Which team would you want to protect the planet

Originally posted by beatboks
Sorry I though you were abhilegend who called all my post lies ( not sure why I thought that your avitars are not the same or even close).

My point was that even though he would not be fighting less intelligently he would be fighting with far more power and intent. IMO that level of drive would give you more than you would loose. Think of the fact that a human under adrenaline when a child of loved one is at risk can lift a car that they would normally not do. Take that and consider just how powerful a blood lusted Superman would be. The other two incidents I posted however are not in the same mental state. One of them is however before COIE.

More intent and more power, maybe, but against Diana, Clark only does as well as he does because he's a skilled fighter himself. He's not on her level technique wise, but his intelligent use of his strength and speed is what makes him beat her when he does beat her. Sacrifice, he was a ball of rage, and while he did show some decent smarts in trying to take her to the sun, it's a world away from, say, how he was in For Tomorrow, or Our Worlds At War.

Superman is at his best when he's emotionless. Cold, even. Look at Ending Battle, or Our Worlds At War. Or the fight with the Elite. It's no coincidence, imo, that Superman's best feats of combat all came in arcs when he let go of emotion and just became a weapon of extreme intelligence and ability.

@PR Don't deny that Supe's does fight better when less emotional. But as you your self said his skill in combat is still below Dianna's. I would point to the time that when Depowered ( Artemis was the new WW) Dianna defeated three Amazons who had super strength and speed with nothing but skill. Now they were skilled warriors who would have been at least not far behind the combat capability of Superman. With her powers, reflex, and skill ( and I've been lead to believe she's even more powerful NU52 - wouldn't know I've stopped reading) she is still more than enough to take on challenges on Superman's level. The idea put forward by Placidity that her presence in that team brings the team down below the others IMO couldn't be more wrong. She is at least able to match every other character here, and I would argue that because of her skill, tactical mind and intelligence is of greater value than almost all but Thor and Surfer

Superman may be inferior in terms of hand to hand combat, but as a whole, he's a great fighter who uses his powers in ingenious ways, prompting the idea that he can "do anything".

I will say that, really, all the teams are capable of dealing with all kinds of threats and any gap between them are quite minimal.

Yeah, Wonder Woman is no slouch. While I would argue that he's stronger and more durable than she is, she's no slouch, and is a lot more than just Superman's girlfriend.

Originally posted by beatboks
She is at least able to match every other character here, and I would argue that because of her skill, tactical mind and intelligence is of greater value than almost all but Thor and Surfer

Green Lantern, Flash, Superman, Thor, Surfer all have greater value than Wonder Woman. More valuable than Captain Marvel and Hulk though, I'll give you that.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Superman may be inferior in terms of hand to hand combat, but as a whole, he's a great fighter who uses his powers in ingenious ways, prompting the idea that he can "do anything".

I will say that, really, all the teams are capable of dealing with all kinds of threats and any gap between them are quite minimal.

originally posted by PR
Yeah, Wonder Woman is no slouch. While I would argue that he's stronger and more durable than she is, she's no slouch, and is a lot more than just Superman's girlfriend.

I agree whole heartedly with Both Statements. Of course Superman is stronger and more durable. The only advantages Dianna has over him are her skill and her better honed reflex ( please not I'm not saying better speed). The thing is IMO all the members of these pairings can defeat each other with the right circumstance. In character Thor wouldn't beat Superman because of the speed advantage, using the full capability of Mjilnor he would. He could in theory last the distance long enough to bring Mjilnor to bear but IMO facing someone of Superman's power set he wouldn't even then because he would consider than a dishonorable win. He can beat Surfer because with Surfer his power set is such that fighting him with the power of Mjilnor isn't dishonorable because it's fighting fire with fire. The versatility of Surfer power set makes using the uru mallet acceptable within his. Dianna can match most not because she's stronger or faster but more skilled by far and not THAT far behind in teh other abilities. A highly skilled fighter will beat one who's stronger and faster by a bit every time and match someone who is MORE than a bit. Let's not forget that one of Dianna's regular enemies ( Cheetah) speed blitzed Wally. So on and so fourth.

If I wrote DC Comics (and I still hope I might one day), I would write Superman and Diana as having equal reflex speed.

Just So I'm directing my comments to the RIGHT person.

Originally posted by abhilegend
facepalm
^Nearly everything in that post is wrong. Diana never entered speed force, she has never defeated superman and that arm wrestle with cap was a phucking dream.

beating Superman

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045848

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045849

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045853

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267425

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045854

Sorry about the order it's all over the place.

then there is also this time

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2044307

and this time

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267414

No she's never had a good showing against Superman has she. I could pull six more but couldn't be bothered looking for the issues.

