DBZ: Battle of Gods

What about the translation though.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
In that video, we so most of the South Galaxy disappear lol. I don't know if it makes any sense, but arguing that Broly can destroy a large chunk of a galaxy, at least in a certain period of time, seems to be a reasonable assumption to make.

OI! Do you have an account on Kongregate? If so, do you frequent that place? If so, what is your username, there? Hint, mine is dadudemon. 😐

In fact, my nickname is hardly an anonymizing nickname because I am dadudemon everywhere.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Thank you for taking the time to do this. I started to put together a post like this but abandoned that once I ran into a brick-wall of not being able to find those very specific scenes on Youtube. Kind of makes it difficult to create screen captures of scenes you cannot find. 😐

To add to your post, the closest canon evidence we have of how powerful Goku was around the time Movie 8 took place was the Cell Games and Cell claimed to power up an attack that would have been around star-system busting. Several orders of magnitude smaller than galaxy busting. 😐

So, yeah, there is a massive power difference between the level of Cell-Games Goku and Bills. 😐

I suppose that supports your idea that Vegito really is a multiplication of power. That's just absurd to think about how powerful Vegito really was (and how powerful Goku becomes at the end of the series).

👆 @ the rest of your post.

Originally posted by dadudemon
That video...was...horribly done but the logic is correct. lol

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
In that video, we so most of the South Galaxy disappear lol. I don't know if it makes any sense, but arguing that Broly can destroy a large chunk of a galaxy, at least in a certain period of time, seems to be a reasonable assumption to make.

Clearly the scene of the southern galaxy gradually darkening into nothingness was meant to depict what might eventually happen if Broly wasn't stopped. After all, that scene gave the impression that absolutely everything in the galaxy was wiped out(all stars, all planets, etc.)-- yet we know with absolute certainty that it was not destroyed(see my former post for proof.) Heck, even one of the planets Broly had personally visited was still left intact-- granted he killed everyone on the planet, but the planet itself was still whole.

Originally posted by dadudemon
And if the Mily Way was destroyed, we wouldn't be able to see it on a clear night (or with telescopes). In movie 8, you can clearly see tons of galactic stuff.

Additionally, either the galaxy was destroyed and everything else contradicts it or the galaxy wasn't actually destroyed and everything else proves that.

The scales are heavily in favor of the galaxy not actually being destroyed and that visual sequence was PIS.

I am not really arguing for the proposition that Broly is an ACTUAL galaxy-buster, ala Odin, but one can't really deny what the starting scene of the movie showcased. And one can't really rely on the way the Japanese dubbed English subbed movies narrate the stuff happening either, because they referred to King Kai's planet as a star in the BOG. I trust what I saw in the beginning of the movie, which was a spiral galaxy getting annihilated.

Originally posted by Galan007
While Goku was IT'ing through the south galaxy, we saw him streaking past stars:

If stars were left intact, the galaxy was not destroyed.

Once Goku arrived on one of the planets Broly caused surface-level destruction to, not only do we see another intact planet in the background, but we also see multiple stars in the background as well:

If planets were left intact, the galaxy was not destroyed.

This is an image taken from just before Comet Camori strikes New Vegeta:

Hundreds/thousands of stars in the background+the planet itself. If planets and stars were left intact, the galaxy was not destroyed. If the galaxy was destroyed, we would not be able to see all those stars with our naked eye.

This is all secondary to that fact that IF Broly destroyed the south galaxy, he would have had to do so as a RESTRAINED SSJ, because he never went LSSJ until he battled the Z fighters later in the film. If you believe restrained Broly is a galaxy-buster, then you must also be prepared to put base-level Goku near that level as well, given that he was roughly equal to restrained Broly in his base state.

...And considering that as of BoG, base-level Goku's PL<120m, I find that hard to believe. /shrug

I'll refer you to this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-ZYa0Wnw88
In addition to what I've already mentioned, it also debunks the myth quite well.

