Originally posted by BrockalizerOh, I'm in no way saying something will or won't work. I'm just saying that Superman (or insert hero here) does everything in his power to stop criminals outside of killing them. It's different than you showing up out of nowhere to beat the shit out of a pedophile/wife beater and not calling in authorities.
A There are some bad guys that prison really wont work on. The justice system in the comics is just as inadequate as it is in the real world. Simply throwing Joker in jail doesn't eliminate the threat he poses. If they aren't evil then at least criminally insane. After all isn't the definition of insanity doing something repeatedly and expecting a different result?
Personally, I love death. Death is awesome, and works like a charm (also hilarious at times). But it doesn't work in comics. And because a hero doesn't accomplish death, it doesn't make them evil. You can't paint the guy who won't kill a pedophile as worse than a pedophile. You just can't. Same goes for all crimes of that nature.
In fact, that's a fine line to walk if you're a hero who believes in good morals. As soon as you start walking the "murder" barrier you could quickly fall to the dark side in the eyes of others, or just turn into a villian youself. But that's neither here nor there.
Originally posted by Black bolt zLot's of characters rape people. Hell, Mr Hyde raped Invisible Man to death. Rape is the new high 5.
Once again, doesn't Dr. Light RAPE people? That might put him up there.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebWhat makes Superman or any other hero different is that unlike the average Joe, superheroes are more intimately familiar with the inadequacies and rampant corruption of the justice system. That is what leads many of them to become heroes in the first place. Batman and Daredevil are excellent examples. At the least it seems insane to assume that the same inadequate justice system that lead to your superhero career in the first place is going magically become more efficient and less corrupt because the criminals have been apprehended by a superhero rather than an actual police officer.
Oh, I'm in no way saying something will or won't work. I'm just saying that Superman (or insert hero here) does everything in his power to stop criminals outside of killing them. It's different than you showing up out of nowhere to beat the shit out of a pedophile/wife beater and not calling in authorities.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebBut it can and does work, especially if done with a semi-competent writer. Both Marvel and DC are teaming with immensely entertaining "Anti-Heroes" like, Deadpool, Black Adam, Punisher, Atrocitous (Brightest Day version), even Thanos at times. Death, like any tool is only as effective as the person using it.
Personally, I love death. Death is awesome, and works like a charm (also hilarious at times). But it doesn't work in comics. And because a hero doesn't accomplish death, it doesn't make them evil. You can't paint the guy who won't kill a pedophile as worse than a pedophile. You just can't. Same goes for all crimes of that nature.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebIMO being able to put aside personal biases and doing what is necessary for the greater good is the true mark of a hero. A hero should care more about doing his or her job than public opinion. Take Rorschach, Punisher, and to an extent the X-Men for example. They are willing to do what is neccessary for the greater good, regardless of how the public feels about them.
In fact, that's a fine line to walk if you're a hero who believes in good morals. As soon as you start walking the "murder" barrier you could quickly fall to the dark side in the eyes of others, or just turn into a villian youself. But that's neither here nor there.
Originally posted by BrockalizerAnd they've also seen good come out of it, or the ability to hold a prisoner long time. Then they also have specialized prisons and whatnot for whatever occasion.
What makes Superman or any other hero different is that unlike the average Joe, superheroes are more intimately familiar with the inadequacies and rampant corruption of the justice system. That is what leads many of them to become heroes in the first place. Batman and Daredevil are excellent examples. At the least it seems insane to assume that the same inadequate justice system that lead to your superhero career in the first place is going magically become more efficient and less corrupt because the criminals have been apprehended by a superhero rather than an actual police officer.
They aren't allowing villians to run rampant. They are again, doing everything in their power minus the ability to kill to put the villian under control.
Which is different than your scenario where you're just beating up a child molestor.
Originally posted by BrockalizerNo it doesn't.
But it can and does work, especially if done with a semi-competent writer. Both Marvel and DC are teaming with immensely entertaining "Anti-Heroes" like, Deadpool, Black Adam, Punisher, Atrocitous (Brightest Day version), even Thanos at times. Death, like any tool is only as effective as the person using it.
Example: Dr Doom has been dead for decades. Lex has been dead for decades. Joker, Black Adam, Magneto, Loki, and other other villian you can think of has now been dead for a long time because the hero didn't pussy out and killed them. Hell, Hulk gets killed for his part in forming the Avengers. Darkseid gets killed the first time he screws with Earth and everybody gets wiped out by Anti Monitor because of it. No DC.
What fun comics those would be, wouldn't they?
Death works every now and then for big names, and for minor to no name villians. It doesn't work for how a hero should apply it, and for that reason, comics don't suck complete dick ass.
Originally posted by BrockalizerYes, and for most people that wouldn't work. If Superman started punching basketballs in every villian, I could easily see him corrupted. You don't go from "pure" to destroying villians without some adverse side effects.
