Exar Kun vs. Revan

Started by AncientPower5 pages

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
No, KotOR hints and states numerous times Revan was the most powerful Jedi the Order have ever seen.

[b]"In battle after battle, Revan had led the Jedi and Republic forces to victory. Realizing defeat was inevitable, Mandalore the Ultimate had challenge Revan to single combat, and Revan had accepted. Though the Mandalorian fought valiantly, in the end he was no match for the Jedi Order's most powerful champion."
―Star Wars The Old Republic: Revan

"It was easy to understand how Scourge could be drawn to him; Revan's command of the Force was greater then that of anyone else she had ever met."
―Meetra Surik (Star Wars The Old Republic: Revan)

"Yet even though you are a mere apprentice, your potential is unlimited - and your progress...amazing. In all my years, I have never seen one who has mastered the initial training so quickly. You done in weeks what many cannot do in years."
―Zhar Lestin (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic)

"The Force flows through you like no student we have ever seen."
―Zhar Lestin (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic)

"...you must realize that Revan was as great as a Jedi could be."
―Juhani (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic)

"Revan's tale shows us how even the greatest of Jedi can fall to the dark side."
―Dorak (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic) [/B]

Four character opinions and a generic Champion of the Order accolade does not make him the greatest Jedi ever by that point, you realise Ulic Qel-Droma has three similar statements to.

I have read your entire Revan respect thread and none of his accolades compare to Kun's 'most powerful' accolades.

How being greatest Jedi has any merit here, when comparing to Kun? Last time I checked Kun is a Sith.

Originally posted by carthage
TOR cant claim Kun lmfao, he doesn't belong in that worthless era

👆

In sabers revan take this with a fair amount of difficulty. The double bladed lightsaber and switching between the fighting styles won't really help against revan's precog. Also, a fair amount of kun's sweeping victories in sabers came from his opponents being surprised by the double bladed lightsaber (since he's fought people that use double bladed lightsabers). In a straight duel; kun holds no surprises and revan edges him out in terms of skill. I'd also say that revan has more knowledge of the force but kun's force feats are generally above revan's. I'll say that revan wins in a good fight.

Originally posted by deathslash
In a straight duel; kun holds no surprises and revan edges him out in terms of skill. I'd also say that revan has more knowledge of the force but kun's force feats are generally above revan's.
These are both wrong.

Originally posted by ILS
These are both wrong.
I'll gladly retract both of those statements if you can prove to me that kun is better with sabers and revan is better with the force. Also, I'm assuming that we're talking about normal revan and not revan redeamed, darth revan, or dark revan. If we're talking about one of those three, then his stats would clearly change.

Kun has genuine strong feats against seriously high class opponents as a duelist. Malak is hardly a major duelist compared to the likes of Ulic whom himself is an exceptionally strong duelist with great feats of his own.

Kun was unparalleled in his time and was drawing against Ulic using Ulic's own style against him. Kun has displayed high level proficiency in Djem So, even matching masters of that form. Ataru is another form he has shown use of, displaying high class acrobatic skill. He is a confirmed Niman master and has apparently hybridised the form in some way, almost appearing like a Juyo user.

He has statements in the guide to weapons referring to him as an unstoppable combatant because of his combat tactics and precognition:

The Dark Jedi weilded the saber much as he would a quarterstaff, using one blade to block incoming attacks and then using the second blade quickly spinning the handgrip to strike a killing blow against his opponents.

Customised controls allowed him to quickly adjust the length of the blade from half a meter to one and a half meters. Panels controlled each blade's intensity: at its highest setting a blade was like any other lightsaber. With the ability to cut through dense materials such as armor plating and durasteel with virtually no resistance.
At the lowest setting a blade became a simple shaft of light delivering no damage and providing no resistance to incoming lightsaber strikes. By abruptly_shortening a blade or dropping it to the lowest power setting. Kun tricked his opponents into overextending themselves during attacks giving him an opportunity for a deadly counterstrike.

By coupling these tactics with his Force abilities to predict the attacks of his opponents, Kun became virtually unstoppable in combat.

- The Essential Guide to Weapons and Technology

The belief that Kun wins duels because of his opponents' unfamiliarity with the weapon, is contradictory to the statement that Vodo never stood a chance against Kun:

The two fought, and Vodo-Siosk Baas was no match for Exar Kun's double-bladed lightsaber and deep reserve of dark side power. Vodo-Siosk perished, slain by his former apprentice.
- Power of the Jedi Sourcebook
In the process he once more faced his former master, Vodo Siosk Baas, this time armed with a double-bladed lightsaber of his own construction. Master Vodo did not have a chance, and fell to his former student.
- The Dark Side Sourcebook

In not one other duel does he use his dual-phase saberstaff.

