Originally posted by Rao Kal El
Honest question here.I read the Kurse comics, because I wanted to know what was so great about him.
Honestly I was not impressed, I mean yes, he is 4 times stronger than Thor, but under Walter Simonson what feats of strength Thor has that will make Kurse an extraordinary foe?
Maybe on Walt eyes Thor has a limit which in turn it will get surpassed by Kurse for 4 times
Since different writers have Thor at different strength levels 4 times stronger is a very vague term.
Walt Simonson was the one who had Hercules to lift a city on a made up story.
Because saying that Kurse is strong because he is 4 times stronger than Thor and then saying that Thor is strong because he is Thor is kind of a circular reasoning argument.
So how strong is Thor under Walt Simonson?
😐
I think I get what you're trying to say, but this argument as presented is just dumb.
It ignores the entire relative aspect of comic books first of all, i.e. one writer has top tiers top out at city level and another at planet level. Second, it puts an emphasis on pure strength feats in favor of combat because it implies that the only way to know how strong Kurse is, is by how much Thor was able to bench in that story.
The moment you start applying this to beings like Hunter Prey or Darkseid, you'd immediately back track.....
I might have been inclined to believe that you were just trying to gauge Simonson's Thor power levels BUT......you then try and lowball Thor, and through him, Kurse, by referencing a made up story where Hercules lifts a city (I don't even know how that could possibly be relevant). The funny part is that Simonson didn't even write that Hercules issue.
And how strong was Walter Simonson's Thor? As strong as ever, elite level and not in anyway below Lobo or something if that's what you are implying (Which is where you are going with this, let's not pretend otherwise). Although Walter Simonson put story first. IIRC he said that he'd have Thor lifting a car or moving a galaxy if the story required it. But since you want evidence of his power under Simonson, just read his fight with the Midgard Serpent. Or the Surtur arc. and so on. The entire run had impressive feats for Thor and his cast here and there.
In pure strength terms without any involvement of Mjolnir, a weakened Thor lifted the foot of the Midgard Serpent in his Fafnir form.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusIts his lame and well known plot to lowball Thor and Kurse. Tell him to put Lobo up against Surtur or the Midgard surpent an see what happens.
😐I think I get what you're trying to say, but this argument as presented is just dumb.
It ignores the entire relative aspect of comic books first of all, i.e. one writer has top tiers top out at city level and another at planet level. Second, it puts an emphasis on pure strength feats in favor of combat because it implies that the only way to know how strong Kurse is, is by how much Thor was able to bench in that story.
The moment you start applying this to beings like Hunter Prey or Darkseid, you'd immediately back track.....
I might have been inclined to believe that you were just trying to gauge Simonson's Thor power levels BUT......you then try and lowball Thor, and through him, Kurse, by referencing a made up story where Hercules lifts a city (I don't even know how that could possibly be relevant). The funny part is that Simonson didn't even write that Hercules issue.
And how strong was Walter Simonson's Thor? As strong as ever, elite level and not in anyway below Lobo or something if that's what you are implying (Which is where you are going with this, let's not pretend otherwise). Although Walter Simonson put story first. IIRC he said that he'd have Thor lifting a car or moving a galaxy if the story required it. But since you want evidence of his power under Simonson, just read his fight with the Midgard Serpent. Or the Surtur arc. and so on. The entire run had impressive feats for Thor and his cast here and there.
In pure strength terms without any involvement of Mjolnir, a weakened Thor lifted the foot of the Midgard Serpent in his Fafnir form.
facepalm
How do you even remember a specific moment that could be perceived as a low showing from a specific writer down to the issue number? 😐
And it's not even effective lowballing because the opponent was actively wrestling with Thor. And he gathering his strength to free himself and did when Balder distracted her:
Not to mention that Thor notes twice that he's weakened/drained:
Is lowballing, and terribly at that, a side effect of liking Superman?
mhmm
That just stuck as a funny moment just as Thor stating that colliding with stone roof would crush him. Walt's Thor was inconsistency incarnate, heck he was afraid he would die in lava.
http://i.imgur.com/prLJUiw.jpg
Its funny you mention being fatigued by wearing belt of strength as genuinely weakened though.
And he stated that her bulk pinned his arms. Not due to wrestling.
http://postimg.org/image/l6zph0f1b/
😬
Dat salt.
😂
That wasn't you trying to be funny, that was you trying to lowball and cast Thor in a negative light specifically because of the context of this discussion. And there you go again.
But he didn't die in lava (Why is that even relevant in a strength discussion?) and has withstood infinitely worse under Simonson, even in regards to heat, so why bring it up when we know the mindset that Walter wrote his comics with? I.e. dramatic danger (Not inconsistency like you implied because his Thor always finds a way whether it's a street level threat or a cosmic one).
Her bulk was obviously pinning him down but she wasn't a large dumbbell or something. She was actively wrestling Thor down and exerting her own strength. Why do you need something that's drawn for you also spelled out for you?
Originally posted by abhilegend
That just stuck as a funny moment just as Thor stating that colliding with stone roof would crush him. Walt's Thor was inconsistency incarnate, heck he was afraid he would die in lava.http://i.imgur.com/prLJUiw.jpg
Its funny you mention being fatigued by wearing belt of strength as genuinely weakened though.
And he stated that her bulk pinned his arms. Not due to wrestling.
http://postimg.org/image/l6zph0f1b/
😬
Dat salt.
😂
Originally posted by JBL
How many times have Lobo been beaten and did his HF save him then?
I thought they fought to the best of their ability?
Besides, you have to use the right incarnation. Me saying Thanos gets beaten, for example, is silly considering he's had several iterations.
Lobo definitely has. Previous incarnations meant his blood did this:
For example. So you'll need to disregard defeats suffered by different versions.
And lets forget he has a history of walking all over high end heralds. Barda, a match for Wonder Woman, couldn't even slow him down and had to resort to bfr via boom toob, and was at Lobo's mercy in round 2.
Most of his fights with Captain Marvel, Guy Gardner, Mon El, and even Superman and team wrecker Despero had him barely phased to outright tanking their best shots. (And Gardner and Despero don't hold back.)
Sure, he has his low ends like the blitz from Eclipsed Superman, but on average his hf and damage soak is close to Shaggy Man/General levels.
