Calm the shit down Ant.
Originally posted by Selenial
Why else do you think she HAD to activate the MSG?
Wasn't it implied that Revan was disposing of the elements under his command who weren't loyal to him at Malachor? If Meetra was commanding such a large force, it's likely many of them hadn't been converted to Revan's side. So Revan used her forces to activate it and take heavy loses in the battle and MSG.
Originally posted by Selenial
Obviously know nothing about the mandalorian wars.Revan was an average battle tactician at best, his genius came on a galactic scale, sacrificing millions of lives and countless worlds to gain a tactical advantage.
His greatest genius was learning not to act like a Jedi.
This really made me laugh. I don't even like smiling.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Calm the shit down Ant.Wasn't it implied that Revan was disposing of the elements under his command who weren't loyal to him at Malachor? If Meetra was commanding such a large force, it's likely many of them hadn't been converted to Revan's side. So Revan used her forces to activate it and take heavy loses in the battle and MSG.
Yes.
Because most of the generals had formed a Bond with Surik.
He was even eliminating her, because shed confronted him about the disappearances of Jedi etc.
Alright, some random stuff that I've picked up on that is worth... correcting:
Originally posted by NephthysAll we've really seen from these figures is X beating Y etc. but we really haven't seen enough to accurately judge their mastery over Control, Sense and Alter, or rather things like healing, foresight and telekinesis. Simply put while we can acknowledge them as powerful, we can't say quite how powerful, IMO.
Can't say I see the logic in that. Even without many sources, the Swtor protagonists have the raw feats to stand among the giants of the mythos.The Hero of Tython defeating Scourge and Vitiate and resisting the direct influence of Sel Makor, the Second Wrath defeating some of the top duelists of the age as well as the Voice, several Dark Council members and Baras, Nox wielding the combined power of 5 force spirits and godstomping Thanaton and the Barsen'thor ripping through massive blast doors, defeating Vivicar while he's channeling power from hundreds of Jedi Masters and defeating the First Son, all of these show immense power and skill. They easily rival many of the characters on your "most powerful" list on these feats alone.
Originally posted by NephthysI don't think the Exile actually did sever Traya from the Force, however clearly somehow they're bond was severed. I think it probably was down to Traya tricking her into thinking she was a Sith Lord i.e. betraying her and that broke the bond.
Hello Selenial. I can reply directly to your response to me in the Swtor forums if that's ok with you:Isn't this mere supposition on your part? It's a much simpler explanation that the Force Bond simply continued to exist up until Traya's death, which was what severed it. Traya had obviously lied about the Force Bond being fatal in the case of her death considering every Jedi Master reacts to that info with "wtf that sounds dumb".
Pipe down please Legend, and don't use obscene language, that kind of stuff is censored on SWTOR forums and I'm sure its a violation of KMC rules as well.
This is your supposition, not a valid point.Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia reveals that Emperor Vitiate transformed Dark Temple in to a nexus of the dark side. If Emperor Vitiate, specifically transformed this place in to a nexus of the dark side, then how the hell is this even possible if entire planet is a nexus?
Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan doesn't confirms Dromund Kaas as a nexus of the dark side on the whole either. Strong in the dark side? yes.
Don't make stuff up.
Anyway, Selenial is correct, the entire planet is a dark side nexus:
...The planet was shrouded in a pervasive miasma of dark side energy...
--Taken from Wookieepedia, source from Fate of the Jedi: Ascension.
It unsurprising that you are unfamiliar with this source.
Anyway, the entire planet, much like Korriban and Ziost was a DS nexus. But Sith monuments on the said planet were designed as focal points for that energy, channeling it by way of Sith architectural designs - really you should be aware this, we are talking general knowledge here.
P.S. the definiton of a Force nexus is any area unusually strong in the Force, Kaas is more steeped in the DS of the Force than an average planet and is therefore a DS nexus.
Again general knowledge here.
Originally posted by NewGuy01A purely personal decision unfortunately as they rest on the same level of canon. The fact of the matter is if the Jedi Exile can take on an entire academy of Sith Asassins and Dark Jedi (literally hundreds) defeat Darth Sion three times and then go on to defeat Darth Traya - both incredibly powerful Force Users - in arguably the strongest dark side nexus in the galaxy, then she should be more than capable of taking on one lone DC member - whose abilities fail to stack up to that of Darth Traya. Yet she cannot. This is a canonical inconsistency that we the fans, have been forced to reconcile. Taking into account of course that in a contest of knowledge Drew is royally trumped by the character's creators. KOTOR II is the superior source.
I am very fond of Traya as well.Sadly, the case with the Exile is that her potential greatness was stripped away by the "Revan" novel. I rarely take a video game over a novel in terms of reliability, if ever.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDYou must have been preparing this for some time, because is an age since you last abadoned that discussion, a discussion I'd be happy to continue.