Another thing is, even if hundreds, thousands or even hundreds of thousands of stars/planets were left standing, that's still a very, very small part of the galaxy. If I murdered you and left only a fingertip as your only remains, that hardly means that you weren't actually murdered.

I don't trust that video, as that is the typical "DBZ fantards are dumb idiots/They don't read manga/They don't watch original Jap-dubbed versions" type hate "debunking". Not to mention that the Jap-dubbed version is also not exactly clear on whether the Southern Galaxy was actually destroyed or not, as King Kai explicitly notes, "At this rate, even my Northern Galaxy will be destroyed", which mean that the South Galaxy had already been destroyed by then, or was very close to being completely annihilated.

Love the excuses. You seem like one of those "Broly's power is maximum" guys. 👆

Your contention: restrained Broly=base Goku=galaxy buster(in lieu of evidence to the contrary.) Makes sense. dur

Originally posted by Galan007
Love the excuses. You seem like one of those "Broly's power is maximum" guys. 👆

Your contention: restrained Broly=base Goku=galaxy buster(in lieu of evidence to the contrary.) Makes sense. dur

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
I am not really arguing for the proposition that Broly is an ACTUAL galaxy-buster, ala Odin,

What exactly are you trying to argue, then?

We know the galaxy wasn't destroyed, and we know restrained Broly wasn't remotely powerful enough to preform such a feat anyway. There's really not much more to it than that. /shrug

That it should be labelled a PIS high-end feat. Sort of like Hyperion holding apart 2 universes. Or better still, SS2 Vegeta rocking Bills when neither Gohan nor Goku could do it. Just leave it at that, and we're good.

We don't know that for sure though. I have addressed all of your points from the background stars/planets to the issues with dubbing.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Yes, and that hardly means the galaxy wasn't destroyed.

Well, no, the exact opposite would be true: it wasn't destroyed.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
Or whether that wasn't just the regular heavenly bodies that are often shown in the background in space-based settings for a story.

Well, no, that wouldn't be true, either. Even in the dead of space, you cannot really see other galaxies. You have to have high-powered, highly advanced technology to see all that other stuff. Galactic systems, they cannot be. Local stars inside the South Galaxy? Yes, they can definitely be that.

Additionally, the planet Goku visits has plenty of light. A local star was still around.

Originally posted by TheGodKiller
I am not really arguing for the proposition that Broly is an ACTUAL galaxy-buster, ala Odin, but one can't really deny what the starting scene of the movie showcased. And one can't really rely on the way the Japanese dubbed English subbed movies narrate the stuff happening either, because they referred to King Kai's planet as a star in the BOG. I trust what I saw in the beginning of the movie, which was a spiral galaxy getting annihilated.

I partially agree. I just think it was a visual PIS thing. Wasn't intended to show the galaxy getting destroyed. It is possible that it is not PIS and it was just a vision of King Kai. He is technically a demi-god so he MAY have precognitive abilities. I really hate having to explain away PIS and/or plotholes.

Originally posted by Galan007
Love the excuses. You seem like one of those "Broly's power is maximum" guys. 👆

Your contention: restrained Broly=base Goku=galaxy buster(in lieu of evidence to the contrary.) Makes sense. dur

lol, ROFL, you certainly don't pull punches.

Did they need to draw billions of stars and trillions of planets in the film for you to realize that the galaxy was not completely erased, as the opening scene depicted? We saw planets in the south galaxy. We saw stars in the south galaxy. I mean, the notion that the thousands of stars we observed from within the south galaxy were actually in a different galaxy, is one hell of a stretch given that we saw Goku whizzing right by dozens of these stars whilst IT'ing through the south galaxy.

Simply put: the opening scene depicted the south galaxy being completely erased(literally nothing was left.) Yet it was soon revealed that there were still stars and planets left intact. That much alone contradicts the opening scene. It was a prophecy of events to come IF Broly weren't stopped. Nothing more, imo.

