Originally posted by NemeBro
Marcus is physically stronger than any Twivamp, obviously.
You will need to mention some feats for that claim.
How I compare the two:
Strength: Currently Contested
Speed: TwiVamps by far
Durability: TwiVamps (bullet proof)
Stamina/Endurance: TwiVamps
X Factor: Depends on the specific TwiVamp - TwiVamp special abilities incl mind-reading, foresight, sensory deprivation, Illusion generation etc etc.
Even if one concedes the strength advantage (which I don't until convinced), the Underworld Vampire is still easily dominated due to the TwiVamp's other superior abilities and powers.
Can't say Marcus is physically stronger than any Twi vamp, he can be in par or less. I would say his cunning prowess and fighting abilty can take out a Twilight Vampire ( w/o any special abilities)
Originally posted by NemeBro
Marcus is physically stronger than any Twivamp, obviously.We basically see James have his head ripped off.
Ergo, Marcus rips off their heads.
Originally posted by Placidity
You will need to mention some feats for that claim.How I compare the two:
[b]Strength
: Currently ContestedSpeed: TwiVamps by far
Durability: TwiVamps (bullet proof)
Stamina/Endurance: TwiVamps
X Factor: Depends on the specific TwiVamp - TwiVamp special abilities incl mind-reading, foresight, sensory deprivation, Illusion generation etc etc.
Even if one concedes the strength advantage (which I don't until convinced), the Underworld Vampire is still easily dominated due to the TwiVamp's other superior abilities and powers. [/B]
The feats for Marcus' strength have been mentioned, Ed's best strength feat is IIRC pushing over a tree.
As for speed, by far? What have they done to give them the incredible speed advantage? Newborn Michael was fast enough to be a blur to a vampire elder like Viktor, and Selene at some point in the second movie was dodging bullets, wasn't she?
In terms of durability the Twivamps win out, yes, but endurance? Marcus' superior healing factor seems to imply the opposite.
Originally posted by NemeBro
The feats for Marcus' strength have been mentioned, Ed's best strength feat is IIRC pushing over a tree.
Stopping a van with one arm. I'm sure DDM can list more.
Originally posted by NemeBro
As for speed, by far? What have they done to give them the incredible speed advantage? Newborn Michael was fast enough to be a blur to a vampire elder like Viktor, and Selene at some point in the second movie was dodging bullets, wasn't she?
I would have thought this point would be the least argued point actually. Have you actually seen the movies? (Not asking as an insult because I know many people would laugh at the idea of watching it)
Michael doing the blurring thing, I've heard about many times I've never bothered to watch it again. Either way, it is probably the only moment in the whole Underworld trilogy where such speed was displayed (maybe some in the new movie - I don't know?), so its fair to label it an uncharacteristic high end feat.
Regarding Selene, she definitely has superspeed, and was aim-dodging, but nowhere near as fast as Twivamps.
In terms of durability the Twivamps win out, yes, but endurance? Marcus' superior healing factor seems to imply the opposite.
The reason I said this is because Underworld Vampires have a more human anatomy than TwiVamps. They have shown signs of exhaustion throughout the trilogy, however the TwiVamps have not. It makes sense though, the TwiVamps are more physiologically "dead" than Underworld Vamps since they don't breath, have no blood circulation etc and the most persuasive argument is that they do not sleep - ever (sleeping is a form of rest obviously) , its no wonder they don't tire.
Again, there are also special abilities...
Stopping the van was actually calced to be about a class 5-10 feat IIRC.
As for the speed... What in that video did you just show me that Marcus or even Michael could not replicate? Hell, IIRC Selene has done the same damn thing, pre-Corvinus blood.
I am talking about Marcus. Have we seen Marcus get tired? Hell, William, his equal (Or inferior, considering Marcus is now a hybrid), was still much stronger than a normal Lycan after hundreds of years of starvation.
Originally posted by NemeBro
As for the speed... What in that video did you just show me that Marcus or even Michael could not replicate? Hell, IIRC Selene has done the same damn thing, pre-Corvinus blood.
Would you like to post a clip for comparison? I've seen Evolution quite a few times, their speed is clearly inferior to me.
Originally posted by NemeBro
I am talking about Marcus. Have we seen Marcus get tired? Hell, William, his equal (Or inferior, considering Marcus is now a hybrid), was still much stronger than a normal Lycan after hundreds of years of starvation.
