Originally posted by riv6672
More like its not such a huge deal to me that i want to pursue the matter.
This actually pertains to the OP.
While i'm curious as to what you guys think, well, i dont care that you believe it.
If you took the time for a garbage remark, you could have taken the same time to reach the information you did not give.
Looks like you just want to lie.
Regards
DL
Originally posted by riv6672
I think of religion as a personal thing, so, people who constantly put theirs in others' faces...i just dont appreciate that.Edit:
I am of course talking about RL. Forums like this, its pretty much accepted that this is what we're all here to kvetch about.
Spirituality is private. Religions are not.
Personal went out the window the moment they ask us to subsidize or exempt their taxes.
Religions dip into even the non-believers pocket so that makes religions public.
Regards
DL
Well, excuse me for not caring what you replied to my quoted posts; you seem angry and trying to get a rise out of me.
Wasted effort, really.
I find you lacking in maturity, which is why i never post in your threads. In mine though, i'll show just slightly more respect than you show me.
Even garbage posts like yours serve to move the conversation along, after all.
Oderint dum metuant,
JR
Originally posted by riv6672the way i look at it basically if i thought people were going to hell i would probably want to warn them about it too. i don't let that kind of shit get to me at all cause i feel like it's coming from the right place. i've never actually had an unpleasant experience with a proselytizer. i've had them give up on me and walk away in disappointment but that's about as negative as it gets.
I think of religion as a personal thing, so, people who constantly put theirs in others' faces...i just dont appreciate that.Edit:
I am of course talking about RL. Forums like this, its pretty much accepted that this is what we're all here to kvetch about.
Originally posted by Reflassshh
I don't. Everyone can believe whatever they want as long as they don't try to impose me their beliefs.
You give no though to others who could use help?
For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.
Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D
When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.
How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?
Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.
We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.
It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2zhlDbMfDg
They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.
African witches and Jesus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlRG9gXriVI
Jesus Camp 1of 3
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=48b_1185215493
Death to Gays.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyuKLyGUHNE
For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.
Regards
DL
Only when it affects my life. Which it has. Then I care, and it would easier if there was agreement. But in an evangelical sense, no.
There's some excellent memetic research on how and why religions have this sort of mentality built into them. It (the mentality) rewards converting others and becoming converted, and thus perpetuates the system. It's an institutionalized survival mechanism. In practice, adherents will talk about how it's saving the converts. And they really do believe that. But that's the societal face on the underlying procreative force driving most monotheistic religions, the story told to actually make it take root.
I really really hope that the religious system I believe in is true. Mormons believe that we pretty much judge ourselves. Not only do our actions but our feelings and thoughts behind those actions influence that Judgement.
Those who do not go to heaven are those that consciously choose to NOT go to heaven. In other words, a person makes a very well-informed decision not to want any part of paradise. Everyone gets a chance, a genuine chance, to accept God's plan. This means atheists in this life will get another chance in the next life before they get to move on to their judgement. If a person is approached in a bad part in their life, with an offering of the gospel, and they would definitely not accept the gospel under any circumstances, they get to accept it in the next. Basically, every single soul gets a chance to genuinely accept or reject the gospel. Everyone chose to be born into this life (we chose before we were born).
In this case, this system allows for a fair chance for everyone. The system is based on a set of choices and agency. Mercy is aloted to those that did not get a genuine chance (such as the atheist situation I described or if you're born retarded).
Lots of choices. Lots of outcomes. I think a truly merciful and loving God would offer all of these options. If my religious belief system is the most correct (that's what Mormons believe...we do not believe our system is perfect, we believe it is the most correct), then informed atheists are, on average, better than my Christian peers. This means my atheist pals are more likely to go to "heaven" than my Christian pals. That is due to our choices; on how they are determined as good, bad, or indifferent; being influenced by what we think of those choices. I've said this before but I'll say it again: if you think placing a magnet on a refrigerator is evil, then if you do it, it is counted as evil to you. You thought it was evil and did it anyway. Mercy comes into play if you were brainwashed and didn't have a genuine choice in the matter (because we do not have free will, we have limited free will).
Edit - To directly answer the thread question, no, I do not care if others believe my religion. This is because I think a person can go to heaven and be a staunch anti-theistic atheist as long as that person lived their life, generally, as good, and thought they lived their life as good. If they thought they were doing the righteous thing by stopping religious hate and "religious disease", then that may actually be righteous. There is probably a line with people thinking that mass murder is righteous such as Hitler's ideas regarding Jews. I think that this is accounted for in our "holiest of holy" thoughts where we genuinely do not think genocide is a righteous decision. I think that, deep down, Hitler knew what he was doing was wrong. But that is for God to decide because He supposedly has a perfect knowledge of our decisions included how those decisions were informed.
