Originally posted by Pwned
When taking Cognus into account though, you have to also take into account that weird ability she has. She unconciously disrupts the Force near her, leaving Bane slower and not as capable as he normally is due to a, admittedly very minor, disruption in his connection to the Force.
We've seen Jedi adjust themselves, however, when blockers or Ysalmiri are present...and don't forget the yuuzhan Vong.
Neph:
So? Disintergrating an opponent with TK is a matter of skill and mastery of telekinesis, not raw power. If anything the orbalisks would make it harder to do that with the pain and adrenaline messing up his concentration.
When is this noted? Sith in pain make them MORE dangerous as they focus through it and it gives them more power.
Furthermore in that fight he had to deal with nanobots causing him extreme pain and disorientation, and he still disintergrates 2 technobeasts as he's fighting them off at one point. Peak condition my ass.
Once again, there is no evidence that being in intense pain breeds disorientation. "There is no Pain where Strength Lies" remember? Does this make Vader unfocused and weak because he's in horrible agony every waking moment?
And even if it was a matter of power, Bane specifically notes that he's trying to conserve power during that fight, but that he can still afford to use the Force in that way and fight for over an hour. Considering this, as well as the fact that he disintergrates 12 of them at once, indicates that he would be capable of doing it even without the boost from the orbalisks.
Originally posted by LightsnakeBut also take into account what happened the first time they encountered it.
We've seen Jedi adjust themselves, however, when blockers or Ysalmiri are present...and don't forget the yuuzhan Vong.
I also see a difference between blocking and disrupting, which I need to say before you read this next part:
While they have adapted, it takes time. And Cognus will be on your ass the whole time, combined with her inherent precog, she is quite formidable. Not to mention that he had to extend more concentration to draw on the Force, thus weakening him even further. Her little ability there is quite powerful.
The first time Mara encountered a Yuuzhan Vong, she ended up killing him, as I recall.
And this isn't Cognus when she was an amazing Sith Lord, it's Cognus, the force assassin. This is also something Cognus did instinctively, not an ability she refined. It's not something a high level Sith Lord has any business falling to.
We know for a fact from the visual guide that the Sith of the Banite line kept surpassing one another to boot. Plagueis would be a good sight stronger.
Plagueis has been directly confirmed as more powerful than Bane...so have Zannah and Cognus and all those that followed
There is simply no reason Plagueis cannot. It's not a costly force technique
Stating that you can't find a good reason for a force user not to do action A, B, or C doesn't mean said force user can do action A, B, or C.
Originally posted by suck it cowboy
And you're back with the typical baseless assertions and reaching. Please show us where it was "confirmed". Show us where it is also stated that each sith lord was more powerful than the first.
The Rule of Two is that when the apprentice has surpassed the master they kill them, then they become master and get their own apprentice, who in turn surpasses and kills them.
To surpass is to become better, stronger, and logically more powerful.
Originally posted by Master_Galen
The Rule of Two is that when the apprentice has surpassed the master they kill them, then they become master and get their own apprentice, who in turn surpasses and kills them.To surpass is to become better, stronger, and logically more powerful.
That's not a "confirmation". Furthermore, the point is valid only if each master faced his apprentice in the same manner that Bane and Zannah did, and not defeat the master through subterfuge.
Originally posted by suck it cowboy
And you're back with the typical baseless assertions and reaching. Please show us where it was "confirmed". Show us where it is also stated that each sith lord was more powerful than the first.
Stating that you can't find a good reason for a force user not to do action A, B, or C doesn't mean said force user can do action A, B, or C.
""For a millennium, the Sith maintained their order in secrecy, passing down their evil heritage. As they gained knowledge of the dark side of the Force, their powers increased with each generation." (pg. 16)"
So Plagueis can't do something very, very basic? Even when he could do more complicated maneuvers against Darth Venemis?
I didn't say he couldn't, I said that not finding a good reason for a force user to not do something doesn't necessarily mean he can do it.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Neph:When is this noted? Sith in pain make them MORE dangerous as they focus through it and it gives them more power.
Do you not remember the subplot where Zannah convinces Bane that the orbalisks are more trouble than they're worth because he can't concentrate properly and they affect his control?