I've seen him and upgraded Selene breath hard, thats a sign of being tired. Their healing factors keep them going, but Twivamps don't get tired at all, at least we have not seen it AND they NEVER SLEEP, so whichever way you cut it, Twivamp's endurance is at least equal or greater, never less.
Edit:
Also about William starving? We don't really know if Lycans, (or the original Lycan) really needs sustenance to keep going. We see that vampires lose their muscle mass and are reduced to a bony corpse after hibernation and require blood to rejuvenate, however Lycans likely do not have a similar need, William still looked like he did 800 years ago before he was locked up.
In the first minute alone we see that Michael can move without apparently being seen at all, appearing right where Viktor landed after Michael hit him.
Originally posted by KingD19
What's the strongest Twi-Vamp feat?
Depends on your measure.
It could be Edward pushing an "alive" tree over near the base (a feat that puts him well past the 100+ ton lifter category and he's supposed to be a "weak" vampire compared to some of the brawler types in Twilight).
The other measure could be cracking the stones with Edward's body by Felix.
Another could be Edward barely extending his arm and it stops that van like it weighs nothing.
I would put the tree feat as the strongest. I found scholarly work that talked about the forces required to uproot "naked" trees which were in the tens of thousands of kilonewtons of force. The one Edward pushed over was "alive" and in the "frosty mountains". SO it would have been harder to uproot the tree due to the frozen ground.
That runs parallel with a comment Bella made in the book about cars being like styrofoam toys to the vampires.
Originally posted by KingD19
Marcus knocked a Duece and a half(huge truck) off the road by shoulder charging it.
A similar feat that Edward pulls off with far less effort: he just extended his hand.
Oh, and...he seemingly teleported from about 30 feet away to stop the van from crushing Bella. And you wonder why girls get all wet over Edward? He's a very archetypal "savior" type.
Originally posted by KingD19
Yanked a helicopter out of flight with one pull.
I destroyed why this is a good feat to use.
Basically, YOU could pull a helicopter out of the air. A helicopter hovering stationary is only supplying just enough lift force to stay in one spot. Pulling on a rope of a helicopter doing so will rock the helicopter and scare the shit out of the pilot. It's only the newer helicopters that have the gyoscroping and the "auto" correcting "self-righting technologies" in place (like the one that guy is using to create "jet cars"😉 that would rev up the engines automatically in response to the "downward" pulling force.
Watch the video where he pulls the helicopter out of the sky: the helicopter's engines do not rev up.
Originally posted by KingD19
Lifted a portcullis that was solid stone, several feet thick, which equals a bunch of tons.
It was not several feat thick and it was metal.
Edward destroys that strength feat by leaps and bounds. Maybe by 10-50 times over.
Originally posted by NemeBro
Stopping the van was actually calced to be about a class 5-10 feat IIRC.
Yeah, gently extending your hand and allowing the van to bounce off of your hand due to your durability while also being in a crouching position does not show us even remotely close to his hi end strength feats. He might as well have held his hand up while someone threw a dodgeball at bella's face (and the dodgeball would have caused a normal person's hand to react even more than Edward's did to the car.) Watch the scene again: Edward's hand does not really show signs of even being affected by the inertia of the moving car.
The only time Edward really strained to do something strong was when he pushed a full grown and "live" tree over near it's base. That's well into the multi-hundred ton category. I also proved it, as well, with an independent and scientific source.
This is why Twilight should not be used in vs. discussions: there's very few people willing to actually engage in objective conversation when it comes to Twilight.
Originally posted by NemeBro
Source of the amount of force required to push over a tree you mentioned?
Me.
😐
That's all you need.
😐
It's in the MVF, somewhere. It was in another Twi-hate thread.
Look for kilonewton by my name. You might find it that way. Look for root by my name. You may find it that way, too.
Originally posted by lilshogun
Twilight Vamps regeneration is a question. Since they are made of some type of rock like material, I am sure the Underworld Were's has enough strength to break off an arm or two thus handicapping them.
It may be a possibility for the strongest of the Underworld Universe (we won't know until the strength debate is established), however its not really an advantage in their favor since TwiVamps can do the same and more to the Underworld Vampire, they can literally crush them.
About the regeneration, I do think the Underworld vampire has a superior HF in the traditional sense, but the Twivamp does have a HF too - they can be "put back together" even after being ripped apart - though thats irrelevant if they are broken thats the end for them in this fight. They also heal from cracks they receive from battle I believe.