Re: SIEGE and Void Sentry VS KMC
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
1. Did Bob allow Thor to kill him during SIEGE?
Yes, Bob did allow it.
Before the killing blow Void and Thor engaged in a fight, where Thor was approaching Void and yelling at him, he will attack him with all of the power under his command.
Thor attacked the Void with one of his major lightning strikes, which he doesn't do on a regular basis, but uses them to attack opponents like the Chaos King and so on.
That attack didn't have that much of an effect on the Void except for bursting his outer shell.
Here are the screenshots to that scene:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180715-6.jpg
As a comparison here is Thor's lightning strike he used on the Chaos King:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111132618/3435515-3299168-1814844744-56563.jpg
The next time we saw Thor fighting the Void, Void was squeezing the hell out of him and obviously having the physical advantage, as well the speed advantage judging by the next scene, where Void destroyed entire Asgard, while Thor only managed to raise his arm to wield Mjolnir in the meantime:
Here are the screenshots to that scene:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180716-7.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180717-8.jpg
In my opinion that encounter has proven that Thor didn't have any business fighting the Void.
Then we got the infamous scene in the end, where Thor gets the opportunity to strike again and finish the Void off, after Robert Reynolds begs the Avengers to kill him:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180749-16.jpg
If you take a look at all of the events during Siege it's not that hard to understand that Void straight up beat Void and only died, when his good side regained the control and defeated himself.
That was confirmed by the writer of the story himself:
Q:In this scene, Thor finally ends the threat of the Void AKA Bob Reynolds by killing him. It seems like when you consider the Void's power level, the only way this could have happened was because the Void wanted to die.
A:I see there is a lot of online speculation about that, and I thought it was pretty clear. I don't like to over analyze these things. I prefer the work to speak for itself, but I'll put two things out there.
[...]
Number two, yes, Bob realized that things had gone as far as they could possibly go. There was no other end for him and without his cooperation he doesn't go away. I just didn't want to have a line in the script where someone like Spider-Woman goes, "Boy, if he didn't want us to kill him, we couldn't have killed him." I see a lot of people got it, though, or they were just so happy to see the Sentry die they didn't give a shit how it happened.
Source: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=26287
But that is overall the history with that character as we could see it also during the events of World War Hulk and the final battle between WW Hulk and the Sentry, where you saw Sentry letting Hulk beat him up, even asked for more punishment and thanked Hulk in the for stopping him.
The writer of that story confirmed as well that the Sentry realized that he was going too far and asked the Hulk to stop him:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/102593/3288874-greg.jpg
And I would like to point out that during the Sentry was depowered during the World War Hulk storyline, since he was dealing with major mental issues, which make the character less powerful and he still went blow for blow with one of the most powerful Hulk versions and even had the upper hand in my opinon.
That showcases how powerful the Sentry and the Void really are. You just have to consider a little bit of context, when it comes to that character.
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
2. Was it brute strength or matter manipulation that allowed Voidtry to rip Ares in half?
Well, in the end of the day it was both. Right now we're left with the notion that the Sentry is capable of controlling the molecules. That is the reason why he can do all the things he does.
When Sentry killed Ares, he had his molecule aura around himself:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180703-7.jpg
The molecule manipulation gives the Sentry strength as a sub-power and it could and should be argued that he can use his molecule manipulation to increase his strength levels, just like other characters have dynamic strength, gamma rays or the power cosmic for that.
However the question now is if he used the molecule manipulation or raw, brute strength to rip Ares in half.
And the answer to that is obviously raw, brute strength.
In the screenshot we see him ripping Ares in half. Everything points to it being a showing of strength:
- He holds Ares body parts in the directions he is pulling,
- He is channeling more strength by screaming and looking enraged.
When Sentry and Void were using molecule manipulation it never turned into a massacre like in the case of Ares' death. There it was more of a dissolve into nothing.
