Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
You continuously try to argue that he is skilled with the blade which is logical but to say he can beat Meetra or anyone who is above her dueling wise is foolish when he has no feats in it. It's like saying Cin Drallig > Exar Kun in swordsmenship simply because Drallig has hype as a great duelist - yet, he has no feats supporting those claims and was slaughtered by Anakin quite easily. It's not logical and i'm not calling Vitiate featless - he should be skilled with the blade. but i can't judge or side with him because he has no feats with the blade all we have is speculation. I apologize if i came off a bit aggressive in my previous post, it was not my intention.I never implied such a thing Sinious, if you're talking about the chat comment i was only joking 😬 You know i'm not one to use the "SLAUGHTERHOUSE" Or "ROFLSTOMPS" Arguments 🙁
Wow, seriously? You couldnt quote anything firstly, and also, I've stated several times that Meetra is superior in sabers since Vitiate is featless and said that making any comments on Vitiate's saber skills is pure assumption. What we are debating here is whether Meetre would stomp Vitiate in a duel or not in case you haven't read the prior posts.
But you still have much to learn..
Not really. You have failed again bro.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
I'm sorry that's pure speculation, still doesn't refute anything I said and supports the claim that Vitiate isn't as skilled with sabers. T
You presented 3 options and Ive stated my opinion. Yet its either A or C.
Lol, who said the HoT had the best Force powers offensive wise, or that they specialised in it? Speed, Tutaminis, Shields, using the Force without gesturing, ragdolling Vitiate, TKing bridges, and collapsing ceilings, and Force enhanced strength, all things the Exile has never shown eclipsing, all Force oriented, all things the HoT has. Not to mention the fact that literally everyone in game talks about how the HoT is the most powerful Jedi seen in generations and is the greatest and most powerful in the Order by the end of Act II, Act I even, but hey, the Exile might be more powerful in the Force than the Hero of Tython. Me guessing would be pure speculation.
Yes, HoT is very powerful. This doesn't change the fact that he is a dueling based character and his saber skills are his main area. Vitiate being able to duel with him for a decent amount of time should at least give hints about whether he would be stomped by Meetra or not. Speed factor is very important as well and in favor of Vitiate in this case.
The healthiest way to approach this subject would be accepting the uncertainty which is what I've been defending from the beginning.
Originally posted by SiniousYou presented 3 options and Ive stated my opinion. Yet its either A or C.
Yes, HoT is very powerful. This doesn't change the fact that he is a dueling based character and his saber skills are his main area.
Vitiate being able to duel with him for a decent amount of time should at least give hints about whether he would be stomped by Meetra or not. Speed factor is very important as well and in favor of Vitiate in this case.
The healthiest way to approach this subject would be accepting the uncertainty which is what I've been defending from the beginning.
Originally posted by FreshestSliceWhat does the hero of Tython's fighting style have to do with Vitiate's? In almost every encounter with him, he keeps distance and attacks with the Force. So I'm sure, that when he meets one of the best duelist in the galaxy, the last thought on his mind is that he should go saber to saber with them, especially since he didn't even have a saber out during the end of duel. It's not like he chose that one random moment to put it away.
No it's not. It's an indication that Vitiate used the Force to maintain distance, illusions, Lightning, TK, etc. These are all things we see him use, in cutscene to maintain distance between himself and the Hero of Tython.
None of the things you have listed proves Vitiate's lack of dueling skills. This was exactly the case with Sidious before the PT came out and look how it turned out to be.
The healthiest way to approach this is to treat Vitiate like literally everyone else is treated here and saying that unless he even has the accolade, which he doesn't, he won't compare in something the Exile is proven to have excelled in.
Lack of knowledge doesn't mean that a character is lacking skill in that area. As I've said before countless times, due to feats, the Exile takes sabers but when a character is this powerful in the force and comes from the sith culture, lack of info on his saber skills shouldn't be an excuse to say that he would be stomped by an opponent.
