Beta Ray Bill vs Supergirl

Originally posted by -Pr-
Why should I go find scans to prove a negative?

You're the one claiming she's as strong as he is and as fast as he is. The burden of proof is on you, not me.

I says she as strong as superma and as faster as superman just a example,not true,I'm already say.Pre-52 supergirl just close to superman level,if she not part with superman in strength she at least as strong as wonder woman,You ignore
agian,you even cant prove bill strength can match for her,i dont know why your bump this thread

Originally posted by Sh3nG L0nG
Just because someone doesn't agree doesn't make them fanboys. We're all fanboys to some degree, though.

Originally posted by a88378438
I says she as strong as superma and as faster as superman just a example,not true,I'm already say.Pre-52 supergirl just close to superman level,if she not part with superman in strength she at least as strong as wonder woman,You ignore
agian,you even cant prove bill strength can match for her,i dont know why your bump this thread

Hahahaha

From my limited understanding of the tasmanian languange, I think he just insulted PR in that post. 😂

Well, the little that I'll say about the speed issue for now is that Supergirl did, indeed, outrace her cousin, however much effort he put into it, back in Superman/Batman #19, also known as Supergirl Number Zero.

In Supergirl #5, of course, Superman makes the all but famous speech that his fans love to quote so much,
to the dark half of Kara, created from black kryptonite trauma to Supergirl:

"I could catch you -- and I could stop you
-- any time I wanted to".

Ignored by people is the fact that "dark" Kara does NOT believe him when he says this, and challenges him to prove his claim, which he doesn't.

Instead, Batman makes dark Kara stand down by brandishing his green kryptonite ring,
which, for whatever reason, Batman did not feel necessary until then,
at which point light Kara takes responsibility for herself,
and takes initiative and tells Wonder Woman to bind her
and her dark half twin together,
reuniting Supergirl into a whole person again,
resolving the conflict.

It's worth noting that 10 issues after that point, roughly a year after that story and under a different main author,
Supergirl, now a year older,
STILL DOES NOT BELIEVE SUPERMAN IS REALLY AS FAST AS SHE IS.
She told Power Boy as much when they were a couple, and he did not believe her. Then they ... split as a couple.
Power Boy went mental and physically abusive.
They had a big fight, Supergirl got the better of him, Power Boy retreated a long, long distance away, thinking he had outrun Kara.

Deadly serious this time, Kara makes it clear to Power Boy that she was NOT lying:

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc141/Supergirl_Respect/roundtw9.jpg

At any rate, the point in this thread is relatively moot, unless it takes a form somewhat like the following, namely:

Does Kara need to be as fast as or faster than Superman in order to beat Beta Ray Bill in a fight?

Does Beta Ray Bill resort to speed blitzes or flurries himself against high-level competition?

Will being put at a disadvantage from a theoretical blitz that does NOT immediately knock Bill out
make Bill desperate enough to try a winning Stormbreaker attack,
like teleporting or space warp,
which he might NOT have thought of otherwise?

Given what we know of the characters and how they normally function, what role, if any, will superspeed likeliest play in this Beta Ray Bill versus Supergirl encounter?

Wanted to correct the insane smallness of 2 previously submitted scans, if possible, I don't know that it is, as my final submissions of this morning:

Kara versus Brimstone. Power press and throw.
Teen Titans Fifty Three.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
At any rate, the point in this thread is relatively moot, unless it takes a form somewhat like the following, namely:

Does Kara need to be as fast as or faster than Superman in order to beat Beta Ray Bill in a fight?

Does Beta Ray Bill resort to speed blitzes or flurries himself against high-level competition?

Will being put at a disadvantage from a theoretical blitz that does NOT immediately knock Bill out
make Bill desperate enough to try a winning Stormbreaker attack,
like teleporting or space warp,
which he might NOT have thought of otherwise?

Given what we know of the characters and how they normally function, what role, if any, will superspeed likeliest play in this Beta Ray Bill versus Supergirl encounter?

So Blue who are you picking in this thread?

Originally posted by a88378438
really hard belive it..when hulk struggle lift a mountain
by the way,bro did you see shazam vs a guy who has entire universe matter/big bang?

Originally posted by a88378438
I says she as strong as superma and as faster as superman just a example,not true,I'm already say.Pre-52 supergirl just close to superman level,if she not part with superman in strength she at least as strong as wonder woman,You ignore
agian,you even cant prove bill strength can match for her,i dont know why your bump this thread

If you believe she's close to Wonder Woman, then it's up to you to prove it if you want people to agree with you. A statement about Power Girl isn't proof.

I believe Bill is as strong as her, or at the very least, strong enough that he can hurt her. The difference is, It doesn't bother me if you don't agree, because I'm not looking to change anybody's mind.

I'm just giving my opinion.

==

Superman proved that he's faster than her with his own feats. PLUS, it wasn't just Superman that believed this; It was Batman too.

As far as strength goes, well, they have fought, and Superman showed her up on each occasion.

thread seriously derailed.

I am giving this to supergirl. I think they are closely matched in terms of power and strength however, she is too clever and figures a way to win consistently.

7/10

Originally posted by -Pr-
If you believe she's close to Wonder Woman, then it's up to you to prove it if you want people to agree with you. A statement about Power Girl isn't proof.

I believe Bill is as strong as her, or at the very least, strong enough that he can hurt her. The difference is, It doesn't bother me if you don't agree, because I'm not looking to change anybody's mind.

I'm just giving my opinion.

==

Superman proved that he's faster than her with his own feats. PLUS, it wasn't just Superman that believed this; It was Batman too.

As far as strength goes, well, they have fought, and Superman showed her up on each occasion.

