superman vs goku

Superman is too fast

Originally posted by BloodRain
Seems to be the thing. Everything above what they usually show is brushed off, leading to a massive ballpark of an 'average' that it becomes near useless in direct, more equal comparisons. Pick and choose for seasoning.

yea it makes no sense because if you discount their high end showings then thats not the true average

That's not how we do things here, though.

High end feats do matter. As long as they make sense with respect to power sets, logic, and general history.

Spidey knocking Firelord out is pretty much the benchmark "bullshit" example. Or, say, Batman kicking Captain Marvel into a mountain for a KO.

This is a better example. Which one do we accept, the majority or the minority? Do we accept 95% of a character showings or do we base our judgment off of the 5% of their high end showings while ignoring the more consistent of their fts? Common sense to me. If we accept Highs, like I've said before, Hulk can give Galactus a run for his money. Nothing short of Eternity himself is beating Thor, and Gladiator can't be damaged by anything less than a solar system buster. Let's not even talk about what Surfer can do. He should be able to mud stomp anything short of Odin, with ease and his fights against Thanos is PIS since he didn't even use a fraction of his power. That's all this takes is a little thinking. Just a Lil bit.

Example. Hulk nearly overpowers an Abstract.

Originally posted by carver9
By the way, here is proof. Strange sent a crew in to free order, the other half of the In Betweener. They made it to the door and Read what is said "we made it to the door. Let's free the other half".

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17094436/Longshot_Saves_The_Marvel_Universe_002-014.jpg.html

Used nearly all of his power to contain Hulk and Hulk was still getting stronger. In time, we all know what would have happened (this isn't even WWH or World Breaker, this is just Savage that expanded his power like that). This same guy was controlling an IG user and the Phoenix Force. Crazy fts for Hulk. Insane ft.

Here is where the In betweener said he regained most of his power after letting Hulk go...

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17094441/Longshot_Saves_The_Marvel_Universe_002-017.jpg.html

Here is him controlling an IG user and the Phoenix Force.

http://s1007.photobucket.com/user/lgu88/media-full/dec4/longshot03c_zps1bf4890c.jpg.html

And Order and Chaos was so powerful that they were fraying the threads of reality.

http://s1007.photobucket.com/user/lgu88/media-full/dec4/longshot03d_zps46b998ba.jpg.html

Hope all enjoyed.

Or i can post Hulk fight against Nightcrawler that destroyed a freaking universe.

Is this a start off for Hulk as well? Where does this end? Do we discredit all of Hulk showings and focus on the highs? Really? Like I've said, this is common sense.

So no PB for DBZ?

Is planet busting a high end ft for DBZ? What showings goes against this?

Well considering that there's only been like, 2 or 3 planet busting feats for DB ever, yeah according to your own argument, we shouldn't use a minority over a majority

Well I'm certain you can figure it out

Precisely, onto two PBs and a moon. On the other hand there are dozens and dozens of attacks that do not come close.

Similarly DBZ only has 1 or 2 FTL 'claims'. And again, constantly shown up to MHS at best.

With the same argument, Goku loses his MHS and PB feats in favour over averages.

Don't think you get it. No where has it been said that Goku can't destroy a planet. No where has Goku failed to destroy a planet. We know DBZ capabilities. We know that on average, if they want to destroy a planet, they can. What we know about Superman is, he flew in a black hole, then he fought against numerous of beings that koed him with far less power. What we know is Superman benched a planet but his punching power has been mountain busting level, even at his highest. We see him admit he can't destroy a planet. This goes on and on and on. If Superman would've benched earth and had more showing backing that up instead of 50 thousand showings going against him, he would be a consistent planetary being but as well all know, that isn't the case. Goku never destroyed a planet but how do we know he can? Because he's far more powerful than planet busters. Frieza for example. He has the statements along with the fts of being a planet buster. He destroyed one, then we have Piccolo saying what he can do, then we have Goku telling us his capabilities, King Ki, Vegeta...the list goes on and on. Same with Cell, same with Buu...the list goes on and on and some of these people pale in comparison to Goku. The consistency is on point in DBZ. Don't hate me because the guy you are voting for is all over the place 99.9% of the time. I'm hoping you all know what 'on average' means.

And has also fought those that demonstrate planetary force. Also does he not say precisely that against one of those new gods and Konvikt? Anyhow, so to you a character must constantly demonstrate a certain level and have statements? Well now you've put the nail in your FTL coffin, right?

Edit: Seeing as we're playing this ridiculous game, how about we see the speed, durability, and physical stats (strike strength and durability) that DBZ has to offer?

99.9% of Superman's showings are of him holding back. Mental blocks and what not. His "high end feats" are what he is always capable of when he wants to let loose.

Originally posted by juggerman
99.9% of Superman's showings are of him holding back. Mental blocks and what not. His "high end feats" are what he is always capable of when he wants to let loose.

Makes sense. So he allowed himself to get destroyed in fights? Also, prove that DCNU Superman have mental blocks.

Originally posted by BloodRain
And has also fought those that demonstrate planetary force. Also does he not say precisely that against one of those new gods and Konvikt? Anyhow, so to you a character [b]must constantly demonstrate a certain level and have statements? Well now you've put the nail in your FTL coffin, right?

Edit: Seeing as we're playing this ridiculous game, how about we see the speed, durability, and physical stats (strike strength and durability) that DBZ has to offer? [/B]

When do I ever join a thread with Goku in it saying he is going to pummel anyone at FTL speeds? The only time I bring up FTL is when you all downplay the character.

Who has Superman fought that has destroyed planets?

Originally posted by carver9
Makes sense. So he allowed himself to get destroyed in fights? Also, prove that DCNU Superman have mental blocks.

Are you serously suggesting Supes doesn't consistantly hold back?

Originally posted by juggerman
Are you serously suggesting Supes doesn't consistantly hold back?

During what scene? Every hero holds back. Doesn't mean their durability, strength, and speed is held back during certain circumstances. Goku always hold back as well, does that discredit all of his showings as well?

Actually, Carver's right here.

You guys are pitting his argument against him, but what you apparently fail to realize is that DBZ only has barely over 500 chapters. Most of these other series have thousands of issues, probably hundreds of thousands of chapters altogether. Taking that all into account, nearly 99% of the Superman's can't planet bust, nearly 99% of the Hulks can't either, etc, etc.

Either way, there are different versions of all the characters EXCEPT Goku. Only different cannon sources for him, and there are only three of those(manga, anime, Daizenshuu). DBZ feats/statements are a hundred times more consistent than those of any comic I can think of, with the anime versions solo-ing most of the DC and Marvel verses.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Precisely, onto two PBs and a moon. On the other hand there are dozens and dozens of attacks that do not come close.

Similarly DBZ only has 1 or 2 FTL 'claims'. And again, constantly shown up to MHS at best.

With the same argument, Goku loses his MHS and PB feats in favour over averages.

exactly their logic is flawed lol

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Since when did we swap out cannon for non cannon around here, this place used to always be cannon>non cannon. If its changed, who changed it?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Since when did we swap out cannon for non cannon around here, this place used to always be cannon>non cannon. If its changed, who changed it?

The shockwaves from a planet buster koed Superman.

Originally posted by carver9
The shockwaves from a planet buster koed Superman.

whats your point goku has been knocked out by less