Originally posted by Iskandar
Not really there's still the huge discrepancy of speed and the fact that the Shadow needs time to either think or talk to use his powers. Precognition does not help when you're fighting someone who is far, far faster than you are.
Good thing Shadow Cloud Minds is passive and covers city blocks worth of area. So how is Superman blitzing him when he cannot see him?
Originally posted by Iskandar
Okay, I know what you are talking about now. It's not an annual it's a Dynamite Comics special which is different from the annuals.The Shadow Special #1
So, don't call it an annual again in the future it will just confuse people.
Yes that is it. I thought it was a annual. I will remember that.
Originally posted by krisblaze
He can still hear him, and he would still see him.There's no mind-trickery, telepathy or soul-ability that would work on Superman.
Not quite lol. He is invisible to senses, this includes Psychic senses as Shadow clouded the mind of a powerful psychic dragon possessing people in the Shadow Annual.
Nice try though 🙂
Originally posted by CadenceV2
Not quite lol. He is invisible to senses, this includes Psychic senses as Shadow clouded the mind of a powerful psychic dragon possessing people in the Shadow Annual.Nice try though 🙂
There's no other word for it.
The caliber of things that Superman has resisted and detected is just so far beyond the Shadow's capabilities.
I'd report the thread as spite, but it's a poor nomination and not a thread contender, so I'm not sure what to do 🙂
Originally posted by CadenceV2
Good thing Shadow Cloud Minds is passive
The Shadow's ability to cloud minds is not passive he needs to active it. He is not always invisible.
and covers city blocks worth of area worth of area.
No, it's specified the Shadow has problems when he tries to use his powers on a lot of people at once. He can cloud a handful of minds at once but there's limits and times when he needs assistance if there are too many.
Masks #2
Such as here.
So how is Superman blitzing him when he cannot see him?
Superman can do so just fine in the miniscule fraction of the second before the Shadow does literally anything because the difference in speed will be that the Shadow is basically a statue standing completely still.
Originally posted by krisblaze
You're just...clueless in this debate.There's no other word for it.
The caliber of things that Superman has resisted and detected is just so far beyond the Shadow's capabilities.
I'd report the thread as spite, but it's a poor nomination and not a thread contender, so I'm not sure what to do 🙂
What's that? Both Deathstroke and Batman have out stealth Superman senses with no special Cloud Mind powers?! 🙂
Anyway, I fully believe Shadow can cloud his mind and tell him to p!ss of in a red sun, cause he can soul read you know.
Originally posted by Iskandar
The Shadow's ability to cloud minds is not passive he needs to active it. He is not always invisible.No, it's specified the Shadow has problems when he tries to use his powers on a lot of people at once. He can cloud a handful of minds at once but there's limits and times when he needs assistance if there are too many.
Masks #2
Such as here.
Superman can do so just fine in the miniscule fraction of the second before the Shadow does literally anything because the difference in speed will be that the Shadow is basically a statue standing completely still.
Yes Batman has regularly snuck up Supes reaction. Regularly as well Deathstroke temp escape Supes in a chase as well. Hell Grundy, Mettalo, Parasite all have no standard super speed, yet Supes fails to blitz them in a start of any fight.
As for you scan, it would be relevant if it was not contrary to two other feats. One being Shadow clouding he mind of a Japanese army, as well clouded the minds of a entire shipping yard too. So seems Masks (a non shadow title btw) is either WIS or PIS. Infact in masks the same arc had Shadow clouding the kind of a large skyscraper and all in it. More contradicting evidence.
I still by the argument Shadow would passively have the cloud minds on any battle scenario, and would know the battle would happen before the fight were they meet happens due to his precog feats. Even if we doubt this, then there is the in character superman who never starts a fight with speed blitz in 99% of his fights.
I listed ways and reasons Shadow can win, I will let others decide for themselves.
Also forgot to point out that scan had Shadow clouding minds for no only himself, but several other people. That's could explain the reason he needed a distraction to set it off while a neighborhood of people were watching him and his team. Hardly the norm for the Cloud Minds which is always used for just Shadow.
Originally posted by CadenceV2 Yes Batman has regularly snuck up Supes reaction. Regularly as well Deathstroke temp escape Supes in a chase as well.
Both of which are extremely nonsensical. You claim PIS of what I posted of Masks but nothing strikes you as strange when someone like Batman or Deathstroke catch Superman off-guard?
Hell Grundy, Mettalo, Parasite all have no standard super speed, yet Supes fails to blitz them in a start of any fight.
Alright then post these instances of Superman, as of New 52, failing to blitz these characters so we can see how stupid whoever wrote these fights was being.
As for you scan, it would be relevant if it was not contrary to two other feats.One being Shadow clouding he mind of a Japanese army,
The Shadow wasn't literally clouding all of their minds. What the Shadow was doing was translating what he was saying to them; through the use of his powers.
The Shadow #6
Then the Shadow tricked them into stepping onto some mines that he had planted beforehand by goading them.
as well clouded the minds of a entire shipping yard too. So seems Masks (a non shadow title btw) is either WIS or PIS.
No, this is an exaggeration and you're omitting that here the Shadow was only fighting a handful of people. About a dozen if I remember correctly.
The Shadow #1
Approximately a dozen in fact.
Also, "a non Shadow title" means nothing it's a Dynamite Comics product making it canon.
Infact in masks the same arc had Shadow clouding the kind of a large skyscraper and all in it. More contradicting evidence.
Care to reference the issue or scans where the context of your claim is described? It's not evidence until you prove that it actually exists or that you're not misinterpreting it.
How many people were being effected by it, and how many people were in this skyscraper. Those sort of details are important.
