Originally posted by JBL
In the same class as superman.
Your ignorance is true comedy gold. 😂
If you really had read Simonson's masterpiece you would know your comment makes no sense.
Which storylines/writers have Thor definitively in the same tier as Superman?
I'll give you the neutered Byrne/Wolfman/Jurgens version to work with.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
😐I think I get what you're trying to say, but this argument as presented is just dumb.
It ignores the entire relative aspect of comic books first of all, i.e. one writer has top tiers top out at city level and another at planet level. Second, it puts an emphasis on pure strength feats in favor of combat because it implies that the only way to know how strong Kurse is, is by how much Thor was able to bench in that story.
Not really, I am focusing on strength because I have been told that Kurse is 4 times stronger than Thor, so why will be dumb to ask how strong was Thor under that writer?
Writers have different points of view and think different about characters, Simonson's Thor relies more on the things He can accomplish with Mjolnir than on his physical strength and is not presented as a incredibly strong during his whole run, well He is as strong as Hercules, but again how physically strong Simonson portrays Herc?
Other writer had him not being that impressive physically and actually professor Hulk put up a better fight to Thor than Kurse
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
The moment you start applying this to beings like Hunter Prey or Darkseid, you'd immediately back track.....
Doomsday strength level is easy to track all the way up to Doomsday wars, because he was written by his creator the same way as this Simonson's Kurse. And the strength level of Superman during that era is also easy to track as all his books were interconnected.
Besides that under the same writer Doomsday has under his belt defeating the JLA with one hand and defeating several Green Lantern.
So We know that under the same writer Doomsday was strong, and We know he defeated several enemies and We have an idea of how strong Jurgens thinks a PRE DOS Superman is.
Why are we giving a free pass to Kurse into thinking that he is incredibly strong? Just because he is "4 times stronger" who has Kurse defeated?, does he has under his belt defeating the Avengers with one hand? Killing sonmeone who waqs thought to be undefetable? Who has Kurse defeated to place him so high on the food chain? Just because he can offset the strength of Simonson's Thor, is not really cutting it for me, to be honest.
Some writers might believe a character physical attributes as not as high as others and some might think that their other powers might made up for the lack of physical attributes
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I might have been inclined to believe that you were just trying to gauge Simonson's Thor power levels BUT......you then try and lowball Thor, and through him, Kurse, by referencing a made up story where Hercules lifts a city (I don't even know how that could possibly be relevant). The funny part is that Simonson didn't even write that Hercules issue.
You are right that Simonson did not wrote that issue, but lets see how strong does Simonson think Hercules is? Considering that 4 characters were needed to topple a huge giant door, it doe not seems that Simonson thinks, Hercules or Thor might be that physically strong. Especially if they are compared with other characters
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
And how strong was Walter Simonson's Thor? As strong as ever, elite level
as strong as ever? I seriously doubt that, he has better physical strength feats under other writers as a matter of fact, Walt Simonson is the one who had Thor physically struggling fighting against Gladiator when Thor had an amp basically and Gladiator was handicapped from being tired
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
and not in anyway below Lobo or something if that's what you are implying (Which is where you are going with this, let's not pretend otherwise).
Implying that you knew where was I going with this question I made originally is kind of funny as if you knew what I am really thinking. but lets forget about this psychic reading business and focus on what We have at hand.
Lobo under Bogdanove was fighting a guy who was casually tossing small moon sized ship coming out of hyperspace (meaning moving almost FTL) what type of feat of pure strength like that Thor or Kurse had under Simonson?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Although Walter Simonson put story first. IIRC he said that he'd have Thor lifting a car or moving a galaxy if the story required it. But since you want evidence of his power under Simonson, just read his fight with the Midgard Serpent. Or the Surtur arc. and so on. The entire run had impressive feats for Thor and his cast here and there.
Yes Simonson had Thor relaying more on Mjolnir than anything else a lot of his fights had the power of Mjolnir heavily involved and the physical attributes of Thor were not portrayed as high as other writers might have.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
In pure strength terms without any involvement of Mjolnir, a weakened Thor lifted the foot of the Midgard Serpent in his Fafnir form.