IMO being able to put aside personal biases and doing what is necessary for the greater good is the true mark of a hero. A hero should care more about doing his or her job than public opinion. Take Rorschach, Punisher, and to an extent the X-Men for example. They are willing to do what is neccessary for the greater good, regardless of how the public feels about them.
Rorschach, Punisher, and Wolverine do it because they've had ****ed up pasts that pushed them over the edge and they stayed there. Batman I could see being this, but Batman the way he is now, and all the morals and experiences he's gained along the lines? He'd probably turn into a monster, what with all the ways he knows how to beat everyone.
Upbringing, experiences, and the like all go into this. But not everyone can just be an anti hero without adverse side effects. And that defeats the "hero" term anyway.
Again, not killing a murderer doesn't make you worse than a murderer EVEN IF you stand by and do nothing. Especially when the heros "leap" into action and bam, plow, and bang the villians into the nearest holding cell.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebAnd those "specialized" prisons still fail. Arkam is about as hard to escape as a wet paper bag.
And they've also seen good come out of it, or the ability to hold a prisoner long time. Then they also have specialized prisons and whatnot for whatever occasion.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebAnd while they were dead they ceased to be a threat, until they are brought back at a later date, usually by a different writer.
Example: Dr Doom has been dead for decades. Lex has been dead for decades. Joker, Black Adam, Magneto, Loki, and other other villian you can think of has now been dead for a long time because the hero didn't pussy out and killed them. Hell, Hulk gets killed for his part in forming the Avengers. Darkseid gets killed the first time he screws with Earth and everybody gets wiped out by Anti Monitor because of it. No DC.
Originally posted by Sr J-BiebSuper heroes aren't most people. There is a difference between "punchin basketballs" in everyone and "sanctioning" the most extreme cases. Not all villains are equal. Incarceration won't remove the threat posed by Joker, Carnage, or Lex Luthor and the heroes that defeat them know it.
Yes, and for most people that wouldn't work. If Superman started punching basketballs in every villian, I could easily see him corrupted. You don't go from "pure" to destroying villians without some adverse side effects.
Originally posted by Brockalizer
And those "specialized" prisons still fail. Arkam is about as hard to escape as a wet paper bag.And while they were dead they ceased to be a threat, until they are brought back at a later date, usually by a different writer.
Super heroes aren't most people. There is a difference between "punchin basketballs" in everyone and "sanctioning" the most extreme cases. Not all villains are equal. Incarceration won't remove the threat posed by Joker, Carnage, or Lex Luthor and the heroes that defeat them know it.
If Superman killed Luthor tomorrow he'd be seen as a tyrant, and the world would hate him.
It doesn't make you a pussy to show restraint.
Originally posted by BrockalizerIt actually holds people in for quite a while. Usually something big happens to force a breakout.
And those "specialized" prisons still fail. Arkam is about as hard to escape as a wet paper bag.And while they were dead they ceased to be a threat, until they are brought back at a later date, usually by a different writer.
Super heroes aren't most people. There is a difference between "punchin basketballs" in everyone and "sanctioning" the most extreme cases. Not all villains are equal. Incarceration won't remove the threat posed by Joker, Carnage, or Lex Luthor and the heroes that defeat them know it.
I'm not saying they would be a threat. I'm saying comics would suck ass if super heros just started killing everyone. Plus, it'd be terrible at this point in time if every super villian just died. The sales would just drop everywhere.
Plus as I said, killing Darkseid would have caused the entirety of DC to be destroyed... so there's that.
And most villians deserve to die. Most villians Superman fights, and especially most villians Batman fights. If they just started killing them after all they've stood for... I could easily see them becoming monsters.
Any of this still doesn't make the hero worse than the villian as again the villian is doing it. The hero isn't giving them a pass to accomplish nefarious deeds, they're only letting them live and stopping whatever plot they cooked up at the time.
Originally posted by -Pr-That too. Lex is loved as shit.
If Superman killed Luthor tomorrow he'd be seen as a tyrant, and the world would hate him.It doesn't make you a pussy to show restraint.
Plus, the whole world hated WW for killing a loser like Max Lord. Imagine Superman killing someone, not just someone but Sex Luthor?
That wouldn't go well.
In the anime Fate - Zero and Fate - Stay Night, they show a guy who want save the world and innocent people.
Then he notice he cant save people without killing some. He kill 100 to save 1 million, etc. But after a long time, he noticed how many people he killed and he give up.
BUT, he dont had Superman powers. IMO if the Supers killed some supervillans, they could saved millions of people.
I cant understand why Batman dont kill the Joker. I know, Joker is a popular characther, but for the plot thats make no sense.
Originally posted by psycho gundam
Couldn't superman fly off grab his iphone and come back really fast the next time luthor re-reveales to him what a deceitful shit he really is (for the umpteenth time) and just record it and post it on Worldstar?isn't he like....a reporter?
Superman wants to win fairly, though.
And besides, that kind of shit is Lois' job.
Plus, isn't that illegal?