be hit.

The inconsistency in that case is why I consider it more PIS.. Since CIS = "Character Induced Stupidity", that should mean Superman simply isn't smart enough to use his speed to avoid being hit.. Yet, he HAS used his speed to avoid being hit. So, how could he be dumb with his powers sometimes, but not with other times?

the midgard serpent feat was actually pulled from the actual myth; that's how thor removed it from the earth, also from the myth was when he lifted the paw of a cat (jormangand in disguised) which was actually a huge section of the serpent's torso, in the comics it was the serpent disguised as FFF.

Of course, I don't think Leo's intention is to regulate or depower characters arguing about CIS, but to limit the extents of PIS, because those feats are completely ignored which is quite drastic as a result.

If I say, Hal gets some wins by using some high level shot like the Krona buster, I can claim he wins 1/10 like that in a certain matchup. Those who claim it's PIS will just ignore it. There is a sensible difference.

the thing about the krona buster is that it makes you wonder why hal wasted so much time when he could well...bust his shit wide open by himself

More from my train of thought:

But what about Thor? He also proved he's smart enough to use his powers, so why should Superman get a pass?

Because, Thor has an in comic explanation for his CIS: Warrior honor. When he fights Hulk, he wants to beat him on Hulks terms. He also tends to hold back the bulk of his powers against non Gods, both for fear of hurting them and because he's ego centric enough to assume he'd kill a non God with his full might. 😄

On that same token, while Supes should get a pass on speed inconsistency, he does hold back his power a lot too. So, Superman not one shotting a character with his full strength is total CIS, and not PIS.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
the thing about the krona buster is that it makes you wonder why hal wasted so much time when he could well...bust his shit wide open by himself

Good question.

It was claimed his willpower overrode the rings limiters, and Hal usually doesn't kill.. So, I'd speculate this was Hal's version of Death of Superman.. Prior to the Krona buster, Hal was still trying to end it as he normally would. Eventually, he realized the stakes and how impossible sticking to his code would be... The one time in his life he was serious about killing someone, because he saw no other option. He was using 100% of his will in ending a life, which was more than even the ring could handle.

But it's not something he could bust out whenever he wants, which is why it's a high end feat. The conditions need to be right for it.

Odin shacking the multiverse by fighting someone

Originally posted by requim
Odin shacking the multiverse by fighting someone

Even worse than that, the entire universe was in danger of being destroyed according to Jean Grey, Dr. Strange and the Silver Surfer.

Originally posted by requim
Odin shacking the multiverse by fighting someone

that's a good one. his battles have been universal in scope in his early years, but shaking the multiverse is definitely a bit of an outlier. depending on how you view those early battles, shaking the multiverse could be PIS.

Originally posted by Bentley
Of course, I don't think Leo's intention is to regulate or depower characters arguing about CIS, but to limit the extents of PIS, because those feats are completely ignored which is quite drastic as a result.

👆

If I say, Hal gets some wins by using some high level shot like the Krona buster, I can claim he wins 1/10 like that in a certain matchup. Those who claim it's PIS will just ignore it. There is a sensible difference.

yep. that's almost always how i figure things. if hal battles ss, is there a chance he could pull off that krona blast? yes. based on his typical showings are the odds good? not a chance. so maybe he gets 1/10 in my own accounting of how there battles go. and if it's one and done, i'd never say he used that blast because the proof does not suport it.

fighting to their best should NOT mean characters fight out of character, and rarely used attacks should be viewed as just that--rarely used attacks.

what are some of the more called for PIS feats by the popular guys? captain america? superman? surfer? wolverine? i'd love more feats to discuss to see if these feats really SHOULD be considered PIS.

^I got 1. Surfer channeling the crunch when Big G couldn't do it.

Hal's done the Krona buster three times now

That almost killed Surfer, though.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Hal's done the Krona buster three times now

Oh yeah? Is this before the reboot, or in some later timeline running co-currently?

Originally posted by cdtm
That almost killed Surfer, though.

Yeah but my point was why was Surfer even needed? PIS on Galan's part.

Originally posted by cdtm
Oh yeah? Is this before the reboot, or in some later timeline running co-currently?

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
Damn edit button...

Krona/Entropy...
*mini bio on his new form*
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-07.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-08.jpg

Is taken out by a couple GL's after he was smashing the central power battery. They hit it in the heart where all the captive minds are held.
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-16.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-17.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-18.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-19.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o106/bigbran1/owned/Green_Lantern-1992-35-20.jpg

He did it again more one on one against a weaker Krona too IIRC

Those scans aren't just Hal, though. 😕

Originally posted by cdtm
Those scans aren't just Hal, though. 😕

I'm sorry if it's not impressive unless it's just Hal

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
It's Hal and a group of 'Herald' level beings beating pretty much an abstract level being.

I'm sorry if it's not impressive unless it's just Hal

It's impressive, but it's not Hal doing a Krona buster. It's a group of GL's doing a Krona buster.

Originally posted by cdtm
It's impressive, but it's not Hal doing a Krona buster. It's a group of GL's doing a Krona buster.

Just saying his most recent shot isn't pis, as Hal has a history of rocking Krona's shit (actually, any really powerful being really)