Originally posted by Taay'hai
Hah! Have you seen his incredible deflecting skills, and his man-handling of Adi Gallia?
Gallia was beaten via the Force. Opress is not an "expert swordsman" in the sense that he is not the product of years of formal training. But your point is well taken: a talentless hack does not hold his own with a leading member of the Jedi Council in a sword fight.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Gallia was beaten via the Force.
This is true, but I noticed that Savage was consistently pushing her onto the defensive and desperate dodges with lightning-quick saber strikes. I also noticed her attempt of a stab/jab/w/e it was on him, but he caught the blade using only one arm and caused her to swing away. This is when he brought down the support like barbarian for the second time btw
Originally posted by Taay'hai
LOL The Revan-masturbater is back!!!!!!
B/W I am fan of Ancient era Star Wars lore. I also like PT/OT era works.
Originally posted by Taay'hai
He defeated Mace Windu once, though he wasn't at his peak.
Originally posted by Taay'hai
Still, if Qui-Gon had the time to reach his full potential--and he didn't, because of Darth Maul's prowess--then I could imagine him possibly defeating Mace again. Still, he didn't live that long
Originally posted by Taay'hai
Hah! Have you seen his incredible deflecting skills, and his man-handling of Adi Gallia?
And am I supposed to be impressed by Adi Gallia? What are her accomplishments?
Adi Gallia turned on her furious-fighter mode against Grievous, and that was impressive. And Savage deflected better than Starkiller against a patrol of Mandalorian officers (Satine's) quite handily. I'd show you but I can't post video links until 20 posts are done. I'll novelize it for you if you want.
Originally posted by Taay'hai
Adi Gallia turned on her furious-fighter mode against Grievous, and that was impressive.
Any well-trained Jedi is supposed to be an impressive fighter. It is no big deal.
People like Revan represent the elites of the Jedi Order; unmatched in skill and power within a span of many generations.
Try to perceive the difference.
Originally posted by Taay'hai
And Savage deflected better than Starkiller against a patrol of Mandalorian officers (Satine's) quite handily. I'd show you but I can't post video links until 20 posts are done. I'll novelize it for you if you want.
Revan actually have a very long and impressive kill record.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
What double standards? I supported my assertion with evidence that Revan's reputation is well earned. You clearly have no counterargument.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
What fearsome reputation? The Jedi didn't fear him.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
You completely missed the point; did you see Revan [B]struggle to perform a feat with the Force? You have read the novel, right? [/B]
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Nowhere during the events (covered by the novel) did Revan bring forth his maximum power on the table; not even during his confrontation with Vitiate.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Feats alone do not prove relative strength of a character in comparison to others in the mythos.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Maul is simply better explored in the mythos in the context of Force powers then Revan. However, given the reputation of latter, he is likely to put Maul to shame in a showdown of Force powers. To give you an idea; Revan could collapse a building if he really wanted to with his TK abilities, as per Drew Karpyshyn. The author envisions Revan as a "very powerful Jedi."
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Heck, Revan is touted as the Jedi Order's strongest champion:Though the Mandalorian fought valiantly, in the end he was no match for the Jedi Order’s most powerful champion. (SWTOR: Revan)
Pretty good hype but not enough.[QUOTE=14302927]Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
[B]No, I pointed out the difference between Anoon's and Revan's respective standing within the lore. Again, what has Anoon done to complement his apprentice's touts?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Obi-Wan was just a padawan during that encounter.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Revan cut a swath through Sith forces stationed aboard the Star Forge; is this not an extraordinary display of skill and power?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Obi-Wan killed Grievous with a blaster.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Their is difference between fighting and winning, genius.Ahsoka have also fought Grievous and lived. Would you consider her on par with Obi-Wan now?
Here;
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Revan's raw power in the Force bends Nyris's Sith lightning back at her, utterly destroying the Sith Lord. (Star Wars: The Essential Reader's Companion)
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Subjective speculation.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
And these feats prove that he can rule a Sith Empire? Their is hell of a difference between managing a criminal organization and a Sith Empire.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Sidious regarded Maul as a rival because the latter was a logical threat to RoT and the former couldn't take chances.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Register this in your brain: Vitiate >> Revan >>>> Maul.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Where?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Absurd comparison. Prove it that Maul can unleash lightning.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I am not ignoring canon evidence; I am critically evaluating the information that you are offering about Maul which hype his skill and power in contrast to his actual performance.If Maul is so well-versed in the dark arts, then why have he not been able to unleash some signature Sith powers that many powerful Sith have demonstrated?
He hasn't? Mastering multiple forms at the highest degree and having absurd strength isn't enough?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
And he still couldn't subdue (Jedi Master) Obi-Wan? In comparison, Dooku have humiliated Obi-Wan like how many times?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Revan is also skilled in all forms of lightsaber combat, as per Drew Karpysyhn.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
- Maul had clear win over Qui-Gon. And Qui-Gon have defeated/subdued any powerful opponent before?
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
- Bondara fell due to the blast.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
- Opress is not an expert swordsman.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
- Obi-Wan isn't the top duelist of the Order.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
- Hyperbole
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
That was a not real Maul.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Revan pack much greater raw power. He doesn't needs immense physical strength to be an overwhelming combatant.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Same is true for you.
Adi Gallia didn't lose--the hall in the ship exploded and then she and Obi-Wan and Cody were gonna get sucked into space. Grievous ran away and she saved them all.
