Originally posted by "Id"
For Nate you do not need to reach into your physical brain to effect his mind. His run in with Xavier, and how he folded his astral body is clear evidence of such.Regardless if Dr. Manhatan body made of matter or immaterial, he has a conscious mind therefore his mind can be effected since his astral body can be found in the Mindscape/Astral Plane.
This should not come as a huge surprise, given that other immaterial beings like Cassandra Nova, or Shadow King have been shown to be effected by psionics despite being energy beings themselves.
On the subject of Dr. Manhattan, its really a moot point.
He's never fought a telepath/psionic or anything like that, so there's no proof as to what would really happen.
There have been plenty of other characters listed who can be argued a lot more easily...
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I took it to mean no one who could solo, lol.So if you have one (or several) mutant(s) who can conceivably beat a good proportion of the others (P5, Proteus, Legion etc) then yeah, unusable. But yeah, clarification would be good.
Basically you can't choose any mutant for your answer, because they are all fighting on the mutant team...
...the only exceptions were the high end warpers, PF, etc. excluded in the OP. They are out of the thread entirely, so they aren't fighting for the mutants and they can't be chosen for your answer either. Guys who can put universes in boxes are getting too ridiculous.
Maybe:
Kuurth
Odin
Standard Galactus
The Stranger
High Evolutionary (has shown some ability to remove the X-gene)
Korvac
Well that makes it a lot easier to puck characters to solo the mutants.
Like i said, a lot of choices were already put out, to include Dr. Manhattan, who's powers, while always a matter of debate, is secondary to his durability, both mental and physical.
The character was never intended for these types if debates, and i didnt bring him up, but i still think he could do this. Found an in depth post on another site by a poster named Wyldsong. Giving credit where due:
Dr. Manhattan Feats: Watchmen #1: Pg 20: Size alteration Pg 21: Some super strength, lifting what looks to be a heavy piece of equipment Pg 22: Teleportation of another Watchmen #2: Pg 15: Talks of ’s Matter Manipulation and Teleportation abilities Watchmen #3: Pg 4: Ability to create duplicates of himself (no more than 2 of Manhattan seen at one time) and to project some electricity from his hands Pg 5: Ability to phase Pg 9: Telekinesis Pg 16: Teleporting a room full of people, then teleporting self Pg 19: Teleporting self Pg 21: Teleported to Mars Pg 26: Survival in Mars’ Atmosphere Watchmen #4: Pg 5: Flash/awareness of the future while in the past – seems to be viewing events possibly simultaneously throughout segments of his life for the majority of the issue Pg 6: Has his intrinsic field removed, and is seemingly vaporized or disintegrated – specifics aren’t discussed as to what actually happens – the intrinsic field is described as some theoretical field that holds things together – but over the next couple of pages, Manhattan pieces himself together, often slipping in and out of view – by pg 10, Blue boy is reformed in all his…uh…glory… Pg 10: It is stated he can control atomic structure itself – you only see him dismantle a rifle without his hands as this is stated, and blasting/melting the top of a tank Pg 14: He makes some guys head explode Pg 16: Shows knowledge of future events, and states inability to affect it Pg 17: Hinted that he does not age, or ages much, much slower than humans Pg 20: Size manipulation of self Pg 22: Teleports a bunch of angry protesters presumably back to their homes Pg 26: Floats a few feet off of the ground and forms a crystalline structure on Mars Watchmen #8: Pg 23: a little more on how he views the time stream, and teleporting himself and Laurie to Mars Watchmen #9: Pg 3: Able to create some sort of enviro field around Laurie allowing her to survive on Mars Pg 5: More on his perception of time and how everything he sees is preordained Pg 6: Creates a table and chairs out of the crystalline structure Pg 9: Makes his structure on Mars fly Pg 10: Creates water in bottle Pg 17: States he reads atoms, also states there is some trouble seeing to a point in his future, possibly due to a static from maybe an electromagnetic pulse Watchmen #12: Pg 7: Can see or sense tachyons – the “static” makes tracking them difficult – and more teleportation Pg 12: More talk on his time stream view Pg 14: Has intrinsic field removed…again…Veidt wasn’t even sure it would work Pg 17: Size manipulation – and sudden reappearance Pg 18: Talks about restructuring himself from intrinsic field removal being the first thing he has learned…talks about being able to walk on the sun, etc. Pg 24: Vaporizes Rorschach Pg 26: Walks up a wall and through a ceiling Let’s talk about this intrinsic field thing, since there is a lot of speculation on his being able to control his own atoms or even reverse entropy (though it is only stated that he has “restructured” himself)… So, what is an intrinsic field you might ask? It is never fully explained in the comics how and why it does what it does, and it never truly explains the disintegration/vaporizing effect, other than the idea that an intrinsic field holds stuff together.
