Originally posted by AuraAngelI'm the never been seen death of Voltron type baddie.
While I know very little about Voltron, the whole forming a giant robot via combining several parts seems to come when the bad guy becomes a bigger threat. And no one has to worry about you being a threat. Or being bigger sadly.
Originally posted by quanchi112Wrong, since Ganondorf is at least as fast as Russel in terms of his rushdown speed. 🙂
Link doesn't cut people in half though. Link has used his sword to kill but he isn't quick enough to even draw his sword. Russell can clear thirty feet before Link can even see him.
Link stabs him and then Russel dies from sunlight exposure.
Originally posted by quanchi112
It happens so quickly I never saw it in still frames before. It's a basic slap/poke attack with hardly any effort from Russell's end which makes it very impressive.
Ok.. I'll let you off on a technicality. Hm, impressive buts its still in the 3-5x stronger than a human level. So lifting a ton or two?
Originally posted by quanchi112
A goron isn't rock he is comprised of flesh and rock like parts. That's your first mistake you don't know what he's comprised of but all you zelda fanatics are so used to acting like the goat stopper is a stud in the strength department. He isn't.
Given their inability to float at all, just like the rocks falling in the TP lake, their density would have to be at least double a humans which is the density or rock. See, you can't say what they're made of but we do have their obvious density as a back up. As dense as rocks = as heavy as rocks. That and Link's sword sparks when he attacks their guts.
Even if we ignore the stone and say they're 100% flesh, a flesh Goron would still weigh 4 tons and Dangoro would weigh 24 tons. <-Using human flesh would mean this is a bare minimum as we know they're far denser than humans.
Note, I'm not affiliated with the 'zelda fanatics' either. Just a guy that likes a debate :T
Originally posted by quanchi112
Also lifting something isn't the same thing as being effective in combat. Russell slaps heads off while Link's supposedly great strength doesn't translate over when he fights his opponents because he needs to use techniques and sword expertise mainly to rely on.
So you admit that Link can lift things that only a superhuman can, as in he doesn't just have normal human strength?
Link having superhuman lifting strength would mean an increase to his striking strength. Its not a direct, 100% increase on both sides but strength means strength. A weightlifter that lifts 400lbs will hit harder than a guy that lifts 100lbs. Even more so for his throwing feats as that strength is even closer to the strength used to attack.
Originally posted by quanchi112
HE ISN'T STRONGER THAN THEM.
Lifting Dangoro [100x peak lifting strength, minimum 45x for flesh] > Half-flipping a small car [5x peak lifting strength].
Throwing a large ball of metal to knock Blizzeta across the room [500x peak strike strength] > Knocking someones head off [5x peak strike strength]
Math or no math, Link is stronger in any physical way.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Why won't it hurt a guy who needs to brace up to stop a goat ? Do you think a goat weighs more than Russell ? Who can move faster as well; the goat or Russell ?
Because said guy can take being fired out of cannons or hit with a stone axe without harm. Russell's attacks aren't as strong as those. Again, you seem to be confusing early game Link with late game Link. You are aware Link gets stronger as he goes, right? As for the goat, sure it could weight more than Russel, but it isn't faster than him.
Link's too slow in any event. Russell kills with blinding speed and strength.
Link's fast, too. He'd kill Russel with sunlight.
Link isn't stronger than Russell. The foes in the game wields the ball and chain much easier than Link. Link isn't super strong in his own game he's strong enough. If Link was super strong he wouldn't need to rely on swordplay and gear now would he ?
No it doesn't. The Darkhammer actually moves slower than Link does while wielding the Ball & Chain, and its best feat is breaking a suit of armor. Link shatters boulders, walls of ice, and tosses Blizzeta around. Fact is, Link is much better than the Darkhammer.
Link is strong enough but at no point in the game is he too strong for his foes. You zelda fans want everyone in zelda to be super strong which is quite frankly ridiculous for any reasonable person to swallow that a guy needs the proper technique to stop a charging goat.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx0Yfg6EasQ#t=51s
Here. And since you seem to like stills more than video I got you this: http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb380/scenario3/Screenshots/swordlock.jpg
Link overpowers Ganondorf, for one thing. He also overpowered Blizzeta. Again, the goat is early and Link gets stronger. Why don't you accept that people improve over time?
Russell kills him before he draws his sword. Russell is far too fast for Link to even draw.
Not according to supersonic Ganondorf.
How isn't Russell strong enough to kill him ? Far less can hurt Link and unlike Link Russell has shown himself to be much stronger than his foes.
Like what? Link has been hit in cutscene with a giant stone axe and been unharmed. He's been fired out of cannons and been fine. Just so you know, these overrule any gameplay damage you might bring up, but if you choose to use gameplay it still means Link can take sword strikes without much damage.
