Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
actually it most certainly does... The only expression of doom from the emperor we see is when Yoda is WITHOUT his saber and the lighting is arching back at him. This isn't my opinoin it is in the highest form of canon. Sids also doesn't knock Yoda back with his lighting and then yoda drops his saber and it wasn't in mid air either... Yoda lands on the pod.. ignites his saber.. .and palps blasts it out of his hand and yoda barely moves (is NOT thrown back) These aren't my opinions these are right there for all to see. The movie is the final version of the script...
Watch the saber fight again. Palpatine is grunting and howling when they are dueling in the pod, this goes in line with Sidious being disarmed.
Also I wish they would have kept this in the movie.
@Intrepid- speed is an important part of saber fighting. It can be just as important as sheer technical skill. Someone can have more technical skill and still lose to someone who has superior speed. Sidious blitzing those masters is still a saber feat. If you're suggesting that Yoda is more skilled, well I agree, as he seems to have more accolades than Sidious regarding his saber skills.
I never says it wasn't in line with sidous being disarmed.. what I'm talking about is Yoda being disarmed and it not happening like in the script thus the movie is what we go by. Same for the emperor getting lighting arcing back.. this again didn't happen when Yoda had his saber but when Yoda had no saber and the emperor seemed doomed.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
@Intrepid- speed is an important part of saber fighting. It can be just as important as sheer technical skill. Someone can have more technical skill and still lose to someone who has superior speed. Sidious blitzing those masters is still a saber feat. If you're suggesting that Yoda is more skilled, well I agree, as he seems to have more accolades than Sidious regarding his saber skills.
What he is saying is abundantly clear.. Yoda disarming Sids and beating him in sabers... IS a saber feat... and a greater one than what Sids did to the Jedi. If sids is able to do that to the jedi... and Yoda is able to do that to Sids... well then... That is the better feat. To say nothing of Sids losing twice in saber combat to Mace and Yoda and yoda not having any losses in saber combat. Yoda has the greater feats and that can't be questioned really.
Originally posted by Stigma
^ I pretty much agree with the above, however I would say that Yoda has a bit better chance at taking down RotJ Sidious than his RotS incarnation.Of course, this is only my gut feeling. To me RotJ Sidious is most probably more powerful in the Force, but not necessarily a more powerful combatant given his possibly rusty saber skills at that time.
Well, Sidious's best Force feats occur after his RotS incarnation, and while his saber skills could have deteriorated, by that same logic they should have already declined by RotS. And I don't see why Sidious wouldn't practice his saber techniques, to keep Vader in his place, if nothing else.
But then again, I could say the same about Obi Wan. I guess everybody just sat on their asses and grew old.
Originally posted by Master Han
Well, Sidious's best Force feats occur after his RotS incarnation, and while his saber skills could have deteriorated, by that same logic they should have already declined by RotS. And I don't see why Sidious wouldn't practice his saber techniques, to keep Vader in his place, if nothing else.
Originally posted by Master Han
But then again, I could say the same about Obi Wan. I guess everybody just sat on their asses and grew old.
Originally posted by SIDIOUS 66
Nai is a better debater than me at some things like interpreting literature perhaps, but he's not when it comes to arguing combat ability in a vs forum.
You do grasp the apparent contradiction here, right? Apparently not.
If I'm your superior in interpreting literature, it follows, that I'm also your superior in a field that is based almost solely on that particular skill.
Your inability to grasp that fact, already shows how "skilled" you are, when it comes down to analysis and the forming of coherent arguments.
And to add the icing to this particularly ugly cake: You might consider the fact, that I'm operating under aggravated conditions here, given that I'm neither utilizing my primary language (which would be German) nor arguing to convince people of my personal opinion.
Yet, unlike you, I'm not the only person recognizing my own skill as a debater. In my case, that particular trait has been lauded even by my most notorious opponents in this forum, including the likes of Lightsnake and Gideon.
In short: Just because you're allowed to take the field in the same arena as yours truly, you're not necessarily playing in the same league. 😉
And just to stay on topic:
Originally posted by The_Tempest
SIDIOUS_66 makes a convincing argument that Palpatine's disarming by Yoda was the product of the uneven terrain. Palpatine drops his lightsaber, per the script, when threatened with a fall from the Chancellor's podium. On flat terrain, that probably won't happen.
Sidious was holding the superior position during that section of the duel, forcing Yoda to - quite literally - run circles around him. I don't see how the apparent disarming could have been a question of "uneven terrain". In fact, Yoda on "equal ground" should give Sidious much more trouble, considering the fact, that - in such a situation - the Sith Lord would be limited to about 1/3 of his arsenal of lightsaber moves, because of Yoda's hight.
I'd also like to point to some facts considering the saber ability of Sidious. "Darth Plaguies" reveals quite nicely, that Sidious master wasn't fond of lightsaber duels. He actually dispised the art. The only formal training that Sidious - according to that novel - received in the art, are contests versus droids and a ritual slaughter of technologically inferior non-force-sensitives. Hardly a base to assume formal lightsaber mastery on a "technical" level.
And there are the following inconvenient facts: Sidious was - in the very same source - disarmed by Mace Windu. On equal ground. While Mace usually is viewed as Yoda's inferior in both lightsaber skill and force ability. So why shouldn't Yoda be capable of archiving the very same?
You see. I don't want to cast doubt on Sidious' deadliness with a lightsaber. Given his force mastery (that translates into precognition, manipulation of opponents and sheer speed) he is, most certainly, a formidable opponent. But once his strength in the force is either negated (as in the duel vs Mace) or matched (his duel with Yoda), he will most likely lose in armed confrontations. This even hold true to his DE incarnation. Once Leia starts negating Palpatine's "dark side version" of battle meditation, even Luke Skywalker is capable of disarming the Sith Lord.
Sidious never was the "fighter type" of a Sith Lord, and I find it rather irritating, that people feel the need to convince others, that he is a monster with a lightsaber in hand.