Darth Sidious vs Darth Plagueis

Originally posted by Vensai
It's official that Sidious is the most powerful Sith. Done.

When the Sith finally emerged from a thousand years of watching and waiting, they numbered—in accordance with the tradition set down by Darth Bane—only two. The most powerful of these was Darth Sidious, an ice-cold, diabolically calculating genius equipped with the strength of the dark side of the Force, as well as an enormous wealth of Sith artifacts, equipment, and knowledge.
--Taken from The Dark Side Sourcebook

these things were b4 Plagueis novel came out..

y dont u answer to my previous argument, instead quoting sources which came b4 the novel. Even Luceno accedes Plagueis was the most powerful until TPM atleast.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Or its saying that when the Sith emerged there were two of them, and the strongest out of those two was Sidious.

the thing is we can NEVER know in the present who was most powerful comparing Plagueis and Sidious, because Sidious cowardly killed Plagueis and did not follow the Bane tenets to ensure the survival of the stronger, while in a PROPER DUEL.

And in a PROPER DUEL, Luceno says Plagueis will have the upperhand.

n dude I have seen your other posts, impressive yes. carefully see my argument.

Darth Plagueis was released in January 2012. The Complete Visual Dictionary was re-released in September 2012 and mentions Sidious as the most powerful Sith ever.

Plaguies didn't even kill his master in a fair duel :I

Originally posted by Intrepid37
Darth Plagueis was released in January 2012. The Complete Visual Dictionary was re-released in September 2012 and mentions Sidious as the most powerful Sith ever.

What about Luceno's book saying Plagueis had the ultimate power and he was the most powerful sithlord ever ? Its right there on the back cover.

We can never know out of the two then.

Originally posted by darth venki
What about Luceno's book saying Plagueis had the ultimate power and he was the most powerful sithlord ever ? Its right there on the back cover.

We can never know out of the two then.

Originally posted by The Merchant
Plaguies didn't even kill his master in a fair duel :I

1. He pulled down the ceiling so fast that his master could not even realize what had hit him.. n his master was powerful too n before he could not EVEN sense. Such was the speed.

2. He did not make his master sleep n hit him. That is cowardly.

3. Tenebrous took out the foresight from Plagueis. That's the reason why he could not sense the danger from Sidious, supposing if u are gonna say Plagueis did not sense too.

4. Sidious did not man-up.

Originally posted by Vensai
Wasn't that just hyperbole? Because there a lot more mentions of Sidious being the most powerful Sith. Your argument is done.
If you have feats of sabers or force surpassing Sidious, put them forth.

I am saying this for the second time.
1. Untill TPM Plagueis is most poweful as confirmed by Luceno in his interview.

2. After that Sidious grew more poweful. But if Plagueis was around he would have grown more powerful too. He already increased his own midi-chlorian count and he was close to immortality. SO we can never know is the LOGICAL POINT.

What interview did he say this?

Originally posted by ares834
What interview did he say this?

You can google it. It was in a facebook interview. He said if it was a duel, Plagueis may have found a way to undermine his apprentice, hence the inference.

So he never said "Untill TPM Plagueis is most poweful". Good to know.

Originally posted by ares834
So he never said "Untill TPM Plagueis is most poweful". Good to know.

OK. 😮‍💨

Originally posted by Vensai

"You have to be Mace or Yoda to compete with the Emperor,” says Lucas in The Making of Episode III

Plagueis was dead by the time of Episode III, of course some dead guy would not be factored into the equation.

During that period of time, Mace or Yoda were indeed the only cool young men who could compete with the Emperor.

I dont consider Sidious cowardly for killing Plagueis in his sleep, I consider him efficent and intelligence. I see it as the same as him trying to flee a fight with Yoda. He has far too much self control to let his bloodlust effect his plans.

He has an agenda, a very wide reaching and long term goal and he isnt going to risk it in a single fight. He might calculate his odds of winning to be 60% or 70%. That means he has a significant advantage but it also means taking on a 30 or 40% chance of losing, and that isnt something that interests him. Part of what made him so successful was his cunning, He doesnt play the odds, he minimizes them as much as possible before doing anything. Once the fight with Yoda began Sidious was anything but scared, he loved it, but it was still a risk hed rather not take.

As far as Sidious vs Plagueis its hard to say. Plagueis was extremely powerful, and possibly could have almost equaled ROTS Sidious had he survived, but you have to remember the act of killing the master gives you a power boost. Plagueis had already recieved it and as of TPM Sidious hadnt so whatever advantage Plagueis held might not have been soley due to his natural power.

Add to that the fact Plagueis was free to spend all his time learning about the dark side while Sidious spent a lot of his time living the life of a politician. This gives Plagueis a big advantage as well since he had been able to intensively work toward reaching his potential, Sidious had been busy focusing on taking down the republic.

Ultimately I dont think Plagueis could have kept up. Maybe if he stayed the master until ROTS he could have stayed close, but once the republic was theirs and Sidious could spend some serious time learning more about the dark side he would have pulled away.

Originally posted by Decay
I dont consider Sidious cowardly for killing Plagueis in his sleep, I consider him efficent and intelligence. I see it as the same as him trying to flee a fight with Yoda. He has far too much self control to let his bloodlust effect his plans.

He has an agenda, a very wide reaching and long term goal and he isnt going to risk it in a single fight. He might calculate his odds of winning to be 60% or 70%. That means he has a significant advantage but it also means taking on a 30 or 40% chance of losing, and that isnt something that interests him. Part of what made him so successful was his cunning, He doesnt play the odds, he minimizes them as much as possible before doing anything. Once the fight with Yoda began Sidious was anything but scared, he loved it, but it was still a risk hed rather not take.

As far as Sidious vs Plagueis its hard to say. Plagueis was extremely powerful, and possibly could have almost equaled ROTS Sidious had he survived, but you have to remember the act of killing the master gives you a power boost. Plagueis had already recieved it and as of TPM Sidious hadnt so whatever advantage Plagueis held might not have been soley due to his natural power.

Add to that the fact Plagueis was free to spend all his time learning about the dark side while Sidious spent a lot of his time living the life of a politician. This gives Plagueis a big advantage as well since he had been able to intensively work toward reaching his potential, Sidious had been busy focusing on taking down the republic.

Ultimately I dont think Plagueis could have kept up. Maybe if he stayed the master until ROTS he could have stayed close, but once the republic was theirs and Sidious could spend some serious time learning more about the dark side he would have pulled away.

True that. I agree he would have stayed close up until ROTS. So up untill ROTS ends, we can never know. Its 50-50 chance for both of them. Remember during TPM, Sidious observes his master as nuclear oval of terrifying energy. So he might have gone on more, if he would have lived. So up untill ROTS it cannot be decided.

Here;

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
To be honest, debates about "most powerful characters" are typically useless. Several characters have received such promotion officially thus far and all of them have dedicated fans. It is unlikely to reach a consensus in this kind of conflicting scenario. Funny possibility is that an official consensus does not exists in this regard either.

Plagueis can be back in EP VII... Its a big possibiliy...

Sure it is. 😐

A major Lucasfilm announcement coming soon it seems 😄 (starwars episode 7 update) http://www.starwars7news.com/2013/08/rumor-ian-mcdiarmid-to-return-in-star.html#more

n Sidious may return..

A major Lucasfilm announcement coming soon it seems 😄 (starwars episode 7 update) http://www.starwars7news.com/2013/08/rumor-ian-mcdiarmid-to-return-in-star.html#more

n Sidious may return.. but i think as a holo recording may be.. or bane may be returning.. who knows.. its all exciting