Originally posted by The_Tempest
😐I shouldn't have taken you off ignore... 😬
starwars.com still lists TOR as one of their official games.
It seems like it is still in production. Then again, probably due to money.
http://www.starwars.com/games-apps/star-wars-the-old-republic
Yoda being (supposedly) the most powerful Jedi would have never made him untouchable. Theres more to combat than power. Certain individuals, such as in my opinion Orbalisk Bane, have the tools to beat him regardless of his legendary power. Statements like "the most powerful blah" don't give you an automatic win.
I do agree though that the common belief is that Yoda would only ever lose to Sidious and Luke, though. And people write off the possibility of anyone else beating him.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That being said, I don't imagine EA will send off its cashcow while it still has the rights to produce SW games. Right now, it looks like the quiet period, where EA is just waiting for approval or rejection, since to my knowledge, they don't speak on TOR's canonicity.
Nah, it has nothing to do with whether or not TOR should be canon. It has everything to do with LeGenD (like Neph and Moose) claiming to not be overtly partial to Vitiate, but all three admit to eagerly seeking scenarios and outcomes that will enhance his reputation.
Spoiler:
He's lying about being impartial.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Caedus being among the finest is not an issue, the suggestion that he is equal to and/or stronger then Emperor Vitiate is baseless.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
He didn't die from it.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Visions are always correct. Point is that they represent possibilities and may or may not come true.
Regardless this wasn't even a vision of the future. There is no chance of Thanaton fighting his past self outside of his vision because that is not possible.
And as we saw from TCW, visions/dream sequences are not accurate representations of power. Anakin beat Dooku in that vision easier than he did in ROTS, and he's not even at that level yet. Yoda somehow deflected Sidious's lightning at one point, and was tanking a barrage of Sidious's lightning, but in ROTS he got knocked out by a short burst of Sidious's lightning and failed to deflect it.
Visions are not always correct, this wasn't even a vision of the future, this vision had no chance of happening outside of the vision, and visions as unrealistic as these don't display power very well.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Once again, Nox would not have casually tanked it or tanked it all without drawing strength from several Force spirits. Try to understand the ground reality instead of portraying Nox like a regular.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor Vitiate had mostly been shrouded in mystery, apparent from journals of Jedi historians. He didn't share much of his knowledge with others either.In-fact, much of the ancient treasures about Sith had been lost by the time of Plagueis, some records have been destroyed by one of the Bannite Sith as well. Plagueis also didn't make much effort in trying to uncover ancient treasures.
First of all, Plagueis labeled The Ones as Celestials; confirmed by author James Luceno himself and also apparent from the revelation itself since The Ones lasted thousands of generations.
Secondly, Plagueis do have much idea about ground realities of Emperor Vitiate. Plagueis thought that Emperor Vitiate lasted 1000 years but in reality the latter Sith lasted over 1300 years and would have continued to exist if Jedi and Sith had not stopped him.
I'm pretty sure Plagueis wasn't exactly swimming in celestial knowledge either. Hell most likely even less was known about the Ones and the Celestials then about Vitiate, so don't play a double standard to try and claim Vitiate is on their level.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Which is contradicted by BioWare.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So we are dealing with contradiction in this matter or lets say multiple possibilities.
The Ones of Mortis>Vitiate... deal with it.
@ S_W_LeGenD
While i agree with you on your debates against some people who think even the likes of Tenebrous(lol) or Anakin could kill Vitiate, I have to stop you when you say Vitiate is same level with the ones.
You cannot ignore mountain shattering lightning just because it is not demonstrated in the story.
Also their immunity to lightsaber attacks is not the same thing with the jedi/sith blocking sabers with bare hands. Those Jedi/Sith simply survive the encounter and have a really hard time pulling off the feat where the Son was able to withstand the impact as if he was caressing the saber.
You compare their feats to the Dread Masters' but the DMs were able to do those things through preps, rituals and certain tools of the dark side. The Ones could casually do what they did in Mortis trilogy and Im pretty sure that with prep, they were capable of doing things that no sith/jedi would even be able to think of. (Even Darth Nihilus would shit his pants)
Vitiate's force powers in combat are insane and his force feats with prep are unmatched by any sith/jedi but if he were to face the son or daughter 1on1, he would be destroyed within a short period of time. Even Vitiate prepped vs the son/daughter wouldn't change the result.
