Ironman 3

Originally posted by ares834
So what? The Mandarin was nothing more than a cover for Killian's schemes. Why would it matter if the Mandarin appeared weak?

Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

But shouldn't he make sure Pepper and Maya were not there before he launched the attack?

Originally posted by Slowpoke
But shouldn't he make sure Pepper and Maya were not there before he launched the attack?

Assuming you're talking about Killian, the Mandarin's reputation and the possibility of Stark ruining his long term goals was more important than Pepper's well being (and as we saw later) Maya's life.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Assuming you're talking about Killian, the Mandarin's reputation and the possibility of Stark ruining his long term goals was more important than Pepper's well being (and as we saw later) Maya's life.

No, the virus is the most important thing, if both Tony and Maya are gone, then any of his men could explode and he might not be able to cover it every time, since even he has the virus inside himself.

Also if Tony is gone, Pepper would take over his business, she would be a good choice to be lured to work with AIM.

That's how mastermind do things, they don't just kill whoever taunt them, they carefully make the best way.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

I'll admit that does work. If Killian suspected Stark would have been able to learn the truth he would take him out.

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Mandarin had to appear to be a highly competent and dangerous terrorist figure at all times in order for his scheme to work. Considering at this time, Iron Man was a bonafide superhero in leagues with legendary super soldiers, gamma monsters, and a god, Mandarin taking Stark out in his own home only further made him that much more legitimate of a threat. Plus Tony was going to go after him anyway.

Logically, it made a lot of sense for the Mandarin to accept the challenge than to ignore and wait for Stark to strike first.

That's asking for trouble now. If Mandarin kills Stark, Killian should know the entire Avengers and SHIELD would be hunting for the Mandarin and expose Killian's lie. Having Stark searching for a fictional character is one thing, having Stark's friends seeking vengeance is another. The Mandarin wouldn't look weak if he avoided a confrontation with IM. It would mean he's highly competent not to stir things further. Accepting a challenge would be playing IM's game which is would be stupid yet Killian decided to go for it.

Originally posted by ares834
I'll admit that does work. If Killian suspected Stark would have been able to learn the truth he would take him out.

Also, since he was worried about Stark knowing the truth, why did he pay Pepper the visit by himself, along with the bald guy who does all the secret missions for him? That's asking for trouble.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
But that attack almost killed Maya, who was very important to him. This also showed he didn't put an eye on his most important "partner", who knew almost everything about his plan.

Yeah, and he eventually killed her anyway, when she made him choose. Goes to show he found her useful only to a point.

We could go on like this for pages and pages. We agree to disagree.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
A villain with layers? A middle eastern mad man who hates America. Real deep. You say you would have been happy if the Mandarin was a terrorist enhanced by Extremis? Well... that's what you got. Aldrich Killian was the Mandarin, and he was a terrorist, just a corporate terrorist instead of "I live in a cave" religious zealot one. The idea of a cooperation with military weapons contracts inventing a terrorist organization and using appropriated iconography from various cultures as a means to distract the population and government from their unethical and dangerous experiments while they operate behind the scenes with impunity is scary, and much more interesting than a run of the mill terrorist, even if the guy in charge happens to be white... which is apparently an issue.

Also Killian wanted to partner with Stark Industries to get approved human trials for Extremis. He as grateful to Tony for teaching him the value of anonymity, he said as much in the movie. Killian wasn't out for revenge or to humiliate Tony, he wanted to work with Stark... but Tony calling out the Mandarin on tv, and Pepper turning down his offer forced his hand. Tony inserted himself in AIM's cross hairs, investigating what happened to Happy, but he was never the target or goal.

Killian was a nerdy mad scientist who made up the Mandarin. They say they can't make the Mandarin without adding space rings and yet they did so. Up to the point of the big reveal, he was a layered villain/terrorist that had AIM, 10 rings, and Killian in his pocket. There was character development of the Mandarin but why he hates American ideals wasn't not yet explained. Was there more to his past and why he chose to attack America? Why he considered himself a teacher of sorts. All were intriguing stuff they could've expanded upon without the need of space rings. A shadowy figure ala Ra's Al Ghul would be enough of a challenge for Stark.

Let's put it this way, Killian story was interesting but yeah they decided to go with a cop out corporatist villain instead of developing on the Mandarin. Let's put it this way, Killian might call himself the Mandarin but in no way does he resemble or sound like the Mandarin. Kinsley's Mandarin is pretty damn white if you ask me except he had the persona of the Mandarin until the reveal. I would have gripes too if they revealed the Red Skull was actually Japanese corporatist.

Originally posted by roughrider
Yeah, and he eventually killed her anyway, when she made him choose. Goes to show he found her useful only to a point.

We could go on like this for pages and pages. We agree to disagree.

To kill her is also a bad choice when even himself has the virus inside and it would further make Tony refuse to work with him.

It actually fit his character well, he's just some nerdy scientist who got pissed by Stark, we can't expect him to have the nerve to handle all these. Thus it would be better to let him be recruited servant rather the mastermind behind all the schemes, terrorist cells and the organization. Let the Mandarin be the antagonist would be the best.

Good article here, on why this twist on the Mandarin works so well.

http://www.movies.com/movie-news/why-39iron-man-33939s-mandarin-best-comic-book-movie-villain-all-time/12126

Another Mandarin article. Didn't read, because I'll be seeing this tonight.

http://movies.yahoo.com/blogs/movie-talk/iron-man-3-mandarin-blowback-203853732.html

Originally posted by roughrider
Good article here, on why this twist on the Mandarin works so well.

http://www.movies.com/movie-news/why-39iron-man-33939s-mandarin-best-comic-book-movie-villain-all-time/12126

No, clearly Killian could not handle all the mess and keep make mistakes.

And we don't need the twist to know Killian is the bad guy like BB or TDKR, it was made clear 5mins after the movie started.

Someone on the movie forums made the best representation of this twist.

It was a poor choice but executed well.

Originally posted by Newjak
Someone on the movie forums made the best representation of this twist.

It was a poor choice but executed well.

Nah, Killian was revealed very early as the villain.

Originally posted by Slowpoke
Nah, Killian was revealed very early as the villain.

Yes, but not that he would be THE villain. We all got sucked in by the Mandarin...which is funny, because that's exactly what Killian wants us (and the characters)to do in the movie.

Originally posted by roughrider
Yes, but not that he would be THE villain. We all got sucked in by the Mandarin...which is funny, because that's exactly what Killian wants us (and the characters)to do in the movie.

But we already had such twists twice before in recent year's Superhero movie. 😛 And it was bigger surprise since both Ras' Al Ghul and Talia were shown as good guys before the twist.

And Killian clearly works better as a scientist, a member rather than the master mind.

Funny thing is, what they are trying to do is exactly what Cobra did in the first G.I.JOE movie.

So I really hated this movie.

I think it should have been called Iron Man 6...because it's twice as good as Iron Man 1 and Iron Man 2 combined!

Originally posted by Badabing
I think it should have been called Iron Man 6...because it's twice as good as Iron Man 1 and Iron Man 2 combined!

👆