Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
1.lets say..the world trade disaster was a strategy by government to have citizens support war effort .the same tatic which hitler succesfully used to have his people support war (this part is true)what is you reaction?
What exactly are you referring to when you talk about Hitler? The Reichstags fire, or the Glaiwitz incident, or something else?
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
And JFK Sr. opted to support the Germans against the Soviets, should the Soviets become too powerful. Big deal.If 9/11 was an inside job by the American government, the execution of which was designed to push America in to invading the Middle East for money, then I would say they deserved every dollar they made. The planting of bombs, acquiring the planes, alerting all the important people, falsifying everything, kidnapping, coercing, eliminating, and disposing of several hundred airline passengers, the sheer amount of planning, practice, and training... would take thousands of people. People that needed to be recruited and trained (by yet more people), and have managed to conceal their secrecy and espionage from everybody else, to this very day...
The logistics of such an operation would be mind-boggling, even without factoring in human error. The fact that not a single operative f*cked up in any way, and the whole plan went off perfectly... I can honestly say such an endeavor would be nothing short of the greatest artistic masterpiece in human history. The artists themselves would deserve every reward they could possible reap.
But that's the basis of what the 9/11 theorists are disputing and they actually do present their own evidence as to what they believe. It may not be ever 'proved' but to say that they haven't hit the nail on the head in any of the issues arising from that incident is naive. It was a public event, on film so they can pick at it and call in their own experts/witnesses, whatever and they do and some of what they say is compelling.
Some of the people that have spoken out may have been silenced/discredited, others may not have known what the 'operation' was all about. Or some may have been cold-hearted enough to to whatever their masters told them, because if you can't believe in the depths of human cruelty then that's unbelievable because history is full of them. Some are living now also.
The problem now is there are almost too many theories about what happened; plane/drone /no plane/missile, concentrated energy device, thermite and it goes on. But because they can't present or challenge their evidence it just gets ignored and that makes it worse in the long run - adds more suspicion. If the government had nothing to hide, why not confront the accusers and break down their arguments?
Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I would not be surprise about the World trade disaster being a set up but as for the Hitler thing I would be surprise.
So a governmental conspiracy that has yet to garner any credible evidence, or be leaked through one of the thousands of media outlets we have in today's media-obsessed world by any single member of the conspiracy, is MORE likely than the face of evil in the 20th century doing something similar in an era where it would've been much easier to pull off?
Large conspiracies almost always fall apart in the theory room because it's impossible to keep something so large a secret for any meaningful length of time.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
If 9/11 was an inside job by the American government, the execution of which was designed to push America in to invading the Middle East for money, then I would say they deserved every dollar they made. The planting of bombs, acquiring the planes, alerting all the important people, falsifying everything, kidnapping, coercing, eliminating, and disposing of several hundred airline passengers, the sheer amount of planning, practice, and training... would take thousands of people. People that needed to be recruited and trained (by yet more people), and have managed to conceal their secrecy and espionage from everybody else, to this very day...The logistics of such an operation would be mind-boggling, even without factoring in human error. The fact that not a single operative f*cked up in any way, and the whole plan went off perfectly... I can honestly say such an endeavor would be nothing short of the greatest artistic masterpiece in human history. The artists themselves would deserve every reward they could possible reap.
lol, this.
Originally posted by inimalist
I'm sorry, do you know how large the market is for conspiracy books?
Not to mention, who actually reads books anymore? If actual evidence can be found that isn't "fringe" people yelling without proper diligence, the media will eat it up. Hell, interview one guy involved in any way with 9/11 who says he was part of a plan, throw the video up on youtube, and you'll be viral before you have a chance to get out of your boxers and put a suit on for the cameras.
Also there's anti-conspiracy books that debunk conspiracies. So the issue IS being confronted and debunked when applicable. Lord Z, if you're claiming the debate is being put under wraps, you're not doing a good job of searching for it.
On 9/10, Rumsfeld announces there is fraud in the hundreds of billions in the Pentagon. Next day a plane hits the Pentagon not far away from where he was in that building.
The real question is does the Pentagon play covert war games in our own country, and when things get to the point where their interests are affected, pull the trigger to deflect attention or direct an action after such subsequenct actions.
Say maybe the Kennedys wanted to pull out of Vietman, but military says no.
Perhaps, backup records of the Pentagon transactions are in a New York World Trade Center building and the main records in the Pentagon.
