Originally posted by Nephthys
Hmm, thats a bit too vague to conclude much from, so I'd still rank Vitiates lightning above his, taking out 5 of the galaxies most powerful Jedi with ease and all. TK is a toss-up.
Meh, not buying it.
Sidious has one-shot Force users with his lightning (Empire's End) and reduced others to ash ("Resurrection"😉; in contrast, Vitiate only rendered people unconscious and blistered Revan's flesh.
Telekinetically, Sidious has effortlessly subdued Force users capable of hurling starships, collapsing caves, and emitting potent Force repulses, to say nothing of his dominance of Dooku, Vader, and Marek -- three telekinetics of extraordinarily high repute.
Telepathically, Sidious has enslaved billions, mindwiped [millions? billions? trillions?], and ensnared Jedi.
In terms of destruction, Sidious is capable of destroying fleets with mere thought and inclination and razing planetary surfaces.
In the end, he definitely edges Vitiate out.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Also:All Jedi have some skill with Tutaminis. Its one of the first powers they're taught as initiates, before they even become padawans. Its just that most aren't good enough with it to block blaster bolts or lightning. The Jedi Path mentions blocking excessive sunlight as a basic example, for example.
This is really cool.
Like, my mind is a little blown.
The Jedi Path is a cool read, I recommend it.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Meh, not buying it.Sidious has one-shot Force users with his lightning (Empire's End) and reduced others to ash ("Resurrection"😉; in contrast, Vitiate only rendered people unconscious and blistered Revan's flesh.
Telekinetically, Sidious has effortlessly subdued Force users capable of hurling starships, collapsing caves, and emitting potent Force repulses, to say nothing of his dominance of Dooku, Vader, and Marek -- three telekinetics of extraordinarily high repute.
Telepathically, Sidious has enslaved billions, mindwiped [millions? billions? trillions?], and ensnared Jedi.
In terms of destruction, Sidious is capable of destroying fleets with mere thought and inclination and razing planetary surfaces.
In the end, he definitely edges Vitiate out.
He one-shot losers like Brand and Rayf Ysanna, while Vitiate easily whooped 5 of the most powerful Jedi at the time. He reduced those acolytes to ash from behind, so big deal. Your contrast is dumb, like me saying that Malgus > Sidious because he's killed people with TK while Sidious has only subdued them. Vitiate has overpowered multiple powerful opponents who are actively resisting him. His lightning is superior.
I wasn't aware of him dominating Dooku, Vader or Marek with TK. Yes, his bitchslapping Maul and Savage is highly impressive, but bluh bluh Dark Temple, bluh bluh prove he destroyed it, bluh bluh screw this.
He enslaved said billions over a large period of time in an indeterminate manner. It has no provable combat application. And Vitiate ensnared Jedi better:
'The Sith Emperor has mastered the dark side’s power to become the most dominating Force-user the galaxy has ever seen. His corrupting influence is so complete that none can stand in his presence without succumbing to fear, anger and hatred. The Emperor can wither and ruin even the strongest Jedi’s connection to the light side. Jedi Master Tol Braga’s strike team was not the first group to succumb to the Sith leader’s oppressive influence. Hundreds of years ago, the Jedi Revan and Malak discovered Dromund Kaas and confronted the Emperor. They fell to the dark side and returned to Republic space as Sith Lords. Since then, dozens more Jedi have followed the same path into evil.'
Vitiates mental powers were also potent enough to make Scourge shit his pants at a brief touch. In contrast Starkiller was able to shake off Sidious comparatively wussier influence by merely being distracted.
As I said, this puts DE Sidious ahead. So there was no need to bring it up other than mere bragging.
Originally posted by Nephthys
He one-shot losers like Brand and Rayf Ysanna, while Vitiate easily whooped 5 of the most powerful Jedi at the time. He reduced those acolytes to ash from behind, so big deal. Your contrast is dumb, like me saying that Malgus > Sidious because he's killed people with TK while Sidious has only subdued them. Vitiate has overpowered multiple powerful opponents who are actively resisting him. His lightning is superior.
Vitiate overpowered guys holding their lightsabers up. If that's decisive to you vis a vis Palpatine, then Sidious gets the nod for blowing Yoda's lightsaber out of his hand.