Here we have the Sentry dissolving the Molecule Man into nothing:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180597-11.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180598-12.jpg
Here we have the Void dissolving Noh-Varr's tech into nothing:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180771-2.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180772-3.jpg
(It's interesting to see that the Sentry was capable of using his offensive molecule manipulation regularly, while the Void needed to make contact with the weapon first with one of his tentacles)
Here we see Void once again using his molecule manipulation and here in order to dissolve Loki into nothing. Once again he makes contact with his tentacles instead of just using the molecule manipulation from a distance:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180726-7.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180727-8.jpg
Sentry again doesn't need tentacles to use the molecule manipulation on items / opponents:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111131773/3323521-4.jpg
The question should be
Did Bob allow Thor to "kill" him during SIEGE?
Because, we know now for sure, Sentry didnt died in Siege. He still was able to reform himself in the sun, even if great part of himself wanted to be dead.
Is very clear that he let Thor kill him. Sentry just cannot die if he dont want do (unless a guy far stronger than a High Herald try to kill him...you need way more than just destroy all his body).
Re: Re: SIEGE and Void Sentry VS KMC
Originally posted by EnzeruGood to have you back Enzeru 😂
Yes, Bob did allow it.Before the killing blow Void and Thor engaged in a fight, where Thor was approaching Void and yelling at him, [b]he will attack him with all of the power under his command
.
Thor attacked the Void with one of his major lightning strikes, which he doesn't do on a regular basis, but uses them to attack opponents like the Chaos King and so on.
That attack didn't have that much of an effect on the Void except for bursting his outer shell.Here are the screenshots to that scene:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180715-6.jpgAs a comparison here is Thor's lightning strike he used on the Chaos King:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111132618/3435515-3299168-1814844744-56563.jpgThe next time we saw Thor fighting the Void, Void was squeezing the hell out of him and obviously having the physical advantage, as well the speed advantage judging by the next scene, where Void destroyed entire Asgard, while Thor only managed to raise his arm to wield Mjolnir in the meantime:
Here are the screenshots to that scene:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180716-7.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180717-8.jpgIn my opinion that encounter has proven that Thor didn't have any business fighting the Void.
Then we got the infamous scene in the end, where Thor gets the opportunity to strike again and finish the Void off, after Robert Reynolds begs the Avengers to kill him:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180749-16.jpgIf you take a look at all of the events during Siege it's not that hard to understand that Void straight up beat Void and only died, when his good side regained the control and defeated himself.
That was confirmed by the writer of the story himself:Q:In this scene, Thor finally ends the threat of the Void AKA Bob Reynolds by killing him. It seems like when you consider the Void's power level, the only way this could have happened was because the Void wanted to die.
A:I see there is a lot of online speculation about that, and I thought it was pretty clear. I don't like to over analyze these things. I prefer the work to speak for itself, but I'll put two things out there.
[...]
Number two, yes, Bob realized that things had gone as far as they could possibly go. There was no other end for him and without his cooperation he doesn't go away. I just didn't want to have a line in the script where someone like Spider-Woman goes, "Boy, if he didn't want us to kill him, we couldn't have killed him." I see a lot of people got it, though, or they were just so happy to see the Sentry die they didn't give a shit how it happened.
Source: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=26287
But that is overall the history with that character as we could see it also during the events of World War Hulk and the final battle between WW Hulk and the Sentry, where you saw Sentry letting Hulk beat him up, even asked for more punishment and thanked Hulk in the for stopping him.
The writer of that story confirmed as well that the Sentry realized that he was going too far and asked the Hulk to stop him:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/102593/3288874-greg.jpgAnd I would like to point out that during the Sentry was depowered during the World War Hulk storyline, since he was dealing with major mental issues, which make the character less powerful and he still went blow for blow with one of the most powerful Hulk versions and even had the upper hand in my opinon.