Originally posted by a88378438
you belive bill as strong as her and even cant show us his best strength feats,ah,you got it
supergirl was equal to powergirl in strength and in speed,wonder woman even says powergirl at least as strong as her,that was statement of factCYou don't agree with is to be of no great importance, this is a fact

Huh?
It's not a statement of fact, it's a character's opinion, and that isn't proof on these boards unless it's indisputable, which it's not.

Superman regularly says "that's the hardest I've ever been hit/hardest enermy I've ever fought". It can't be taken as fact, because, like I said, it's an opinion.

Only the writer's narration is fact.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Huh?
It's not a statement of fact, it's a character's opinion, and that isn't proof on these boards unless it's indisputable, which it's not.

Superman regularly says "that's the hardest I've ever been hit/hardest enermy I've ever fought". It can't be taken as fact, because, like I said, it's an opinion.

Only the writer's narration is fact.

Originally posted by a88378438
supergirl fight with mon-el,who close to superman in strength
supergirl fight with Ultraman.who also close to superman in strength
Doesnt matter,because even supergirl not as strong as superman she at least close to him
and again,you not show us bill strength feats,and say he as strong as supergirl just your fantasy
this fight even not a close fight

If you say so.

Originally posted by a88378438
supergirl fight with mon-el,who close to superman in strength
supergirl fight with Ultraman.who also close to superman in strength
Doesnt matter,because even supergirl not as strong as superman she at least close to him
and again,you not show us bill strength feats,and say he as strong as supergirl just your fantasy
this fight even not a close fight

Even assuming you're right and Bill's physical strength is nowhere near close to Supergirl...

That's not factoring in his absurd power output and durability and fighting prowess and general power level. Fact of the matter is that if Kara punches him, he'll feel it, but he's not getting one shot or two-pieced. And if Bill punches her (instead of using Stormbreaker), she's going to feel it. They're not arm wrestling.

Again assuming Bill's might doesn't even compare to hers which is ridiculous.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank

As far as grabbing the hammer while Bill has it and forcing himself to strike himself, in the first instance of Hulk/Thor, it flies in the face of prior stories establishing that Mjolnir will not strike its master unless cursed or otherwise usurped by mystical means. And in the second case, Hulk was mind controlled and turned on Thor suddenly.

Using the hammer against either Thor or Bill is something that is, historically speaking, more unsuccessful than vice versa. Is it possible for it to happen? Sure, it has, after all happened on panel. But the instances of the hammer being unable to harm its master or its master being stunned to the point where he cannot simply will Mjolnir to fly away are more plentiful and as such, more likely to happen.

Assuming what YOU'RE now assuming, for the sake of argument with a88, that Supergirl has superior strength,
also given that most engagements shown of Bill occur in a galactic or outer space setting
(space, of course, being a locale where Stormbreaker's "no lift" clause would be negated)

would not now be an EXTREMELY appropriate time for you to present evidence AGAINST Stormbreaker being handle-able even under those conditions?

For Supergirl's M.O. says she WOULD think of that option and try it.

Even as she thought to use Lantern's ring against him.
Even as she thought to use Flash's speed and pride against him.
Even as she thought to use Cassie's own lasso to bring Cass down.

All of which I've shown in this thread.

You hinted earlier that you might be able to supply scans supporting your position on some things earlier. Your quoted words above suggest you have something specific in mind for this subtopic as well.

Present, please.

Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Assuming what YOU'RE now assuming, for the sake of argument with a88, that Supergirl has superior strength,
also given that most engagements shown of Bill occur in a galactic or outer space setting
(space, of course, being a locale where Stormbreaker's "no lift" clause would be negated)

would not now be an EXTREMELY appropriate time for you to present evidence AGAINST Stormbreaker being handle-able even under those conditions?

For Supergirl's M.O. says she WOULD think of that option and try it.

Even as she thought to use Lantern's ring against him.
Even as she thought to use Flash's speed and pride against him.
Even as she thought to use Cassie's own lasso to bring Cass down.

All of which I've shown in this thread.

You hinted earlier that you might be able to supply scans supporting your position on some things earlier. Your quoted words above suggest you have something specific in mind for this subtopic as well.

Present, please.

I already said it's possible that Kara could somehow use Stormbreaker against Bill. But it's improbable it would happen if we give even Bill a portion of the credit and faith you seem to be giving Supergirl.

We've seen enemies attempt to "hitch a ride" via Mjolnir back to Thor. And while we've seen it succeed at some points, we've also seen Thor either halt Mjolnir in its tracks or just will Mjolnir to fly in another direction.

The crux of this argument seems to be focused around Supergirl using Stormbreaker against Bill successfully, and in order for that to be the case she'd have to

A.) Exploit the no-gravity clause in space
B.) Pull the "stop hitting yourself" trick
C.) Catch a thrown hammer toss and "ride it" back to Bill's face
D.) Somehow be considered "worthy''.

And E.) If she even meets any of the above criteria, she still must be able to knock out Bill or grievously stun him to the point where he can't simply summon the hammer back to him (something that even half dead worthy beings can do).

That's a lot of faith to put into Kara using a weapon against a being who has exceptional mental control and command over it. Stormbreaker and Mjolnir are capable of cleaving through planets to get back to their masters and even tear through time and space to do so. Adamantly arguing that Supergirl of all people will somehow use said weapon against its users to such a degree of frequency and success to turn the tide of this fight solidly in her favor just doesn't sit as plausible to me at all, tbh.

As far as scans go, I'll have to check through my collection of comics.

Even though I don't think Kara would do it but Xenith lifted Storm Breaker IIRC and tossed it.