Originally posted by NemeBroDorf never used his speed against Link so saying Link is this fast based on no proof is wishful thinking on top of the fact Russell is faster than Dorf by a mile.
Wrong, since Ganondorf is at least as fast as Russel in terms of his rushdown speed. 🙂Link stabs him and then Russel dies from sunlight exposure.
Russell slaps his head off.
Originally posted by BloodRainIt's more than enough to kill Link considering what hurts Link in his game.
Ok.. I'll let you off on a technicality. Hm, impressive buts its still in the 3-5x stronger than a human level. So lifting a ton or two?Given their inability to float at all, just like the rocks falling in the TP lake, their density would have to be at least double a humans which is the density or rock. See, you can't say what they're made of but we do have their obvious density as a back up. As dense as rocks = as heavy as rocks. That and Link's sword sparks when he attacks their guts.
Even if we ignore the stone and say they're 100% flesh, a flesh Goron would still weigh 4 tons and Dangoro would weigh 24 tons. <-Using human flesh would mean this is a bare minimum as we know they're far denser than humans.
Note, I'm not affiliated with the 'zelda fanatics' either. Just a guy that likes a debate :T
So you admit that Link can lift things that only a superhuman can, as in he doesn't just have normal human strength?
Link having superhuman lifting strength would mean an increase to his striking strength. Its not a direct, 100% increase on both sides but strength means strength. A weightlifter that lifts 400lbs will hit harder than a guy that lifts 100lbs. Even more so for his throwing feats as that strength is even closer to the strength used to attack.
Is 'them' Russ?
Lifting Dangoro [100x peak lifting strength, minimum 45x for flesh] > Half-flipping a small car [5x peak lifting strength].
Throwing a large ball of metal to knock Blizzeta across the room [500x peak strike strength] > Knocking someones head off [5x peak strike strength]
Math or no math, Link is stronger in any physical way.
Skill has to do with punching like say comparing Ronnie Coleman to Mike Tyson. Coleman would humiliate him in a liftathon but Tyosn would rape him in a fight.
I appreciate the numbers but again it's just nerd speculation trying to make sense of fiction.
Link can lift heavy objects but he can't blow or plow through his enemies showing he isn't super strong just strong enough. Russell overpowers everyone in his path due to him being superstrong.
Russell is faster and is portrayed as much stronger. Link is a guy who needs a technique to stop a goat and has to work at corraling a horse.
Originally posted by The ScenarioFiction doesn't need to add up. Link can be hurt by attacks with lesser force than these toon like events in his game.
Because said guy can take being fired out of cannons or hit with a stone axe without harm. Russell's attacks aren't as strong as those. Again, you seem to be confusing early game Link with late game Link. You are aware Link gets stronger as he goes, right? As for the goat, sure it could weight more than Russel, but it isn't faster than him.Link's fast, too. He'd kill Russel with sunlight.
No it doesn't. The Darkhammer actually moves slower than Link does while wielding the Ball & Chain, and its best feat is breaking a suit of armor. Link shatters boulders, walls of ice, and tosses Blizzeta around. Fact is, Link is much better than the Darkhammer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx0Yfg6EasQ#t=51s
Here. And since you seem to like stills more than video I got you this: http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb380/scenario3/Screenshots/swordlock.jpg
Link overpowers Ganondorf, for one thing. He also overpowered Blizzeta. Again, the goat is early and Link gets stronger. Why don't you accept that people improve over time?
Not according to supersonic Ganondorf.
Like what? Link has been hit in cutscene with a giant stone axe and been unharmed. He's been fired out of cannons and been fine. Just so you know, these overrule any gameplay damage you might bring up, but if you choose to use gameplay it still means Link can take sword strikes without much damage.
Stronger in the sense of as a warrior not like ten times as strong or anything you are making it out to be.
Wields the ball and chain with one arm. That's a direct comparison showing vast superiority over Link.
Link overpowers him but can also be overpowered. The guys are pretty evenly matched and no one has a huge advantage over the other. Russell's foes can't take him directly on he's too strong.
Dorf isn't anywhere near as fast as Russell nor does he use a rush like attack any other time like he did against one sage.
Link can be hurt by that axe just because he survives an axe shot doesn't make him immune to said axe. Use common sense.
Russell kills him.
Originally posted by quanchi112He fought Link in melee combat, clearly Link can react to him. Nope, Ganondorf is at least as fast as Russel, I've proved it, you can't prove otherwise.
[B]Dorf never used his speed against Link so saying Link is this fast based on no proof is wishful thinking on top of the fact Russell is faster than Dorf by a mile.Russell slaps his head off.
Afraid not, Link is far too durable.