That showcases how powerful the Sentry and the Void really are. You just have to consider a little bit of context, when it comes to that character.Well, in the end of the day it was both. Right now we're left with the notion that the Sentry is capable of controlling the molecules. That is the reason why he can do all the things he does.
When Sentry killed Ares, he had his molecule aura around himself:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180703-7.jpgThe molecule manipulation gives the Sentry strength as a sub-power and it could and should be argued that he can use his molecule manipulation to increase his strength levels, just like other characters have dynamic strength, gamma rays or the power cosmic for that.
However the question now is if he used the molecule manipulation or raw, brute strength to rip Ares in half.
And the answer to that is obviously raw, brute strength.In the screenshot we see him ripping Ares in half. Everything points to it being a showing of strength:
- He holds Ares body parts in the directions he is pulling,
- He is channeling more strength by screaming and looking enraged.When Sentry and Void were using molecule manipulation it never turned into a massacre like in the case of Ares' death. There it was more of a dissolve into nothing.
Here we have the Sentry dissolving the Molecule Man into nothing:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180597-11.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180598-12.jpgHere we have the Void dissolving Noh-Varr's tech into nothing:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180771-2.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180772-3.jpg(It's interesting to see that the Sentry was capable of using his offensive molecule manipulation regularly, while the Void needed to make contact with the weapon first with one of his tentacles)
Here we see Void once again using his molecule manipulation and here in order to dissolve Loki into nothing. Once again he makes contact with his tentacles instead of just using the molecule manipulation from a distance:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180726-7.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2180727-8.jpgSentry again doesn't need tentacles to use the molecule manipulation on items / opponents:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111131773/3323521-4.jpg [/B]
I won't get into the hornet's nest that number one can be.
The second question though I'm pretty sure I've heard and read somewhere that the author stated it takes more than raw strength to kill a god or something along those lines.
If someone could confirm this that would be appreciated.
Of course that could still mean Sentry ripped him apart and used something else to keep him dead or Sentry had to use something more than physical means to rip Ares apart in the first place.
Originally posted by Newjak
I won't get into the hornet's nest that number one can be.The second question though I'm pretty sure I've heard and read somewhere that the author stated it takes more than raw strength to kill a god or something along those lines.
If someone could confirm this that would be appreciated.
Of course that could still mean Sentry ripped him apart and used something else to keep him dead or Sentry had to use something more than physical means to rip Ares apart in the first place.
to b honest with you now that you say that i remember what your talking about im looking now but i wont be able to post scans till im home if someone else can that'd b great
1. Based on Remender's extrapolation on how he kept regenerating from individual atoms while in the Sun, I doubt Thor ever actually managed to kill him to begin with.
2. Combination of both. Although if we want to go the technical route, all of Sentry's abilities are derived from his matter manip, so it should count more as a matter manip feat than a strength feat.
Originally posted by Epicurus
1. Based on Remender's extrapolation on how he kept regenerating from individual atoms while in the Sun, I doubt Thor ever actually managed to kill him to begin with.2. Combination of both. Although if we want to go the technical route, all of Sentry's abilities are derived from his matter manip, so it should count more as a matter manip feat than a strength feat.
Perfectly said! When I first read Sentry's monologue to Thor in uncanny avengers it wowed me because he was basically saying he was never dead. He was within the sun all this time and his cells would constantly regrow but the sun would disintegrate them in an instant and he said he remembers it all happening. So that means this dude pretty much can't die lol.
I also agree with the ares feat. When I abruptly said No I really was thinking yes and no. Perhaps Voidtry did possess said ridiculous brute strength, but a small thought had me to believe that it was complimented with a little molecule manipulation. Hard to truly say.
Originally posted by LordofBrooklynBob wanted him to kill him , but it's not that straight forward as Thor ended up killing the Void who didn't want to die and was attacking the heroes. Plus Bob/Voids durability wasn't lowered.
Care to explain your answers?
It wasn't pure strength due to the energy/molecule powers Sentry had shown