Originally posted by Sinious
Wow, seriously? You couldnt quote anything firstly, and also, I've stated several times that Meetra is superior in sabers since Vitiate is featless and said that making any comments on Vitiate's saber skills is pure assumption. What we are debating here is whether Meetre would stomp Vitiate in a duel or not in case you haven't read the prior posts.Not really. You have failed again bro.
I was only stating my opinion on the matter, I didn't quote anything because I knew there wasn't anything to quote, Vitiate's duel with HoT is full of speculation and as such is subject to debate. I wasn't saying anything that went against you. 😬 you are defending his lightsaber abilities aren't you? How am I in the wrong?
Honestly, I've been nice, I haven't implied or even stated that Meetra would stomp Vitiate - how about you read my second post?- nor have I even stated that she'd even win. Everything I said in chat was a joke, im surprised you took it to heart and I never even said she'd win the whole fight and stomp!. I'm feeling kind of attacked by you dude even though I - in my opinion - haven't said anything that's bad or contradictory. 😬 but If you feel I did, then I sincerely apologize, it was not my intention to get you mad or attack you.
Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
I was only stating my opinion on the matter, I didn't quote anything because I knew there wasn't anything to quote, Vitiate's duel with HoT is full of speculation and as such is subject to debate. I wasn't saying anything that went against you. 😬 you are defending his lightsaber abilities aren't you? How am I in the wrong?Honestly, I've been nice, I haven't implied or even stated that Meetra would stomp Vitiate - how about you read my second post?- nor have I even stated that she'd even win. Everything I said in chat was a joke, im surprised you took it to heart and I never even said she'd win the whole fight and stomp!. I'm feeling kind of attacked by you dude even though I - in my opinion - haven't said anything that's bad or contradictory. 😬 but If you feel I did, then I sincerely apologize, it was not my intention to get you mad or attack you.
Not at all. I was replying with the same sarcastically mean attitude you had which I knew was entirely a joke. 🤣
I didn't take it to heart and I also apologize and sorry to see you feel attacked here. My reaction was to you stating that I claimed Vitiate would win in a duel where I have said Meetra has the upper hand due to feats several times.
Even if you didn't present counter arguments, you have said that what I claim is foolish and wrong. My claim was that Meetra wouldn't be able to stomp Vitiate so I think its pretty organic that I thought you believe Vitiate would get stomped. Other than that, nothing bothered me. (Except this spite thread)
And no, Im not defending his saber abilities. Im simply saying that we have information on this matter.
Originally posted by Sinious
None of the things you have listed proves Vitiate's lack of dueling skills. This was exactly the case with Sidious before the PT came out and look how it turned out to be.
Lack of knowledge doesn't mean that a character is lacking skill in that area. As I've said before countless times, due to feats, the Exile takes sabers but when a character is this powerful in the force and comes from the sith culture, lack of info on his saber skills shouldn't be an excuse to say that he would be stomped by an opponent.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Being all right doesn't change the fact that Surik actually has feats to back up her claim, but Vitiate doesn't. The fact that during the end of the duel Vitiate put so much distance between him and the Hero of Tython and relies on his Force abilities also doesn't lend credit to him being anywhere beyond average in sabers, where as the Exile is a master.I also like how the claim, "Powerful people are great in sabers," is one I've never seen supported anywhere. There's a difference between aptitude towards learning and actually having that skill.
Great power does tend to make you better in lightsaber combat. Kas'im claimed that in general it was the most important factor in a duel, with exceptions. All I meant that I doubt a being as immensely powerful as Vitiate is truly the limp-wristed weakling that many on these boards make him out to be.
Vitiates exact abilities in close combat are vague, true. All we have is him losing to the HoT in a duel while possessing Kira, keeping up with the HoT in their fight and a vagfue story of him disarming and killing one of his best fights with his own sword. But still, with his power I doubt he's shit.
Originally posted by Nephthys
Great power does tend to make you better in lightsaber combat. Kas'im claimed that in general it was the most important factor in a duel, with exceptions. All I meant that I doubt a being as immensely powerful as Vitiate is truly the limp-wristed weakling that many on these boards make him out to be.Vitiates exact abilities in close combat are vague, true. All we have is him losing to the HoT in a duel while possessing Kira, keeping up with the HoT in their fight and a vagfue story of him disarming and killing one of his best fights with his own sword. But still, with his power I doubt he's shit.