I have noticed immense lowballing of Sith Emperor from Beniboybling.I have prepared a response for "Sith Emperor versus Darth Caedus" analysis by him. However, I expect dismissal without valid reasoning. He have a habit of discrediting and overlooking some facts concerning Sith Emperor but he pretends to pay attention.
Darth Caedus is not as strong as Sith Emperor, period.
Also, Vader above Revan? Seriously?
And yes, lol, I pretend to pay attention. Petty attacks at my credibility and no match for strong cohesive arguments that you are sorely lacking in.
Darth Caedus is stronger than the Sith Emperor, until you can adequately prove otherwise, insofar you have failed to do so.
And of course Vader is more powerful than Revan. He is 80% the strength of Sidious, power who Revan is evidently dwarfed by.
Originally posted by NewGuy01Exar Kun, Ulic, Vader and I believe Sidious - probably also the Sith Emperor, since his contemporaries invented the technique and he managed to replicate a facsimile of it (and survive the outcome). Its just a question of knowing how to lock your energy inside of you I suppose, but probably reliant on will primarily.
That's been brought up before, but how many people do you think know that technique?
And that is all for now.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66All Force Drain is the same, Nihilus being a Force Wound only amplifies his powers. Darth Traya herself confirms the power Nihilus uses is the same power that everyone else in the academy uses, including herself.
😂 You think I don't know this? 🙄Nihilus' drain is different from natural drain, due to being a wound. His Force Drain, like The Jedi Exile's, is different. It is out of instinct. They feed off others to satisfy their hunger (even if they don't know it).
I wouldn't classify it the same as the Dark Harvester.
For ultimately what they are doing is siphoning the Force connections of their opponents (or allies). This is exactly what the Dark Reaper does.
Taking into account of course that in a contest of knowledge Drew is royally trumped by the character's creators. KOTOR II is the superior source.
Darth Traya herself confirms the power Nihilus uses is the same power that everyone else in the academy uses, including herself.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66Says who? Leland Chee?The Revan novel is a newer source of canon, meaning it is capable of retconning earlier sources, not vise versa.
Quote? [/B]
You don't define the rules of canon. New sources do not automatically surpass old sources, and old sources can retcon new sources.
Unless of course, you have an official statement/proof regarding this.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
You don't define the rules of canon. New sources do not automatically surpass old sources, and old sources can retcon new sources.
The definition of the word "retcon" is as follows:
"(in a film, television series, or other fictional work) a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency."
The new Revan novel established a different interpretation of the Exile's powers then we previously believed.
Quote?I assume you've played KOTOR II? Well perhaps not.
Here is the quote:
These Sith we face, they have learned how to do this. It is a technique that has been lost for some time, not seen in the days since the ancient Sith. They can use it to consume other Force sensitives. And at the highest pinnacle of power, use it to consume anything that lives. The blind seer, her master has harnessed this technique, and he is rapidly approaching the height of it's power. I fear he may even rival some of the ancient Sith. He is already a more of a force than a living thing, a hole in the Force, that threatens to draw everything into it. And the teaching must die with him, or else all life will be placed in jeopardy.
As you can see she speaks of the Sith as a whole. The entire game revolves around this single power.
I fail to understand how this states Nihilus' drain is the same as others, because according to Traya, it is not.
"It cannot be taught…it can only be gained through instinct, through experiencing its effects, first-hand."
―Kreia (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic II)
---meanwhile---
"Darth Traya indeed teaches the newly christened Darth Nihilus to harness his life-draining gift to radical heights"
―Knights of the Old Republic Campaign Guide
Nihilus' technique cannot be taught, yet Traya's can. Traya's is the same as the rest of the Sith's. Traya teaches Nihilus how to expand his unique Force Drain like no ways before, though as just shown, his power is different.
Originally posted by DarthAnt66Yet no such retcon has occured.
The definition of the word "retcon" is as follows:"(in a film, television series, or other fictional work) a piece of new information that imposes a different interpretation on previously described events, typically used to facilitate a dramatic plot shift or account for an inconsistency."
The new Revan novel established a different interpretation of the Exile's powers then we previously believed.
What we have here is a clash in two canonical sources equal in value, in accordance with Star Wars continuity such a clash would be resolved either by a statement by Leland Chee or a new piece of continuity being released that reconciled the two sources.
However the only instance in which sources can override other sources is if one is on a higher level of canon, then it is automatically assumed that the original source was inaccurate (being on a lower level of canon i.e. a foggier window) with the new higher level source being the accurate depiction.
But no retcon has been made in so far, and neither source exists on a higher level of canon so we cannot argue that one is inaccurate.
EDIT: Basically your trying to capitalize on semantics here, using the fact that all retcons of course come after the original source as a basis for your argument - which is the only reason why this particular quote uses the term "new".