Edward Snowden thread

Originally posted by dadudemon
Thankfully, no. Being an educated citizen is all you need to determine whether or not some provisions of a law or constitutional or not. What the Supreme Court decides is not necessarily fact or correct...it's the thing that legally counts.

This is an argument that has never made sense to me. Constitutionality is decided by the Supreme Court, they are correct by definition. What you can do is provide your own, unofficial interpretation.

Or lobby and vote for amendments to the constitution or a president to appoint supreme court judges that agree with you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/23/world/asia/nsa-breached-chinese-servers-seen-as-spy-peril.html?ref=world&target=comments#commentsContainer

So, I think this newest leak adds a new dimension to Snowden's leaks. Before, pretty much all of his leaks were aimed at exposing government programs and espionage that either targeted the American people or American allies, things that embarrassed the country but that needed to be aired out, but now he's exposed what's arguably a legitimate and well-needed service of the NSA, compromising what I would argue is a critical part of the nation's national security.

My original skepticism of Snowden's motives is surfacing again.

Edit: I just realized that Sym hasn't been around for a while. Without him, ON, and King Kandy, this place is pretty slow.

And now Snowden is officially a tool of Russian propaganda.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
And now Snowden is officially a tool of Russian propaganda.

What is he doing now?

"Inteviewed" Putin about surveillance in Russia

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/04/17/world/europe/russia-snowden-putin/

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What is he doing now?

He just appeared on Russian TV to ask Vladimir Putin about whether Russia conducts surveillance on its own citizens, to which Putin replied "we don't have an extensive surveillance system, and if we did, it would only be conducted by court orders."

Many Ukrainians have pointed out that Snowden should have asked Putin about Russia's social network site VKontakte, given that the Russian government recently asked VKontakte's president for the identities of Ukrainians using the service to coordinate anti-government activities during the Euromaidan.

Basically, Snowden just set Putin up for a propaganda moment and in doing so made it clear that if he had principles he's compromised them in exchange for Russian protection.

Edit: I still think he should get a pardon from the US Government, but he's really not doing much to help his case.

Thanks for the update.

That sounded suspiciously similar to "cool story, bro" 😛

Originally posted by Omega Vision
http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/04/17/video-of-snowden-asking-putin-about-surveillance/#permid=11588214

He just appeared on Russian TV to ask Vladimir Putin about whether Russia conducts surveillance on its own citizens, to which Putin replied "we don't have an extensive surveillance system, and if we did, it would only be conducted by court orders."

Many Ukrainians have pointed out that Snowden should have asked Putin about Russia's social network site VKontakte, given that the Russian government recently asked VKontakte's president for the identities of Ukrainians using the service to coordinate anti-government activities during the Euromaidan.

Basically, Snowden just set Putin up for a propaganda moment and in doing so made it clear that if he had principles he's compromised them in exchange for Russian protection.

Edit: I still think he should get a pardon from the US Government, but he's really not doing much to help his case.

That sounds like a huge stretch to me. You've skipped "b"-"y" and went from "a" all the way to "z."

You need to fill in the gaps to justify why you think Edward Snowden knowingly went out of his way to ignore other Russian specific programs that contradicts Putin's answer (or Snowden's intended question).

Check it: I would have asked the same question to Putin as Snowden. I'm all about privacy and all about the government being beholden to the people. But, if I were in Snowden's situation, you would accuse me of being Putin's lap dog for asking that question when I am definitely not.

Originally posted by dadudemon
That sounds like a huge stretch to me. You've skipped "b"-"y" and went from "a" all the way to "z."

You need to fill in the gaps to justify why you think Edward Snowden knowingly went out of his way to ignore other Russian specific programs that contradicts Putin's answer (or Snowden's intended question).

Check it: I would have asked the same question to Putin as Snowden. I'm all about privacy and all about the government being beholden to the people. But, if I were in Snowden's situation, you would accuse me of being Putin's lap dog for asking that question when I am definitely not.

This event in Russia was essentially the same sort of dog and pony show that Snowden claimed made him into a whistleblower with the NSA: that the US Congress was not trying hard enough to shed light on the NSA's abuses and that the NSA was flat out lying or stretching the truth to the American people and to Congress.

It reminds me of Noam Chomsky's critique of his fellow leftists who supported the Soviet Union: he said it was silly to support the Soviet Union just because of American oppression because "there's one big power that happens to have its boot on your neck (America), and another smaller power that has its boot on someone else's neck (USSR)"

And for the record, I'd probably be doing the same thing in Snowden's position. But then I'm not a very courageous person, I certainly wasn't an agent of a spy organization or anything like that...

Originally posted by Omega Vision
That sounded suspiciously similar to "cool story, bro" 😛

😂 It was more like; interesting, but I should keep my mouth shut, because I don't know what I'm talking about when it comes to this thread. 😉

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I certainly wasn't an agent of a spy organization or anything like that...

So, Snowden has replied to criticism about his appearance, saying that the question was a sort of "test" for Putin, to see if he'd be open about the Russian surveillance state. Obviously, Putin failed the test.

I actually believe that Snowden believes that this was what was happening, but I really have to question if he understands how populist dictatorships work.

He seems somewhat naive sometimes.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I'm surprised there hasn't been more discussion about this guy.

Like WIKILEAKS .. Thats an inside site releasing info they otherwise wouldnt also! (Many think)

Its possible! (Most of us knew all this was going on anyway)

guy is a self righteous prick. All he wants is notoriety and money. If he really cared he wouldn't be taking credit. There's many ways to go about releasing the already obvious information that he leaked. He agreed to take the job, he could have very easily agreed to quit the job. He didn't have to compromise everything in between. I'm all for whistle blowers but ones that do it in the right way. What he did, weakened an already crumbling world reputation.

Originally posted by jinXed by JaNx
guy is a self righteous prick. All he wants is notoriety and money. If he really cared he wouldn't be taking credit. There's many ways to go about releasing the already obvious information that he leaked. He agreed to take the job, he could have very easily agreed to quit the job. He didn't have to compromise everything in between. I'm all for whistle blowers but ones that do it in the right way. What he did, weakened an already crumbling world reputation.

Nah

His latest allegation that he was a "trained spy" drew derision from a former CIA director who actually has gone on record as saying he's thankful for Snowden's reveals. The director "questioned Snowden's common sense" for claiming he was a spy and not just an analyst.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I actually believe that Snowden believes that this was what was happening, but I really have to question if he understands how populist dictatorships work.