Originally posted by NemeBroDorf didn't 'show his speed off so he can react to him without him using a blitz. I agree. If Russell doesn't blitz that doesn't mean if someone reacts that they can react to his speed you zit.
He fought Link in melee combat, clearly Link can react to him. Nope, Ganondorf is at least as fast as Russel, I've proved it, you can't prove otherwise.Afraid not, Link is far too durable.
Link isn't durable at all. Russell pokes the goatstoppers head off. Russell is portrayed as super strong Link isn't.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Fiction doesn't need to add up. Link can be hurt by attacks with lesser force than these toon like events in his game.Stronger in the sense of as a warrior not like ten times as strong or anything you are making it out to be.
Lesser force such as...? As it stands, though, a late game Link is demonstrably unharmed by more force than Russell has shown to exert. In the same way, Link clearly becomes physically stronger, moving from goats to Gorons, then to tossing Blizzeta then sword locking Ganondorf. That's a marked increase over time.
Wields the ball and chain with one arm. That's a direct comparison showing vast superiority over Link.
Not really. The Darkhammer still can barely move while holding it, while Link can move much easier. The Darkhammer throws the ball, then takes several seconds to rest, while Link can pull the ball back and throw it again almost as soon as it lands. Again, the Darkhmmer destroys a mere suit of armor while Link breaks much larger, much more durable items, and throws Blizzeta across a room. By feats, Link is vastly superior to the Darkhammer in strength.
Link overpowers him but can also be overpowered. The guys are pretty evenly matched and no one has a huge advantage over the other. Russell's foes can't take him directly on he's too strong.
Russell's foes aren't as strong as either Link or Ganondorf, though. If Russell tries to overpower Link he'll get cut to pieces or thrown around.
Dorf isn't anywhere near as fast as Russell nor does he use a rush like attack any other time like he did against one sage.
He is just as fast, though. The Sage rush still proves he's that fast.
Link can be hurt by that axe just because he survives an axe shot doesn't make him immune to said axe. Use common sense.
Not according to the cutscene. Which is the actual canon, you know.
Russell kills him.
You have yet to explain how he gets past Link's durability.
Originally posted by quanchi112
It's more than enough to kill Link considering what hurts Link in his game.
Casually punching through rocks is > knocking a head off.
Yeah.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Skill has to do with punching like say comparing Ronnie Coleman to Mike Tyson. Coleman would humiliate him in a liftathon but Tyosn would rape him in a fight.
Who hits harder:
1. An 11 year old boxer vs a 30 year old pro weightlifter?
2. A pro human boxer vs a guy that can lift a car over his head and throw it through a wall?
Even without striking feats from the lifters, you know that their much greater physical strength will allow them to hit harder than to boxers. And the reason the above examples are more relevant to Coleman vs Tyson is because these two are in the same ballpark physically, where the strength in this thread has a greater gap.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I appreciate the numbers but again it's just nerd speculation trying to make sense of fiction.
1. Did you miss the last few posts of me saying "Math or no math/Ignoring any figures and going purely by visuals"?
2. Actually its no longer speculation if you have in-game facts and low-ball the answer. We /do/ know how big they are and we /do/ know they're denser than humans, so we /can/ get a low-ball figure as being legit.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Link can lift heavy objects but he can't blow or plow through his enemies showing he isn't super strong just strong enough. Russell overpowers everyone in his path due to him being superstrong.
Just strong enough to do his feats means he is super strong. Don't forget they're also throwing feats, around the same actions involved in slashing with his sword or general striking. When have you ever seen Link fail to plow through enemies? Skyward Sword Link, who's weaker than Twilight Princess Link, was able to plow/rush through a hundred Boblings (stronger than humans) and wasn't even out of breath by the end of it.
Oh, and you're missing a chunk of info there. Yes Russell overpowers his foes, but take a second to look at them. You have frail humans or creatures that are only 2-3x stronger than peak humans. So the characters Russ overpowers are beasts that are half as strong as him.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Russell is faster and is portrayed as much stronger. Link is a guy who needs a technique to stop a goat and has to work at corraling a horse.
The goat before he got the ToC and became notable, and stated*, stronger than the start of the series? You can't use the horse example. Why would Link use his full strength to control his beloved horse? He wants to calm it down, not tear its head off.
(*"You've gotten a sight stronger in the short time you've been gone, Link." ~Bo after beating him in a sumo match, early on in the game. EoS would be stronger still.
Other than the weaker Link or a non-horse-killing Link above, Link has consistently been portrayed to be superhuman. I count 7 canon-to-progress superhuman feats, a few low-superhuman feats and no feats post-ToC that show him to be peak human or less.