Secondly, I don't really care for Revan's kill-count, because it depends on the kinds of kills he gets. I don't give a flying **** if he brought down a building. There's no building to bring down on a platform. Secondly, he's not gonna have any lightning to deflect back at the team. He doesn't possess every element the team has, and those that he does, the team has to a better extreme with their focused skill division.
Both Revan and Maul have brought down Mandalores. They have both been reborn. They have both brought down several supports. They are very similar, you realize--but I don't recall him being god of everything, such as lightsaber combat.
The Hero of Tython defeated Vitiate while in a Nexus, and the maul bros can still take HoT down. Revan didn't kill Vitiate, and again, he hasn't any chance of assassinating Maul.
"Revan beats Maul head-on" my ass. He has a team with the combined power to beat Revan head-on, and Maul is capable of soloing Revan, or at least holding off against him. Ever heard the term "Ability vs. Environment", btw?
Savage can play hookie with Revan like he did with pedestrians and throw him over the rail of the platform. If he tries to get back up, he can suck Maul's metal boot. Then Bo-Katan and Vizsla can bomb him off.
Intrepid37
He'd still win against most of the Council
Possible, not probable. Opress is Council-level, but he felled Gallia through a Force attack. He's definitely a stronger Force user than most of the Council, but I'm not convinced he's a superior swordsman.
Intrepid37
Not really an absurd comparison. Like you, I say Maul can do stuff he hasn't shown. We are both playing by the same rules.
The TOR!camp generally flinch at the prospect of a debate without double standards.
This will be an excruciating experience for you, my condolences for your patience. 😬
Originally posted by Taay'hai
Well, I saw a post where Maul and Savage run a gauntlet, and the Hero of Tython was on the list, and the majority of members decided HoT would lose. I questioned that myself, but there's possibility for everything.
Thats fair enough. The Hero of Tython isn't really as fleshed out as other characters so it is hard to get a gauge on their abilities. But bear in mind that they did defeat Lord Scourge, a guy who's killed over a thousand Jedi/Sith and scares even the Dark Council. And they became much more powerful afterwards.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Possible, not probable. Opress is Council-level, but he felled Gallia through a Force attack. He's definitely a stronger Force user than most of the Council, but I'm not convinced he's a superior swordsman.
Not every Jedi is cut from the same pie and he should have bigger problems against Grievous than against someone like Fisto in my opinion, despite the latter beating the former.
In a strict saberduel, Opress should have a good shot against anyone but Yoda, Anakin and Mace.
Originally posted by The_Tempest
The TOR!camp generally flinch at the prospect of a debate without double standards.This will be an excruciating experience for you, my condolences for your patience. 😬
What should I expect?
Originally posted by Intrepid37
I was talking about an all-out fight actually, but I agree on a whole.Not every Jedi is cut from the same pie and he should have bigger problems against Grievous than against someone like Fisto in my opinion, despite the latter beating the former.
In a strict saberduel, Opress should have a good shot against anyone but Yoda, Anakin and Mace.
Opress can definitely hold his own against anyone on the Council in a sword fight and defeat any of them in a no holds barred contest thanks to the Force; Yoda and Mace being the accepted exceptions, of course.
Originally posted by Intrepid37
Alright.What should I expect?
Just more of the same.
Accolades only matter when assigned to a TOR!character; accolades for other characters are ambiguous and hyperbolic. Defeating a member of the Jedi Council is paltry, but taking on a member of the Dark Council is the stuff of divinity. Force nexuses are only relevant for consideration when a non-TOR!character is on one; for TOR!characters, they either weren't using the nexus at all, could duplicate the results on neutral ground, or the nexus wasn't a nexus to begin with. Authorial intent and commentary is, again, relevant only when considering a TOR!character's abilities; for a non-TOR!character, if it's not presented in the text then it's non-canon. And if a TOR!character goes up against a random mook and doesn't do so well, then it's only proof that the mook in question is a badass of epic proportions. But if a non-TOR!character goes up against a mook of his or her era and doesn't stomp them outright, it constitutes proof that the character themselves is weaksauce for not beating said mook.
Trust me. You debate with them long enough, you'll see they indulge in all the tactics I mentioned in a single outing.
👆
Originally posted by Taay'hai
Adi Gallia didn't lose--the hall in the ship exploded and then she and Obi-Wan and Cody were gonna get sucked into space. Grievous ran away and she saved them all.Secondly, I don't really care for Revan's kill-count, because it depends on the kinds of kills he gets. I don't give a flying **** if he brought down a building. There's no building to bring down on a platform. Secondly, he's not gonna have any lightning to deflect back at the team. He doesn't possess every element the team has, and those that he does, the team has to a better extreme with their focused skill division.
Both Revan and Maul have brought down Mandalores. They have both been reborn. They have both brought down several supports. They are very similar, you realize--but I don't recall him being god of everything, such as lightsaber combat.
The Hero of Tython defeated Vitiate while in a Nexus, and the maul bros can still take HoT down. Revan didn't kill Vitiate, and again, he hasn't any chance of assassinating Maul.
"Revan beats Maul head-on" my ass. He has a team with the combined power to beat Revan head-on, and Maul is capable of soloing Revan, or at least holding off against him. Ever heard the term "Ability vs. Environment", btw?
Savage can play hookie with Revan like he did with pedestrians and throw him over the rail of the platform. If he tries to get back up, he can suck Maul's metal boot. Then Bo-Katan and Vizsla can bomb him off.
I'm surprised SWL hasn't argued against this yet. Either that or he's building up a post worth the Great Wall of China