Originally posted by Nephthys
I wasn't aware of him dominating Dooku, Vader or Marek with TK. Yes, his bitchslapping Maul and Savage is highly impressive, but bluh bluh Dark Temple, bluh bluh prove he destroyed it, bluh bluh screw this.
excellent
Drawing on a line of argumentation you raised elsewhere, telekinesis is a universal Force power. It stands to reason that Sidious, more powerful than the aforementioned trio, possesses greater telekinetic aptitude unless otherwise noted as an exception.
Originally posted by Nephthys
He enslaved said billions over a large period of time in an indeterminate manner. It has no provable combat application. And Vitiate ensnared Jedi better:
I never said it had combat application, I said Sidious's feats are better. Which they are.
Originally posted by Nephthys
'The Sith Emperor has mastered the dark side’s power to become the most dominating Force-user the galaxy has ever seen. His corrupting influence is so complete that none can stand in his presence without succumbing to fear, anger and hatred. The Emperor can wither and ruin even the strongest Jedi’s connection to the light side. Jedi Master Tol Braga’s strike team was not the first group to succumb to the Sith leader’s oppressive influence. Hundreds of years ago, the Jedi Revan and Malak discovered Dromund Kaas and confronted the Emperor. They fell to the dark side and returned to Republic space as Sith Lords. Since then, dozens more Jedi have followed the same path into evil.'
An in-universe source prone to hyperbole, to say nothing of the fact that Tol Braga is no Luke Skywalker or Starkiller, whom Sidious hypnotized each.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Vitiates mental powers were also potent enough to make Scourge shit his pants at a brief touch.In contrast Starkiller was able to shake off Sidious comparatively influence by merely being distracted.
Making Starkiller shit his pants would probably not have been an adequate means of securing his cooperation and allegiance in killing Kota. Besides which, Sidious has done similar with Vima Da Boda in Dark Empire II.
(Told you, there's not an original element to Vitiate.)
Originally posted by Nephthys
As I said, this puts DE Sidious ahead. So there was no need to bring it up other than mere bragging.
I know. Just some light sparring after a few days away.
Originally posted by Col. Valerian
I see you still showin' the Sidious love, Tempest.Keep it up. For like, the rest of your life.
Although, good arguments could be made for both... As made clear by both of you. Vitiate is extremely powerful, too, for your disgrace.
Always. Best villain in Star Wars, which is why TOR's writers shamelessly ripped him off to create their Big Bad. I'm ambivalent: it's embarrassing that they couldn't come up with something unique for such a high-budget EU project, but it's definitely proof that Sidious is the ultimate Star Wars villain. Too bad no one cares enough about Nihilus, Ragnos, or Bane in that respect.
Vitiate is very powerful, but he's extremely underwhelming for his duration and efforts. Dude had 14 centuries and leached thousands of Sith to get where he is, and is still only Sidious's rival. Embarrassing.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Vitiate overpowered guys holding their lightsabers up. If that's decisive to you vis a vis Palpatine, then Sidious gets the nod for blowing Yoda's lightsaber out of his hand.
And Yoda then blocked it with his hands. Either way, I don't rank Yoda as being more powerful than 5 of the most powerful Jedi put together, and certainly not to the extent that he is easily so.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
excellentDrawing on a line of argumentation you raised elsewhere, telekinesis is a universal Force power. It stands to reason that Sidious, more powerful than the aforementioned trio, possesses greater telekinetic aptitude unless otherwise noted as an exception.
If you are referring to my brief discussion with Silver, I only claimed that Nihilus would possess Force Shield as a universal Force Power, not that he'd be incredible with it.
And thats a shitty argument you're making. Unless he has actual evidence that he's better, we cannot assume he is. Unless you want to go down this road of assuming all core abilities scale with power, in which case alot of your snide remarks about Vitiates lightsaber ability looks mighty dumb.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
I never said it had combat application, I said Sidious's feats are better. Which they are.
Well we're talking about this in terms of combat so shush ya mouth.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
An in-universe source prone to hyperbole, to say nothing of the fact that Tol Braga is no Luke Skywalker or Starkiller, whom Sidious hypnotized each.
It isn't in-universe. And if I recall your argument for him hypnotizing Skywalker is bullshit, and he failed to hypnotize Starkiller.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Making Starkiller shit his pants would probably not have been an adequate means of securing his cooperation and allegiance in killing Kota. Besides which, Sidious has done similar with Vima Da Boda in Dark Empire II.(Told you, there's not an original element to Vitiate.)
Oh no, he made a crazy old lady poop herself! That makes him about as scary as prunes! And big deal, if he is really Vitiates rival he could have just dominated Galens mind and not give a **** his cooperation.