And once again: if you're going to credit restrained Broly with galaxy-busting, then you MUST be willing to put base Goku at that level as well. If you're not willing to do that, then you clearly don't have faith in your own argument.

👆

Originally posted by Galan007
...if you're going to credit restrained Broly with galaxy-busting, then you MUST be willing to put base Goku at that level as well. If you're not willing to do that, then you clearly don't have faith in your own argument.

I am definitely not willing to do that for Goku until the end of the manga. Around the end, yes, he is probably at that level because he will have supposedly been strong enough to contend with people at or above Bills' level.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I am definitely not willing to do that for Goku until the end of the manga. Around the end, yes, he is probably at that level because he will have supposedly been strong enough to contend with people at or above Bills' level.

We are talking about Cell-era Goku here, though.

Originally posted by dadudemon
OI! Do you have an account on Kongregate? If so, do you frequent that place? If so, what is your username, there? Hint, mine is dadudemon. 😐

In fact, my nickname is hardly an anonymizing nickname because I am dadudemon everywhere.

I don't think so. If I do, I haven't been on in a while. Is it any good?

Originally posted by Galan007
If Broly is > Perfect Cell, but < Super-Perfect Cell(which is not only the general consensus of the forum, but a logical assumption based on what we saw), then no, that doesn't make sense. In all his ego, SPC merely boasted that he could destroy the solar system. A solar system=/=a large chunk of a galaxy. In fact, the solar system barely qualifies as an insignificant micro-fraction of the galaxy's totality.

Clearly the scene of the southern galaxy gradually darkening into nothingness was meant to depict what might eventually happen if Broly wasn't stopped. After all, that scene gave the impression that absolutely everything in the galaxy was wiped out(all stars, all planets, etc.)-- yet we know with absolute certainty that it was not destroyed(see my former post for proof.) Heck, even one of the planets Broly had personally visited was still left intact-- granted he killed everyone on the planet, but the planet itself was still whole.

I don't care if Broly is weaker then Krillin, I'm just commenting on his ability to destroy a Galaxy. Whether you think that is PIS based on his power levels is a completely separate discussion and not really relevant on whether or not it happened.

Clearly? Based on what? Absolutely nothing supports it being a precognition except it being an outlier for Broly's power level. I might as well argue that he destroyed the Galaxy and then remade it before Goku got there if we want to insert completely baseless plot points.

As I said, not the entire Galaxy was atomized. But a good chunk seemed to completely disappear. Even in the original Japanese version, Kai says that his Northern Galaxy would be destroyed if Broly keeps up his antics. And by the context of the scene, it would have happened in the near future.

Whether or not it's PIS, there's no denying that Broly is very much capable of a Galactic level of power.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Whether or not it's PIS, there's no denying that Broly is very much capable of a Galactic level of power.

The single scene you're clinging to, in which the south galaxy appears to be completely erased, is blatantly contradicted by multiple scenes that occur later in the film, in which can very clearly see that the galaxy was not destroyed. Simple.

Broli is half as strong as Gogeta. Therefore, Cell era Gokou beating him in anyway is PIS. They'd have to have been Broli's level in Fusion Reborn to create Gogeta that was double Broli's power.

Originally posted by dadudemon
I disagree that that is what you were doing. I think you're now backpeddling and trying to save face.

You should use the quote feature more often if you want to avoid these confusions.

He didn't. Something funky went on, there. Completely destroying a whole galaxy, Broly did not.

I'll use the quote feature more often then, if only because I think perhaps you were trying to pick a confrontation with me for the sake of it.

Yeah, what King Kai said and showed about Broly was basically what would or might have happened in the South Galaxy if he had not been stopped.

YouTube video

Makes me more and more eager for an english-dub(enhanced by Faulconer's scores, of course) every time I see something like this. droolio

Also, Goku's line toward the end of that clip made me lol. "The F*ck?!" Heh.