Oh and she's Never entered the speed force?

How pray tell did she manage to rope Jesse Quick who had entered it AFTER she'd entered it.

jesse entering, no sign of Dianna or her Lasso

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267422

then she's roped

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2044309

here is Dianna matching, beating Wally before his speed force upgrade

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267400

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267401

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2044305

I still haven't found the other scan of WW and Cap Wrestling that shows the one in Cap's title to be a memory not a dream ( it happened in War of the god's and I can only find two issues ATM) but here is WW clearly showing her Superiority to Cap

she has the strength of Gaea that is greater than the strength of Hercules ( which is what Cap has)

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2989324

one of the three times she has matched or beaten him in combat.

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2989325

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2989326

So please tell me again how everything in my post was wrong. It seems I can back everything up, can you.

This is the second or third time you've called me a liar and when I've presented evidence in scans no sign of you. please back up what you have to say or stop making stuff up.

Originally posted by beatboks
if Dianna nevet entered the speed force how did she rope Jesse quick in it after she she had entered it??

so please tell what else about my post was wrong, or is this going to be like your dissapearing act when you said she'd never beaten Powergirl in that other thread after i linked the scan??

Originally posted by beatboks
Just So I'm directing my comments to the RIGHT person.

beating Superman

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045848

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045849

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045853

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267425

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2045854

She never beat him in sacrifice. He however oneshotted her in the same fight.

http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Strength/striking/WonderWoman219s.jpg

then there is also this time

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2044307

Hahaha, WTF dude? That's from a staged fight from Action comics 600 and Diana was far outclassed in that fight. Heck, she admitted that Kalibak was stronger than her in the same comic.

and this time

http://www.comicvine.com/images/1300-2267414

So please tell me again how everything in my post was wrong. It seems I can back everything up, can you.

This is the second or third time you've called me a liar and when I've presented evidence in scans no sign of you. please back up what you have to say or stop making stuff up.

Abhi, cut the hostility.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Abhi, cut the hostility.

Nice avatar.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Nice avatar.

As this is an unknown threat that could come from anywhere, powers that can provide intel/situational awareness would be the most important thing to start with. Not every threat would arrive as a giant dude with a big sign that says "bad guy" on his chest. And not every threat would come with a big instructional manual on how to defeat them. Hell, one could argue that many threats would probably be completely hidden until the last second or that many of them would be indirect threats that don't have a direct enemy to fight (space borne disease/highly destructive cosmic or mystic phenomena).

For this reason, I choose Surfer/WW but just a bit over GL/CM. Surfer's sheer versatility coupled with his cosmic awareness plus WW's plot device (if we're talking about prereboot WW) gear makes them the most capable at determining what the threat is as early as possible and finding the means to stop it.

Originally posted by abhilegend
She never beat him in sacrifice. He however oneshotted her in the same fight.

Hahaha, WTF dude? That's from a staged fight from Action comics 600 and Diana was far outclassed in that fight. Heck, she admitted that Kalibak was stronger than her in the same comic.

If these are out of context, please point it out. Not being a reader of either Superman or Wonder Woman I wouldn't know. I ahven't read WW since before COIE and Superman since reign of the Supermen. I base my statements solely on these character on discussions/ debates I've been involved in on other comic forums. The fact that several forum members all supported a particular version of events mad me believe it to be the case.

Again a huge lulz. That's Earth-two superman vs Earth-two wonder woman from All collector's edition 54. That was a stalemate where superman looked decidedly stronger than her.

sorry but this line I don't buy. I'm not knowledgeable in Superman and WW but I've been a JSA fanboy for almost four decades. I have all but 6 issues of All Star Comcis featuring them, All their appearances in Adventure, all but two JLA crossovers ( that i had but got damaged), their entire 90's run and 2007 run and about 12 mini series plus JSA classified, All Star Squadron, Young All Stars and Infinity Inc.

I may not know Superman and WW but I do KNOW what E-2 versions look like. That scan simply can't have been E-2 versions because the images weren't teh E-2 sylized ones. Superman's S on E-2 was noticeably different. Up intil the mid 50's it was more triangular after that it was narrower. Wonder woman's Tunic like wise had a notable. The eagle on her uniform was larger, going down the sides of the chest and abdomin not just over the breasts. That image is Clearly Bronze age E-1 versions. The fact that your being so disingenous here makes it harder to accept your above statement in good faith.

