Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer has never crossed Galaxies in seconds.I don't think he has ever crossed galaxies on panel.
Surfer travels across 1000 entire universeS in seconds. imo ... less than 10 seconds! 👆
(HOW many "seconds" exactly though... that's open to interpretation)
Surfer takes off from Earth and first visits Zenn-La, then he begins his speed feat journey.
It is not outright stated it was "in seconds" ...
but I easily reached this conclusion from the following two pages.
Although I believe this,
I also think the "speed" of the feat is open to interpretation based on how one views the circumstances.
Basically, as Surfer leaves Zenn-La to find a race called the "Decimators" (located 1000 universeS away)
Human Torch lets off his full power and is no sold, literally, "seconds later" it's over,
because Surfer already reached the reality of the "Decimators" located 1000 universeS away.
We don't see him crossing those universes though.
He flies to Zenn-La and then flies off planet, but the rest happens off panel.
We don't know how he got there, and its not unlikely that he could have used his cosmic awareness to pin-point the location and then opened a portal to get there faster.
We have a prior feat posted of him crossing 500,000 light years by opening a portal, for example. So we know Surfer is prone to opening hyperspace portals to cross vast distances.
Believe it or not, even if we took it straight, travelling to the source wall would still be a comparable or better feat than that. DC's universe is at least hundreds of trillions of light years in size. Which would make it thousands of times bigger than a normal universe.
Originally posted by CosmicCometThe same could be said about those unknown Universes Surfer crossed. It's far better than the source wall feat though.
We don't see him crossing those universes though.He flies to Zenn-La and then flies off planet, but the rest happens off panel.
We don't know how he got there, and its not unlikely that he could have used his cosmic awareness to pin-point the location and then opened a portal to get there faster.
We have a prior feat posted of him crossing 500,000 light years by opening a portal, for example. So we know Surfer is prone to opening hyperspace portals to cross vast distances.
Believe it or not, even if we took it straight, travelling to the source wall would still be a comparable or better feat than that. DC's universe is at least hundreds of trillions of light years in size. Which would make it thousands of times bigger than a normal universe.
It isn't, seeing as the DC universe is confirmed to be at least hundreds of trillions of lightyears in diameter, and that would still be a low-ball.
Our own universe itself is only around 90 billion lightyears.
Since we don't have numbers for those universes that Surfer supposedly crossed, we have to assume that ~90 billion lightyears is the average size for them.
That and if he opened a wormhole, it disqualifies it as a straightforward speed feat anyway.
I said we can assume they average out to 90 billion lightyears. That's a minimum.
We can assume they vary in size and still assume the average of them is 90 billion light-years. That's not a contradiction.
And that's only for the purposes of the specific universes that were crossing over. Seeing as the cosmologies from the cross-over conflict with the main DC/Marvel universes' respective cosmologies, it wouldn't be the same thing being compared.
^ 😐 ... the average universe in Marvel is infinite.
As mind-boggling as it is, the next universe is an infinity away. Then the next, another infinity away, etc to infinitum.
Also, we see the Surfer fly away into the distance, not into a portal/wormhole,
not unlike the Adjudicator's travels to Earth from its location, also entire universeS away:
Surfer 71016 is no joke.
The same kinda of infinite hyperbole label exists for the DC universe.
Obviously reaching the source wall or the end of a marvel universe is not an infinite speed feat, because that would be akin to omnipresence. Neither Flash/Surfer/Superman etc are omnipresent in speed, obviously.
So, in the interest of actually being able to quantify, that's why we need an actual size to calculate.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Also, we see the Surfer fly away into the distance, not into a portal/wormhole,
Not quite, we merely see him flying away from shala bal while still in zenn-la's atmosphere.
We dont see his actual trip to find the decimators. Obviously opening a wormhole is done once he is actually in space and not while he is still on the planet. And opening wormholes is his preferred method of traversing huge swathes of space going by history. So that makes it uncertain
Originally posted by CosmicComet
The same kinda of infinite hyperbole label exists for the DC universe.Obviously reaching the source wall or the end of a marvel universe is not an infinite speed feat, because that would be akin to omnipresence. Neither Flash/Surfer/Superman etc are omnipresent in speed, obviously.