They are definitely not same tier. Father>Son=Daughter>Celestials>World Razer>Soa>Vitiate
About Thanaton, it absolutely doesn't make any sense to assume his lightning is superior to Sidious' or even Bane's. Its not even close.
Originally posted by ares834
Well, the CW is canon so the Others are the most powerful force users...Basically, I'm laughing right now.
😂
Originally posted by Nephthys
Yoda being (supposedly) the most powerful Jedi would have never made him untouchable. Theres more to combat than power. Certain individuals, such as in my opinion Orbalisk Bane, have the tools to beat him regardless of his legendary power. Statements like "the most powerful blah" don't give you an automatic win.I do agree though that the common belief is that Yoda would only ever lose to Sidious and Luke, though. And people write off the possibility of anyone else beating him.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
regardless, the point that I was making was that it's not far fetched or unreasonable.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Wasn't she toying with him?
Thanaton was sent to assassinate her and you think that she would toy with him?
Originally posted by Emperordmb
That's a contradicting statement in and of itself. Visions cannot always be correct if they may or may not come true.
Vision experienced by Thanaton represents that he would become a supremely powerful Force-user one day and that he may join Exal Kressh which implies that he may defect the Empire just like Exal Kressh. However, vision then takes a twist and Thanaton notices his future-self utterly destroying his current-self, and Thanaton jolts back to reality. Message was that Thanaton would be destroyed if he joins Exal Kressh.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Regardless this wasn't even a vision of the future. There is no chance of Thanaton fighting his past self outside of his vision because that is not possible.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
And as we saw from TCW, visions/dream sequences are not accurate representations of power. Anakin beat Dooku in that vision easier than he did in ROTS, and he's not even at that level yet. Yoda somehow deflected Sidious's lightning at one point, and was tanking a barrage of Sidious's lightning, but in ROTS he got knocked out by a short burst of Sidious's lightning and failed to deflect it.
Yoda was being manipulated, not a vision.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Visions are not always correct, this wasn't even a vision of the future, this vision had no chance of happening outside of the vision, and visions as unrealistic as these don't display power very well.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
You are assuming that nobody below Nox's level could hope to defend against Thanaton's power, however Nox did it casually, so that doesn't demonstrate a limit. Try and understand that this does not demonstrate a limit.
You cannot fault Thanaton for loosing to Nox after the latter utilized combined might of several Force spirits against him. Its simply too much power to contend with for any mortal.
I do understand your position but you are underestimating Thanaton's power. Keep in mind that Thanaton was also a master of sorcery, he was deadly in the use of the Force. Masters of sorcery are dangerous to contend with because they can unleash powers of such nature against which standard defensive methods do not necessarily work. Look no further then example of Bane versus Zannah to understand my position.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
You are saying Plagueis's musings demonstrate a limit for the Ones, but don't demonstrate a limit for Vitiate because Plagueis doesn't know very much about Vitiate.I'm pretty sure Plagueis wasn't exactly swimming in celestial knowledge either. Hell most likely even less was known about the Ones and the Celestials then about Vitiate, so don't play a double standard to try and claim Vitiate is on their level.
Originally posted by Emperordmb
TCW constitutes a higher level of canon than Bioware so no, there is no impasse between canon. TCW trumps SWTOR in terms of canon.No. There is a canon hierarchy, and the One's have the accolade of being more powerful than any the Jedi have seen before. This accolade is not contradicted by a higher level of canon, nor is it contradicted by something on the same level of canon.
The Ones of Mortis>Vitiate... deal with it.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Well, according to the legends, Emperor Vitiate is the most powerful Force-user to have ever existed.
If you're referring to the TOR Encyclopedia, he's the most powerful Force-user up to that point in galactic history. You like to point out the encyclopedic nature of that source, but it's written in present tense, as if the events are all currently happening. If it was a true all-encompassing source, it would include the events before and after the game's era, and it would be written in past tense (especially since everything happened a long time ago in a galaxy far far away...).
I do think the TOR Encyclopedia should be the major source for the events of that era, though.