I still by the argument Shadow would passively have the cloud minds on any battle scenario, and would know the battle would happen before the fight were they meet happens due to his precog feats.
No, the Shadow wouldn't unless he is given foreknowledge on the event by someone else. His precognition requires he knows what he is looking for.
If the Shadow does not have preparation or does not know that Superman is after him how will the Shadow know to look into Superman's soul to know his future or what he will do?
More than that, how will the Shadow be able to do so in time before he is overwhelmed by Superman's far superior strength and speed?
Even if we doubt this, then there is the in character superman who never starts a fight with speed blitz in 99% of his fights.
So, Superman will just wait as some suspicious looking person tries to pull out some pistols on him or gives him a funny look before doing anything. Then basically wait what would be the equivalent of hours from his perception because of his super-speed, and do absolutely nothing as the Shadow makes his move?
Real quick most of your argument can be down to this.
I claim PIS when batman Ect done the suppose impossible. Yes and no. The key difference is Superman is consistently being out stealthier and such while Shadow has one low showing that I explain could possibly be this way for this reason. Shadow has on low showing that could be a case of a certain circumstance as I explained. Superman has a large list of showings of being out stealth.
Consistence. It is not there for Superman.
The other argument of speed blitz is that, another Superman speed blitz argument. It's been done thousand of times on thousands of threads. I do not think he can speed blitz or would shadow in character. You clearly on the side that does. Simple as that.
Also a none Shadow comic is important in the same way Wolverine solo titles, or Ghost Rider solo titles have better feats than the crap other writers put them down in non solo runs. Never argued canon, I argued the writer of Masks just either did not know the character that well, or downgraded him to make others shine. It happen in most non solo titles.
Originally posted by CadenceV2 Also forgot to point out that scan had Shadow clouding minds for no only himself, but several other people.
It wouldn't make a difference as the Shadow just needs to cloud the minds of the people who are attacking him and his compatriots.
Nor is it noted by the text or by the Shadow himself that it's more difficult to make people other than himself invisible to others.
It's just because of how many people were attacking them at once that made it difficult here.
That's could explain the reason he needed a distraction to set it off while a neighborhood of people were watching him and his team. Hardly the norm for the Cloud Minds which is always used for just Shadow.
No, it's been used on others as well such as in the Shadow Now #3.
Originally posted by Iskandar
It wouldn't make a difference as the Shadow just needs to cloud the minds of the people who are attacking him and his compatriots.Nor is it noted by the text or by the Shadow himself that it's more difficult to make people other than himself invisible to others.
It's just because of how many people were attacking them at once that made it difficult here.
No, it's been used on others as well such as in the Shadow Now #3.
That scan is nowhere near the numbers or intense involved fighting of the other scan. Not to mention it was not written in Shadow solo title. Nor consistent with current feats of Dynamite Shadow.
Either way you read the comics, but I disagree with your stance on it and you mine. Agree to disagree.
Originally posted by CadenceV2
[B]That scan is nowhere near the numbers or intense involved fighting of the other scan. Not to mention it was not written in Shadow solo title. Nor consistent with current feats of Dynamite Shadow.
They're both Dynamite Comics Shadow? The Shadow Now is a Dynamite Comics print. It's no different than using feats from both Batman Incorporated and Batman v2. They both belong to the same canon.
Same with Masks and Justice Inc. which both belong to Dynamite Comics where the Shadow also makes appearances in.
Either way you read the comics, but I disagree with your stance on it and you mine. Agree to disagree.
Alright then. Agree to disagree.
Originally posted by Iskandar
Superman is too fast if this was a straight fight he would finish it immediately before the Shadow could do anything. Just a flick on the forehead and the Shadow would be KO.Also, the Shadow's powers are a form of mysticism that are specified to work on a man's heart and soul. It can even bring people back to like if he commands them to.
The Shadow #1
http://i.imgur.com/cMiWVeo.jpg
Where the Shadow interrogates a thug he recently killed.
The Shadow #2
http://i.imgur.com/m5kbAi2.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/QIewwzL.jpgCommanding a pilot who has been peppered with bullets to stay alive long enough to land the plane they're on.
The Shadow #3
http://i.imgur.com/Ol3Z5F2.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/idP24D2.jpgCommanding an assassin back to life after shooting him in the head.
Also, even the Shadow's precognition is stated to work by tracing a person's soul to the end of its path.
The Shadow #1
And Superman has bested much stronger magic. Even in byrne days where he was notoriously weak to magic.
Originally posted by abhilegend
You really think Superman has never been attacked with magic which affect souls? And what good is precognition when you don't have time to react. Like quicksilver vs Mr. X.
Read the rest of the thread that's pretty much the point I have been supporting since the beginning. That Superman is too fast for the Shadow to actually do anything. Also, pretty sure we were talking about New 52 Superman. Who is actually pretty weak against magic.
As seen early on in Justice League Dark and Batman v2 #20 where just being in the presence of a demon made him feel nauseous.
And Superman has bested much stronger magic. Even in byrne days where he was notoriously weak to magic.
Doesn't matter regardless as Superman is too fast and will KO the Shadow before he can do pretty much of anything.
Originally posted by Iskandar
Read the rest of the thread that's pretty much the point I have been supporting since the beginning. That Superman is too fast for the Shadow to actually do anything. Also, pretty sure we were talking about New 52 Superman. Who is actually pretty weak against magic.As seen early on in Justice League Dark and Batman v2 #20 where just being in the presence of a demon made him feel nauseous.
Doesn't matter regardless as Superman is too fast and will KO the Shadow before he can do pretty much of anything.
And he was being nauseous because that demon was draining his powers. Not due to magic IIRC.