Originally posted by riv6672
I think you guys may be representative of the majority.
Always a dubious trait to be, but I'll take it.
I think, mostly, people don't care. Our mentality seems to default toward "live and let live" at least in America. And this is from someone who has lived in the Midwest his whole life, among very religious areas. But the religions themselves care, if that makes sense. There's an evangelical undercurrent in even relatively benign religions, and you see its affects in people who regularly attend services. They might not say anything otherwise, but the doctrines they're exposed to sort of nudge them toward it. But it doesn't come naturally. It needs such prodding.
Of course, then you have those who openly and actively try to convert, but that's a different sociological, and psychological, beast entirely.
Originally posted by Digi
Always a dubious trait to be, but I'll take it.I think, mostly, people don't care. Our mentality seems to default toward "live and let live" at least in America. And this is from someone who has lived in the Midwest his whole life, among very religious areas. But the religions themselves care, if that makes sense. There's an evangelical undercurrent in even relatively benign religions, and you see its affects in people who regularly attend services. They might not say anything otherwise, but the doctrines they're exposed to sort of nudge them toward it. But it doesn't come naturally. It needs such prodding.
Of course, then you have those who openly and actively try to convert, but that's a different sociological, and psychological, beast entirely.
Imagine how much better America would be if all religions emphasized strong monetary charitable contributions and service/labor. The social programs we would have would be second to none, no doubt.
Dammit, if only Christians actually followed their beliefs. 🙁
Originally posted by Digi
Only when it affects my life. Which it has. Then I care, and it would easier if there was agreement. But in an evangelical sense, no.There's some excellent memetic research on how and why religions have this sort of mentality built into them. It (the mentality) rewards converting others and becoming converted, and thus perpetuates the system. It's an institutionalized survival mechanism. In practice, adherents will talk about how it's saving the converts. And they really do believe that. But that's the societal face on the underlying procreative force driving most monotheistic religions, the story told to actually make it take root.
It should be obvious to see how religion has been used to promote in-group mentality which promoted solidarity (but at the exclusion of the out-group). The belief that God is on our side, not yours. I think that mindset is increasingly at odds in the modern world and with science.
Regards
DL
Originally posted by dadudemon
I really really hope that the religious system I believe in is true. Mormons believe that we pretty much judge ourselves. Not only do our actions but our feelings and thoughts behind those actions influence that Judgement.Those who do not go to heaven are those that consciously choose to NOT go to heaven. In other words, a person makes a very well-informed decision not to want any part of paradise. Everyone gets a chance, a genuine chance, to accept God's plan. This means atheists in this life will get another chance in the next life before they get to move on to their judgement. If a person is approached in a bad part in their life, with an offering of the gospel, and they would definitely not accept the gospel under any circumstances, they get to accept it in the next. Basically, every single soul gets a chance to genuinely accept or reject the gospel. Everyone chose to be born into this life (we chose before we were born).
In this case, this system allows for a fair chance for everyone. The system is based on a set of choices and agency. Mercy is aloted to those that did not get a genuine chance (such as the atheist situation I described or if you're born retarded).
Lots of choices. Lots of outcomes. I think a truly merciful and loving God would offer all of these options. If my religious belief system is the most correct (that's what Mormons believe...we do not believe our system is perfect, we believe it is the most correct), then informed atheists are, on average, better than my Christian peers. This means my atheist pals are more likely to go to "heaven" than my Christian pals. That is due to our choices; on how they are determined as good, bad, or indifferent; being influenced by what we think of those choices. I've said this before but I'll say it again: if you think placing a magnet on a refrigerator is evil, then if you do it, it is counted as evil to you. You thought it was evil and did it anyway. Mercy comes into play if you were brainwashed and didn't have a genuine choice in the matter (because we do not have free will, we have limited free will).
Edit - To directly answer the thread question, no, I do not care if others believe my religion. This is because I think a person can go to heaven and be a staunch anti-theistic atheist as long as that person lived their life, generally, as good, and thought they lived their life as good. If they thought they were doing the righteous thing by stopping religious hate and "religious disease", then that may actually be righteous. There is probably a line with people thinking that mass murder is righteous such as Hitler's ideas regarding Jews. I think that this is accounted for in our "holiest of holy" thoughts where we genuinely do not think genocide is a righteous decision. I think that, deep down, Hitler knew what he was doing was wrong. But that is for God to decide because He supposedly has a perfect knowledge of our decisions included how those decisions were informed.
You began with pure Gnostic Christian ideas but then went where one must believe in a lot of woo which kills Mormonism as a decent and moral theology.
If your theology must have magic and miracles then it is not worthy.
All Mormonism has become is another idol worshiping cult.
Regards
DL