Originally posted by The ScenarioLess force can hurt Link in the game. Link isn't shown to be invulnerable or anywhere near it in the game. No, it isn't. Link is strong enough to perform the feats but his strength doesn't ever register to be too much for any foes he faces.
Lesser force such as...? As it stands, though, a late game Link is demonstrably unharmed by more force than Russell has shown to exert. In the same way, Link clearly becomes physically stronger, moving from goats to Gorons, then to tossing Blizzeta then sword locking Ganondorf. That's a marked increase over time.Not really. The Darkhammer still can barely move while holding it, while Link can move much easier. The Darkhammer throws the ball, then takes several seconds to rest, while Link can pull the ball back and throw it again almost as soon as it lands. Again, the Darkhmmer destroys a mere suit of armor while Link breaks much larger, much more durable items, and throws Blizzeta across a room. By feats, Link is vastly superior to the Darkhammer in strength.
Russell's foes aren't as strong as either Link or Ganondorf, though. If Russell tries to overpower Link he'll get cut to pieces or thrown around.
He is just as fast, though. The Sage rush still proves he's that fast.
Not according to the cutscene. Which is the actual canon, you know.
You have yet to explain how he gets past Link's durability.
Russell stops cars casually Link can't even stop a goat casually. Try it at any point in the game never does it get easier.
No, it doesn't since it doesn't look anywhere near as fast nor does he ever use this attack again. Dorf isn't in this thread either.
That's shrugging off one attack common sense tells us that doesn't mean he's immune to axes. Common sense or let Link be hit see if it does damage.
You're exaggerating Link's durability. That's the thing. Russell easily slaps off his head before he can react.
Originally posted by BloodRainLink fights opponents all the time and he doesn't ever do it one time. He needs to brace for a friggin goat. It doesn't add up that way and you need an example for it to be considered a possible outcome.
Gorons punch through stone --> Gorons punch Link --> Link doesnt die.Casually punching through rocks is > knocking a head off.
Yeah.
Who said skill? More to the point, give Coleman and Tyson a sword/bat, who will hit harder? And youre forgetting the important part in how hard they strike/lift to each other:
Who hits harder:
1. An 11 year old boxer vs a 30 year old pro weightlifter?
2. A pro human boxer vs a guy that can lift a car over his head and throw it through a wall?
Even without striking feats from the lifters, you know that their much greater physical strength will allow them to hit harder than to boxers. And the reason the above examples are more relevant to Coleman vs Tyson is because these two are in the same ballpark physically, where the strength in this thread has a greater gap.
1. Did you miss the last few posts of me saying "Math or no math/Ignoring any figures and going purely by visuals"?
2. Actually its no longer speculation if you have in-game facts and low-ball the answer. We /do/ know how big they are and we /do/ know they're denser than humans, so we /can/ get a low-ball figure as being legit.
Just strong enough to do his feats means he is super strong. Don't forget they're also throwing feats, around the same actions involved in slashing with his sword or general striking. When have you ever seen Link fail to plow through enemies? Skyward Sword Link, who's weaker than Twilight Princess Link, was able to plow/rush through a hundred Boblings (stronger than humans) and wasn't even out of breath by the end of it.
Oh, and you're missing a chunk of info there. Yes Russell overpowers his foes, but take a second to look at them. You have frail humans or creatures that are only 2-3x stronger than peak humans. So the characters Russ overpowers are beasts that are half as strong as him.
The goat before he got the ToC and became notable, and stated*, stronger than the start of the series? You can't use the horse example. Why would Link use his full strength to control his beloved horse? He wants to calm it down, not tear its head off.
(*"You've gotten a sight stronger in the short time you've been gone, Link." ~Bo after beating him in a sumo match, early on in the game. EoS would be stronger still.
Other than the weaker Link or a non-horse-killing Link above, Link has consistently been portrayed to be superhuman. I count 7 canon-to-progress superhuman feats, a few low-superhuman feats and no feats post-ToC that show him to be peak human or less.
Coleman lifts a lot more than Tyson so they really aren't in the same strength tie. One is phenomenal is lifting while one excels at punching power. Two different things while one is stronger. Russell is exceptionally strong and is portrayed against his peers as such while Link isn't. Link is portrayed as strong enough. That's it.
I posted a writer laughing at battleboards in the video game versus arguing based off higher feats while ignoring portrayals. That's you.
Russell is overpowering vampires who have greater strength feats than him such as Bill with ease. Russell is stronger than any other vampire by leaps and bounds just because he doesn't have their strength feats we know he's well beyond them in strength. That's called portrayal, featboy.
Link can't tear it's head off that's the point. You ignore his portrayal and these examples. Sorry but he's always been strong enough for the task not some superstrong stud off their radar.