Well I was never arguing that he'd beat her. I just wanted to address the conceot that Vitiate is some Trebor level feeb.
Originally posted by Based
Well when he's in VS topics he's usually against top tiered Jedi/Sith. Thus he is definitely a mook with shit skills when in comparison to them.Dude got disarmed by a saber throw.
And Sidious got Judo-thrown through a table by a pregnant woman. When you're not expecting things, even the best get blind-sided.
The Exile and Kreia are some of my favorite characters in the Star Wars mythos. I place KotOR2 Exile slightly above Revan.
WIth that being said, Vitiate should win this. The Exile got ragdolled by Nihilus before he tried to devour her. I don't think Vitiate could duplicate this feat, but I believe he could overwhelm her with his lightning just like he did to Revan.
In a pure saber match, Vitiate is unknown, while the Exile has been proven to be extremely talented.
I do think it's foolish to assume that Vitiate isn't a skilled duelist though. Sidious had a few gaps where didn't use his lightsaber for years and he still kicked ass. I feel that someone as powerful as Vitiate would be somewhat skillful.
KotOR II Exile has nothing that puts her on Revan's level.
I'm loling at the prospect that Vitiate couldn't ragdoll her. He hasn't been static for 300 years. He's been constantly growing stronger. Either way, he was comparable to Nihilus before. I doubt he couldn't replicate his TK feat, which Nihilus did while weakened not at full strength.
Originally posted by Kotor3
According to?
Their primary teacher.
It was always Revan and the Exile, they won the Mandalorian Wars, the Exile was forgotten about due to the Jedi Civil War taking place directly afterwards.
It was always clear to me that Revan was the famous poster-boy but everyone forgets he had help.
Meetra was a dedicated Light Side master, her abilities confirmed well before the novel. Though I see that debating such is just going to be sideswiped with 'lolgamemechanics' when that is not strictly true at all.
Meetra has exceptional feats, even her Force Ghost was powerful enough to feed Revan the required energy and mental fortitude to control Vitiate in subtle ways. All of this on Dromund Kaas, for three centuries.
But people love to low-ball KotOR characters as much as their fans love to place them on an unreachable pedestal.
It's a shame that all the characters bar Revan get ignored in terms of genuine feats.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
KotOR II Exile has nothing that puts her on Revan's level.
All of her feats and accolades from KotOR 2 are at the bare minimum on par with the feats for Revan from KotOR. IMO the Exile is more impressive than Revan.
I'm loling at the prospect that Vitiate couldn't ragdoll her. He hasn't been static for 300 years. He's been constantly growing stronger. Either way, he was comparable to Nihilus before. I doubt he couldn't replicate his TK feat,
Nihilus doesn't have Vitiate's knowledge and mastery of the Dark Side, but he has much more raw power. Without prep, and without a nexus, we haven't seen Vitiate replicate Nihilus' feats. We've only seen Vitiate surpass Nihilus with prep and sorcery. And I'm not trying to take away anything from Sith Sorcery.
which Nihilus did while weakened not at full strength.
Nihilus did that before he tried to drain the Exile. He was hungry because Kreia tricked him sure, but he was still very powerful.
Originally posted by AncientPower
Funny because Meetra has access to the most powerful Light Side techniques where Revan doesn't. But let's not allow some form of debate to jog our memory.
Originally posted by red8
All of her feats and accolades from KotOR 2 are at the bare minimum on par with the feats for Revan from KotOR. IMO the Exile is more impressive than Revan.
Nihilus doesn't have Vitiate's knowledge and mastery of the Dark Side, but he has much more raw power. Without prep, and without a nexus, we haven't seen Vitiate replicate Nihilus' feats. We've only seen Vitiate surpass Nihilus with prep and sorcery. And I'm not trying to take away anything from Sith Sorcery.
Nihilus did that before he tried to drain the Exile. He was hungry because Kreia tricked him sure, but he was still very powerful.