This is what I asked originally and this simple answer might have suffice instead of you trying to read my mind and justify the lack of physical feats of Simonson's Thor
Since this is Simonson's own creation (Kurse) I ask why is he placed so high on the food chain, he certainly does not have under his belt the enemies Darkseid or Doomsday has defeated and certainly Simonson's Thor is not presented as incredible strong to put him even on herald category based on his pure strength So why Kurse is placed so high above in terms of strength, just because he is ALLEGEDLY 4 times stronger than Thor? Other witer had Thor performing better against Kurse and Thor IIRC did not even had the belt of strength, even Professor Hulk performed better than Kurse.
So why are We giving a free pass to Kurse, just because he had some lip service from Simonson? Maybe is because circular logic is used to give Kurse that strength level. :/
If we give this type of free passes lets bring charatcers that are 4 times stronger than Byrne Superman and then place them on the Trans level category when it comes to strength.
That is my point of view
So based on what I have read about Both Characters Lobo will defeat Kurse.
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That wasn't you trying to be funny, that was you trying to lowball and cast Thor in a negative light specifically because of the context of this discussion. And there you go again.But he didn't die in lava (Why is that even relevant in a strength discussion?) and has withstood infinitely worse under Simonson, even in regards to heat, so why bring it up when we know the mindset that Walter wrote his comics with? I.e. dramatic danger (Not inconsistency like you implied because his Thor always finds a way whether it's a street level threat or a cosmic one).
Her bulk was obviously pinning him down but she wasn't a large dumbbell or something. She was actively wrestling Thor down and exerting her own strength. Why do you need something that's drawn for you also spelled out for you?
And now you disregard Thor's own words. But that's how you roll, so I am not surprised at all.
Bwahaha, oh dude. You make it so easy.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Damn Abhi... You are one sad dude.
😂
Originally posted by LordofBrooklynAs long as I'm writing the character, he won't be so strong that he makes other characters look foolish. He is just in the same league as the Hulk, Thor, Superman, Sentry, Orion, J'onn J'onzz, etc. He's NOT above them." Interview with creator Kevin Grevioux
Your ignorance is true comedy gold. 😂If you really had read Simonson's masterpiece you would know your comment makes no sense.
Which storylines/writers have Thor definitively in the same tier as Superman?
I'll give you the neutered Byrne/Wolfman/Jurgens version to work with.
He's talking about his creation the Blue Marvel. And he used the word STRONG. Oh yeah, Thor's name is in there. The day you get your nose out of superman's butt and actually look at writers and creators statements and interviews, you would look less like a donkeys rear when you post your love for the house of Els cape wearing Idol. 😮💨
Originally posted by abhilegendHave you written superman? You are a huge superman fanboy READER yet you laugh at a WRITER who knows and creates character powers????? WOW, a brand new low. 😂
😂Coming from a huge Thor fanboy writer who has never even written Superman? The same writer who said Thor was actually stronger than Superman?
crylaugh
Originally posted by JBL
Have you written superman? You are a huge superman fanboy READER yet you laugh at a WRITER who knows and creates character powers????? WOW, a brand new low. 😂
Originally posted by abhilegendI will give you a moment to reflect on what you just said and hope and pray you see the utter foolishness in what you just said.
No, but I know that Grievoux has never written Superman so he has no idea of how powerful Superman is. The guy said Thing can take 4/10 against Superman FFS.
Originally posted by DTM
Lobo is a major league bruiser, but hes not in Kurses class. Kurse even at his lowest level beat up Thor, and I wouldnt give Lobo the win over Thor, and thats if this Kurse isnt the uber 4xThor version. Decent fight, but in the end Lobo goes down.
But then, Power Pack maanged to put the hurting on him, without seeking to kill him:
He dug himself out, true, but being smashed on by cars etc is enough to cause him pain. Whereas Lobo packs tons of weaponry that could hurt him, and are far more lethal than a car.
