Why do people hate Americans?

Originally posted by -Pr-
I don't agree completely, but then again, I don't want to get in to some long debate about it, because I can tell that we're not going to agree with each other.

I'm in the middle of waiting for Old Republic to finish updating, and that takes priority over long posts. 😛

Well, then don't get into a debate about it.

It doesn't really matter though, no one tackles the very real oppression of men, definitely no male groups who under some MRA label, all they do is attack feminists and uphold the status quo. Perhaps it's a bit hyperbole to say only feminists of course, there's also other civil rights groups who champion the issue, but there's definitely no mainstream, male group addressing it in any meaningful way.

Tbh, in my experience, the only time ever when "men are oppressed too" comes up with people, is when feminists talk about the oppression women face, and it's basically shorthand for "shut up about it".

I wasn't getting in to a debate about it, just clarifying a point of view. Clarifying, not debating.

Originally posted by -Pr-
I wasn't getting in to a debate about it, just clarifying a point of view. Clarifying, not debating.

Regardless, if you say something that I don't agree with I will point out that I don't agree with it and why I don't.

I can totally understand if you don't want to have a discussion about it, I myself have chosen not to discuss things plenty of times. But that doesn't mean I won't write about why I disagree, you know?

Originally posted by Bardock42
Regardless, if you say something that I don't agree with I will point out that I don't agree with it and why I don't.

I can totally understand if you don't want to have a discussion about it, I myself have chosen not to discuss things plenty of times. But that doesn't mean I won't write about why I disagree, you know?

And that's fine; I'm not saying you shouldn't. I'm just saying I don't want to take it any further than that, even if the temptation is there.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Despite my seemingly pro-feminist posts, I am not a feminist. I agree more with your perspective than Bardock's. I think the "women are oppressed in the US" is mostly bullshit, depending on the particular area you'd like to focus on.

"oppressed" is a bit of a strong word, but "moderately disadvantaged" does fit the fact that women still make less money than men, and have vastly lesser political power and representation. It doesn't remotely compare to what it once was, but much like racism, sexism still exists in a noticeable quantity here in the States.

I mean, this has nothing to do with you, but I hold about as much respect for the "men's rights" advocates as I do for "white right's" advocates; nobody denies that we men have it bad in some areas, but when you control (to ass-pull reasonable numbers) >95% of the world's political and economic muscle, whining about comparatively trivial problems is equivalent to setting up a charity to help rich people, only much less altruistic.

What's ironic is that anti-male discrimination, such as the lack of acceptance of male nurses/cheerleaders, and the inherent advantage women receive in custody battles, has actually decreased correlating with the rise of feminism, yet the people who whine about anti-male oppression the most are the ones that get all red in the butt when they hear the f word. 🙄

Originally posted by Bardock42
To what extent?

To this extent:

Originally posted by Bardock42
Of course men are oppressed by patriarchal gender norms as well. Again, the only one speaking up in any meaningful way about the oppression of men are feminists. The only one doing anything about it are feminists.

Originally posted by Bardock42
Again, the only one speaking up in any meaningful way about the oppression of men are feminists. The only one doing anything about it are feminists.

No and no.

Originally posted by dadudemon
No and no.

If you're referring to useless and bitchy "men's rights advocates", they haven't done a load of crap to fix anything.

Someone doesn't like men, I take it.

Someone's a sock troll. 🙂

Originally posted by dadudemon
Someone's a sock troll. 🙂

Possibly.

Originally posted by dadudemon
No and no.

Honestly, some feminists (who I would call "real" feminists, as they want actual equality) really do speak out about men's issues. but like you said, it isn't only them. Ugh, I'm doing it again, aren't i.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Honestly, some feminists (who I would call "real" feminists, as they want actual equality) really do speak out about men's issues. but like you said, it isn't only them. Ugh, I'm doing it again, aren't i.

So then, by your standards, you're not a "feminist" but you are a "real feminist". The degree of doublethink there is remarkable.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Someone doesn't like men, I take it.

Given that I am male, your ad hominem falls quite flat, kid.

Try again, this time with contentions supposed by some semblance of a logical argument.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
So then, by your standards, you're not a "feminist" but you are a "real feminist". The degree of doublethink there is remarkable.

Not really; I honestly don't know if I would be considered any kind of feminist, tbh.

I just think that feminism, like many movements, has its share of people who try to twist and warp it in to something it's not, that's all.

Originally posted by Master Han
Given that I am male, your ad hominem falls quite flat, kid.

Try again, this time with contentions supposed by some semblance of a logical argument.

lol, you so tough, you e-warrior you.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Not really; I honestly don't know if I would be considered any kind of feminist, tbh.

You defined "real feminism" as people who want equality. Would you say you don't want equality?

Originally posted by -Pr-
lol, you so tough, you e-warrior you.

Don't give this speech when you started off the bat by insulting me, despite our having no beef or problem whatsoever.

So, terrible sportsmanship and unwarranted hostility aside, taking shots at other people without actually positing an argument is just poor taste.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You defined "real feminism" as people who want equality. Would you say you don't want equality?

I scrolled back up to read your post and now I don't see it. 😐

Edit: Weird, now it's there again.

Anyway, I was saying what I only think would constitute a real feminist i.e. from my limited understanding of feminism, its true goal is equality between the sexes. That's what I've read as being the true motivation behind it. I could be wrong.

What double thinking are you talking about, exactly?

Originally posted by Master Han
Don't give this speech when [b]you started off the bat by insulting me, despite our having no beef or problem whatsoever.

So, terrible sportsmanship and unwarranted hostility aside, taking shots at other people without actually positing an argument is just poor taste. [/B]

The irony in your statement speaks volumes about your intent to troll, tbh.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Possibly.

Honestly, some feminists (who I would call "real" feminists, as they want actual equality) really do speak out about men's issues. but like you said, it isn't only them. Ugh, I'm doing it again, aren't i.

Yes, there is an egalitarian movement. 😄

Originally posted by -Pr- \
The irony in your statement speaks volumes about your intent to troll, tbh. [/B]

Interesting. You call me a troll, yet I'm the only one here providing an actual argument, and you initiated hostilities with a pointless ad hominem.

Basically, your logic boils down to "anyone who disagrees with me is a troll!" 🙄

Originally posted by dadudemon
What you are describing as "real feminists" are actually called egalitarians. And there are several feminist movements with different ideologies.

Yes, there is an egalitarian movement. 😄

Oh, okay; my bad then.

I've only recently began looking in to this kind of thing, so I'm sure that If I'm wrong, I'll be corrected.

Originally posted by Master Han
Interesting. You call me a troll, yet I'm the only one here providing an actual argument, and [b]you initiated hostilities with a pointless ad hominem.

Basically, your logic boils down to "anyone who disagrees with me is a troll!" 🙄 [/B]

No, that's not it at all, but how presumptuous of you to say so.

Hell, I wasn't even the first person to accuse you of trolling.