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Once again, there is no evidence that being in intense pain breeds disorientation. "There is no Pain where Strength Lies" remember? Does this make Vader unfocused and weak because he's in horrible agony every waking moment?
I said pain and disorientation. The nanobots attack his brain, the frontal lobe specifically, which obviously wouldn't be good for his concentration. Furthermore Bane describes that has lapses in concentration throughout the fight and gets struck down during those time. Its clear that Bane's concentration suffered throughout that fight.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
He noted, actually, he's preserving power/energy AFTER the fight. Not during.
No, during the fight it specifically says that hes 'conserving his Force abilities'.
Originally posted by suck it cowboy
The power of the sith increased with every generation. Congratulations, you proved the sith order become more and more powerful throughout the ages.
Their powers increase.
With every generation.
I didn't say he couldn't, I said that not finding a good reason for a force user to not do something doesn't necessarily mean he can do it.
Yeaaah, I think we're done here.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Do you not remember the subplot where Zannah convinces Bane that the orbalisks are more trouble than they're worth because he can't concentrate properly and they affect his control?
Because he's having blowups of fury. In his fights, Bane is still able to think rationally. Look at how he handled the Jedi with Worror
I said pain [b]and disorientation. The nanobots attack his brain, the frontal lobe specifically, which obviously wouldn't be good for his concentration. Furthermore Bane describes that has lapses in concentration throughout the fight and gets struck down during those time. Its clear that Bane's concentration suffered throughout that fight.
Examples?
No, during the fight it specifically says that hes 'conserving his Force abilities'. [/B]
after the disintegration.
......yes, that was the point.
There are two Sith.Their powers increase.
With every generation.
Yeaaah, I think we're done here.
Originally posted by suck it cowboy
Yes, as a sith order, their powers increase, while the jedi power dwindles. As they destroy the republic from within, their powers increase. Understanding how the statement can mean many different things? Hardly the conclusive "EVERY SITH IS STRONGER THAN THE PREVIOUS" statement, rofl.
Seeing as there is only two sith in the sith order at this point, then yes if the sith become more powerful that means those two sith become more powerful.
Originally posted by Master_Galen
Seeing as there is only two sith in the sith order at this point, then yes if the sith become more powerful that means those two sith become more powerful.
Yes, as a sith order, their powers increase, while the jedi power dwindles. As they destroy the republic from within, their powers increase. Understanding how the statement can mean many different things?
Krayt's sith order also increased in power over 100 years, that means each generation is more powerful than the last?
Originally posted by Lightsnake
""For a millennium, the Sith maintained their order in secrecy, passing down their evil heritage. As they gained knowledge of the dark side of the Force, their powers increased with each generation." (pg. 16)"
Couldn't this simply refer to them gaining more Force powers each generation? It makes sense considering it indicate this as a result of increased dark side knowledge.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Couldn't this simply refer to them gaining more Force powers each generation? It makes sense considering it indicate this as a result of increased dark side knowledge.
No, when you're biased, it means whatever you want it to mean.
Which is the reason each generation is more powerful than the last.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Because he's having blowups of fury. In his fights, Bane is still able to think rationally. Look at how he handled the Jedi with Worror
I didn't say that he couldn't. I merely pointed out that constant pain and increased adrenaline etc would hinder his concentration in battle.
Originally posted by Lightsnake
Examples?
'Three times during the one-sided melee he allowed himself to lose focus, his martial instincts thrown out of sync by the unnerving silence of his enemies as they were butchered. Each time his attention lapsed he was knocked to the ground by the blows of one of the lumbering creatures that got close enough to make contact and forced to battle his way back to his feet. Two other times during the battle he felt the burning in his brain as the orbalisks purged his system of yet another cloud of nanogene spores he had unknowingly inhaled.'
Originally posted by Lightsnake
after the disintegration.
So? Its not like the situation changed after he disintergrated those technobeats. He still had to fight the rest.
The point is that he disintergrated a total of 14 technobeats and then went on to fight for a solid hour, and he still had some Force energy at the end. Its clear that he has enough power to do it, even without the orbalisks.