I've destroyed far more knowledgeable WW fangirls than you. You are welcome to try though.

Already debunked.

I fail to see how. Jesse clearly stated in the issue ( and being a JSA Fan I read that one) that she had done it, she had reached the barrier of the speed force. She then caught savita ( spelling?) to bring her home. It was after that that Dianna roped her. She clearly roped her at light speed since that is the only way you get close to the speed force. I fail to see how making a statement saying one thing and then posting scans that clearly show the opposite are debunking anything.

Hahaha, that's from JLA:43 and in the same comic Flash was moving at mach 3 speed so he doesn't outspeeds diana.

Curious then that he had such a look of shock on his face that Dianna kept up with him.

Cap doesn't has Greek Hercules' strength anymore. He gets his strength from Lords' of Order.

Sorry but I AM a Cap Marvel fanboy with every appearance he's made since about 1970 ( and that includes the kids line books like Shazam and the monster society etc) and that is just bunk. He referenced the strength of Hercules as late as the last run of Justice Society a few times. Shazam is a servant of Order yes, the god's that gave him the power were also hasn't cahnged a thing. Just like Black Adam get's his powers from the Lords of Chaos courtesy of the deal Shazam's daughter lady Blaze did with Set. He still has the power of Shu, Mehen etc.

Cap was mind-controlled and being drained by Ares. Let's see when he's at his right mind and power sharing vs WW, J'onn, Kyle, Guy and Flash were mind-controlled

Underworld was only a feat of Cap's endurance and durability. Of course he went the distance, that's why he always beats the stronger more Durable Black Adam. Because he can take everything BA dishes out and keep coming back for more until he wears BA down. All Cap did in underworld Unleashed was get his but kicked until Jesse told him Neron's weakness for the seal and he offered himself to neron for everyone else. the selfless of his offer meant that neron simply couldn't take his soul.

Under Darkseid's mental control? Never happened. Before COIE he soloed the whole JLA and oneshotted wonder woman in h2h. She has never beaten him in h2h. He would've killed her if he ever went all out in right mind though.

http://s764.photobucket.com/albums/...erman494p17.jpg
http://s764.photobucket.com/albums/...erman494p18.jpg

Let me get this straight, your saying he did something pre COIE and offering post COIE scans to support it. Dude do you seriously think people are that stupid? In one of your scans is Booster Gold who didn't debut until a year after Crisis.

Your really not doing much for your credibility here at all.

If you're talking about Cheetah, she was amped by Zoom.

No Zoom taught her how to increase her speed. She still had those lessons ( as I'm told) for their next few encounters. As I've been led to believe it WW has fought her at that level a few times. If that's wrong please provide proof, because so far I've a lot less reasons to believe you than those who convinced me of it.

Aim-throwing the lasso. Superman has straight up raced and caught flash.

the scan i showed didn't even use the lasso in it, do try to keep up.

Before Speed force upgrade superman was faster than the flash.

I've NEVER said anything to the contrary. I Know he's faster, that's what Ive said a few times.

You are seriously one of the worst posters I've ever seen with no knowledge of context and straight up lying. Congrats.

That the best jibe you have? I never cared what anyone though of me at 12 I certainly don't now. There's a lot of things I'm hopeless at 🤣 😆

Never happened that either.

Wait, is that DC Captain Marvel or Marvel Captain Marvel? All of the teams are a DC/Marvel split, so I'm assuming it's Marvel, and if it is Marvel's Captain Marvel, are we using the original (Mar-Vell), his son (Genis-Vell), or his daughter (Phyla-Vell). The clarification on this point would effect my answer because a GL Ring and the Nega Bands working in concert could likely accomplish a lot, particularly if it's Genis-Vell.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
Wait, is that DC Captain Marvel or Marvel Captain Marvel? All of the teams are a DC/Marvel split, so I'm assuming it's Marvel, and if it is Marvel's Captain Marvel, are we using the original (Mar-Vell), his son (Genis-Vell), or his daughter (Phyla-Vell). The clarification on this point would effect my answer because a GL Ring and the Nega Bands working in concert could likely accomplish a lot, particularly if it's Genis-Vell.

Damn, good point. If it's Mar-Vell that would change my choice too.

Yeah, a GL + CA wielder (mar-vell/genis) would def cinch the "cosmic/chronal/physical" threat category for team GL/CM. But how will they do vs astral/mystical/divine threats?

I was also wondering which Earth? If it's DC Earth, I would say that Superman's universal reputation might be of just as much use as his powers.

Posturing should almost be one of that guy's powers...