Originally posted by riv6672
Well that makes it a lot easier to puck characters to solo the mutants.
Like i said, a lot of choices were already put out, to include Dr. Manhattan, who's powers, while always a matter of debate, is secondary to his durability, both mental and physical.
The character was never intended for these types if debates, and i didnt bring him up, but i still think he could do this. Found an in depth post on another site by a poster named Wyldsong. Giving credit where due:Like i said, not meant for debates, really. But reading between the lines, it seems he's got a lot of implied power that he just never saw fit to use in the story...
Yes, Implied power is good an all but he has never faced anyone note worthy.
Dudes not even high herald.
Its been stated in the original watchmen comics that Jon only has enough power to destroy a continent.
I agree, he is not made for these boards....so leave him be.
Legion, proteus or P5 would destroy him; from what we have seen Jon do pales in comparison to many of the mutants. Telepaths & Reality Warpers.
Originally posted by carver9
😂No he would not. Professor X teamed with Shadow King, Emma, Psylocke, Sinister, Apocalypse, mind rapes the hell out of him. You have to provide some hard proof that he can survive that. Back to what I said before, Proteus turns him into a chicken.
Originally posted by riv6672
Exactly.
There's no way to say Dr. Manhattan's mind is still organic, subject to the telepathic assault that was cited.Its a good attack plan, but its not guaranteed to work.
Originally posted by riv6672
On the subject of Dr. Manhattan, its really a moot point.
He's never fought a telepath/psionic or anything like that, so there's no proof as to what would really happen.
There have been plenty of other characters listed who can be argued a lot more easily...
Even ignoring the telepaths though, he'd fail miserably at this thread. Eva Bell is all of 15 years old and can freeze time(she solo'd the Avengers including Hulk), and she's nowhere near the strongest mutant he'd have to worry about. Fighting together, the mutants have an absurd level of hax abilities that would be firing simultaneously. Manhanttan is screwed here.
I'm not a big stickler for feats over common sense or spite posts, but i was basing my telepathic argument on a probable non organic mind, which a character like Plastic man has shown to be tele proof.
I try not to see things as set in stone in these debates; give every argument the benefit of the doubt.
A lot of posters dont, and depending on my mood i'll either ignore them or debate the point, no big.
Originally posted by carver9
You all are crazy. Proteus, a reality warper would ruin anyone on your list. Add in Apocalypse, Hope (who can add your powers to her own including everyone else powers that is on the battle field just by being in everyone proximity), Exodus, Cable, Shadow King, Blink (who can teleport you anywhere or teleport anything inside of you), Iceman, Rogue, Emma Frost, Xavier, and the list goes on.How about this. This is every mutant on the planet. Some of these people can boil you from the inside out just by staring at you and you think these people will single handily take them out.
http://marvel.com/universe/Category:Mutants
Get out of here. You all really need to think about this for a bit before giving an answer. Lol at Doom. Proteus would turn him into a bunny. And how is Black Panther or anyone going to cancel the entire mutant race powers when the mutants are standing there in front of them. WTF man.
If Proteus is a reality warper then he's not included. Plus I've seen magneto wreck him solo. He's pure energy and you know who's REALLY good at absorbing energy? Doom (ask nightmare, Franklin Richards, Galactus, etc.)
Blink can't do much to anyone with a teleporter (Doom and pretty much everyone I named), Shadow King, Exodus, Cable, psionics in general fall to Doom's willpower and psionic refractor, to BP's tp defense, to Iron Man's psionic dampeners, etc. Prep easily counters all of that.
Rogue has to touch you, Iceman sucks unless he's going all out and even then can simply be TP'd or hypnotized or just trapped, Apocalypse has become a jobber that Ironman already trapped sans prep, and Hope can only copy powers of mutants. Plus she can only handle so much.
And how is BP gonna cancel mutant race powers? Satellite+x-gene nullifier. Or gas in air+x-gene nullifier. That goes for all the prep masters.
Oh and Doom has countered reality warp before with pure willpower. Proteus would get mangled.
Originally posted by riv6672
I'm not a big stickler for feats over common sense or spite posts, but i was basing my telepathic argument on a probable non organic mind, which a character like Plastic man has shown to be tele proof.
I try not to see things as set in stone in these debates; give every argument the benefit of the doubt.
A lot of posters dont, and depending on my mood i'll either ignore them or debate the point, no big.
Jokes aside, the mutants have affected non-corporeal minds before. I'm not saying "it's set in stone", so much as I am saying "the evidence indicates this."
I mean, we're all having fun here and you're welcome to believe whatever you want obviously.
Except that he can actually win. uhuh