So, in the interest of actually being able to quantify, that's why we need an actual size to calculate.
So if we don't have that, stop lowballing the feat. And stop assuming he opened up a wormhole which we don't see and would take time to open up. **** the Source Wall, too. You act like that's some sort of be all end all speed feat that no one else could accomplish. Surfer, Gladiator, Runner, Thor, Scuttlebutt could surf that thing like a skate park.
Lol, here's you wormhole theory right here
.....IN LESS TIME THAT IT TAKES TO READ THESE WORDS (which is a matter of seconds)
.....THE ADJUDICATOR FLASHES PAST ENTIRE UNIVERSES (which is on panel)
......NOT IN A SPACESHIP......BY PROPELLED BY A FORCE BEYOND HUMAN COMPREHENSION.
There you have it D.C. lowballers,, you cannot spin this. No wormhole to speak of. I'm sure the next step is for attorney Comet to argue the term universes means two. 😆 This feat shits on errthing. Flashes past universes in seconds, deal with it.
Re: Lol, here's you wormhole theory right here
Originally posted by Blue Area VetExcept its not canon to 616 Surfer regardless of how you spin it. It's Earth-71016
.....IN LESS TIME THAT IT TAKES TO READ THESE WORDS (which is a matter of seconds).....THE ADJUDICATOR FLASHES PAST ENTIRE UNIVERSES (which is on panel)
......NOT IN A SPACESHIP......BY PROPELLED BY A FORCE BEYOND HUMAN COMPREHENSION.
There you have it D.C. lowballers,, you cannot spin this. No wormhole to speak of. I'm sure the next step is for attorney Comet to argue the term universes means two. 😆 This feat shits on errthing. Flashes past universes in seconds, deal with it.
Re: Re: Lol, here's you wormhole theory right here
Originally posted by Juntai
Except its not canon to 616 Surfer regardless of how you spin it. It's Earth-71016
Except I'm not arguing that. I'm addressing the D.C. acolytes who are so delusional and entitled they would go to great efforts to poke holes in the fears of a non cannon Surfer showing. Surfer is the stuff of nightmares.
Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
So if we don't have that, stop lowballing the feat.[/b]
You aren't used to actually calc'ing feats or doing anything resembling actual debating on these forums so I will give you a pass here for not knowing the typical steps you take when you are trying to quantify something: You establish a lower bound.
That's what you go by, especially when an upper bound is unknown or impossible to establish(such is the case for a lot of feats).
I also did that for the Source Wall, I established a low-ball figure. Though I'm sure the reality of consistent practices escaped you.
And stop assuming he opened up a wormhole which we don't see and would take time to open up. **** the Source Wall, too. You act like that's some sort of be all end all speed feat that no one else could accomplish. Surfer, Gladiator, Runner, Thor, Scuttlebutt could surf that thing like a skate park.
You are free to believe what you want about what's possible, but what can you prove is another matter?
Of the feats posted prior to this;
A.) Surfer crossing 1 lightyear in a fraction of a second
and
B) Surfer crossing 500,000 lightyears in seconds which he circumvented by opening up a portal anyway (which btw took him no time at all to open up, so a false premise on your part).
Neither of those could compete.
This is the one feat posted so far that at the lower bound may be close to comparing, or in the unknown upper bound may be even beating Flash's demonstrated speeds.
But, it comes with caveats.
1. It's non-canon first of all. So...yeah.
2. Sizes of said universes are unknown. But assuming said universes are the size of...actual universes...is hardly low-balling or illogical. Especially because of pocket dimensions that would still count as universes by denominations even if they are fractions of the size.
3. It is impossible to say Surfer didn't use a wormhole since we did not witness his actual travel there, it was off panel. Likewise, using wormholes is entirely within his character to do and something he uses all the time and since he was in a rush, it would also have been the most expedient thing for him to do. And Surfer is nothing if not a pragmatist.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Can you not post without attacking people?
I'm generalizing among a minority group of board members who are staunch D.C. fans who constantly band together to discredit Marvel characters and Marvel character feats. You see it just like I do. I didn't attack anyone individually. Attacking is what posters including you do to Carver on an ongoing basis.