Perhaps both buildings go down or have a plane crash just where those records happen to be, in a huge castrophe by recruits none other recruited by the Pentagon to do such actions to deflect their own fraud.
Ask yourself what happened in the last 10 years that the supply of opium from Afgahnistain went from 10% to 90%, were there new trade routes discovered? Better marketing of their product?
And if we over there, how do shipments go up 9 fold without anyone noticing, and how is it getting over here, the same usual way?
Or would it be wasteful to not load military planes up on the way back for a fee, a nod and a wink?
Re: Your reaction
Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
1.lets say..the world trade disaster was a strategy by government to have citizens support war effort .the same tatic which hitler succesfully used to have his people support war (this part is true)what is you reaction?
Very perceptive... The war on terror is an excuse to control!
-Wang is love
to answer the OP: If I found out that my government was literally designing huge plots to kill its own citizens in spectacular ways, for whatever reason, the only rational answer is violent revolution.
I'd actually challenge any Truther on this point as well. If you truly believe that this is the monster you are fighting against, WTF? If you really, REALLY, believe the US government is needlessly killing its own citizens on mass like this, making stupid YouTube videos and arguing on message boards is retarded (also dangerous). Why aren't you fighting? Cowardice? Ineptitude? Sloth?
Originally posted by inimalist
to answer the OP: If I found out that my government was literally designing huge plots to kill its own citizens in spectacular ways, for whatever reason, the only rational answer is violent revolution.I'd actually challenge any Truther on this point as well. If you truly believe that this is the monster you are fighting against, WTF? If you really, REALLY, believe the US government is needlessly killing its own citizens on mass like this, making stupid YouTube videos and arguing on message boards is retarded (also dangerous). Why aren't you fighting? Cowardice? Ineptitude? Sloth?
Well put!
Originally posted by inimalist
I'm sorry, do you know how large the market is for conspiracy books?
Do you?
I was under the impression that it was waning due to "free" stuff.
Originally posted by Digi
So a governmental conspiracy that has yet to garner any credible evidence,
The evidence gathered is very credible. I believe the conclusions are the problem.
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak out because I was Protestant.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
Originally posted by WangWins
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak out because I was Protestant.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
Wrong. You still have the atheistic/agnostic anarchists. That's about 50% of young adults. 😆
Originally posted by WangWins
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak out because I was Protestant.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
I feel so lonely. 🙁
Originally posted by inimalist
to answer the OP: If I found out that my government was literally designing huge plots to kill its own citizens in spectacular ways, for whatever reason, the only rational answer is violent revolution.I'd actually challenge any Truther on this point as well. If you truly believe that this is the monster you are fighting against, WTF? If you really, REALLY, believe the US government is needlessly killing its own citizens on mass like this, making stupid YouTube videos and arguing on message boards is retarded (also dangerous). Why aren't you fighting? Cowardice? Ineptitude? Sloth?
I heart you, ini.
I take it though you think the protestors in Syria should all be taking up arms now instead of trying to carry out peaceful protests (not counting the FSA), don't you?
Originally posted by Lord Shadow ZThousands of them. All recruited, trained, kept in the dark, silenced, sent through their mission, and seen it come to full fruition.
Some of the people that have spoken out may have been silenced/discredited, others may not have known what the 'operation' was all about. Or some may have been cold-hearted enough to to whatever their masters told them, because if you can't believe in the depths of human cruelty then that's unbelievable because history is full of them. Some are living now also.
All without a hitch.
Without a doubt, the Inside Job of September 11th was/is the single greatest heist/work of living art to ever exist. Bar none.
Originally posted by NemeBro
Did that guy just imply that the 9/11 conspiracy was planned and carried out in a day, or is that just me? 😐
The 9/11 attack is much simpler than people make it out to be....if you assume they didn't rig the support beams with nanothermite.
But, yes, the attack could have been planned out in far less than a day.
It still took months to carry out because they had to go to flight school.
His implications were that there was a bigger conspiracy going on. Just because Rummy announced it the day before, does not mean that we were trying to kill him in just a day. That could have been one of two things:
Rum was breaking a promise about not revealing that info but he did anyway. A "kill" plan was designed months in advance just in case. (very silly)
It was a plan to distract from the announcement (worked splendidly).
The latter is more plausible. If there was going to be a mass government conspiracy, the plan would be executed in a way that it was be too silly to look like the government did it. Basically, there would be no room to think it was the government with a sane mind. For me, that's the biggest problem with the truthers.