Furthermore Kun is stated to and has shown that he has beaten Vodo repeatedly before and not just once.

Kun was a master of lightsaber combat and had even bested Master Vodo’s quarterstaff during a sparring practice.

- Power of the Jedi Sourcebook

As the Jedi Watchman of Dantooine, Master Baas spends much of his time on the planet and trains multiple apprentices at a time. His strongest apprentice, however, is a young pupil named Exar Kun. Kun's skill with a lightsaber is so great that he claimed victory over his master many times when they sparred together.

- Jedi Academy Training Manual

As far as Force prowess goes instead of just repeating the previously stated most powerful accolades I would direct people towards these Force feats:

Odan-Urr immediately knows he is in the presence of a dark force, he reaches deep into the light, drawing on the bright power-- as he tried to teach Nomi Sunrider.

*Sever Force has no effect on Kun whom kills him shortly after*

Odan Urr goes to the Force and the darkest power in the galaxy walks away with something that will make him even stronger.
- Tales of the Jedi

So not only has Kun displayed that even Jedi as learned as Odan Urr cannot sever him from the Force but we have yet another statement referring to him as the darkest power in the galaxy.

Now beneath the ancient temples on Yavin four, he penetrates the hidden world of Sith magic._
*Exar Kun uses Force Flight to descend down an immense shaft into a hangar-bay large enough to fit a Sith Battlecruiser*

- Tales of the Jedi

Here Kun displays exceptional command over the Force using levitation, a feat replicated by very few.

As Exar Kun stands defenseless, guardian creatures leap down from the tombs.. they exist only to serve their long-dead master's purpose. Kun is not prepared to face further tests!

The creature's teeth at his throat, Kun attempts to retrieve his weapon with the force.. but the light side is mysteriously blocked. Exar Kun has only one option.

He's taken that option before.. and each time he has taken it more easily, with more confidence... he takes it now-- --the power of anger! A river of rage flows unimpeded through Exar Kun, and he easily demolishes the tomb guardians.

As the last guardian dies, a spectral voice resonates over the mummified remains of the ancient dark lords of the Sith.

Here Exar Kun demolishes nearly 30 Tuk'ata at the same time with his Force Rage.

Below, a mysterious figure strides through the battlefield-- untouched by fire or shrapnel._
*Kun employs a form of Protection Bubble to protect himself and his Massassi from the bombing runs*

- Tales of the Jedi

Here Kun displays mastery over the strongest Force Defense variant with no apparent concentration or effort, insteadly merely walking forward.

Drained from thousands of Massassi sacrifices.. the power is rising. The ritual begun.. Sith power objects unleashed! Even as the Jedi approach, Exar Kun prepares himself to unleash his powerful spirit.. to shed the chains of his mortal body and run rampant throughout the cosmos!
- Tales of the Jedi

Here Kun drains thousands of Massassi and then uses that to empower the Sith Apparatus, unleashing his deadly spirit in a display exactly like Vitiate's return on Yavin IV. This is a feat he has replicated beforehand.

During Ulic's sentencing, the doors crashed open and Exar Kun strode in, flanked by Massassi bodyguards. Before the whole assembly, the new Dark Lord of the Sith used his powers to hypnotize the observers and manipulate the president of the senate.
- The New Essential Chronology

Exar Kun easily freezes the entire senate which at this time had over 10,000 members, this assembly was stated to be full. Inferring that Kun effortlessly froze over 10,000 beings before demolishing Vodo Siosk Baas.

There is much more and I am not even going to go into his spirit feats but Kun is an exceptionally powerful and skilled being.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Four character opinions and a generic Champion of the Order accolade does not make him the greatest Jedi ever by that point, you realise Ulic Qel-Droma has three similar statements to.

I have read your entire Revan respect thread and none of his accolades compare to Kun's 'most powerful' accolades.


This:

Though the Mandalorian fought valiantly, in the end he was no match for the Jedi Order's most powerful champion. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

This is much before Revan's prime. Also, Revan have superior combat feats then Exar Kun.

You keep stating that but have yet to show why.

Also that accolade is quite obviously talking about at that time, if you read the full context. None of them matches Exar Kun being once the most powerful ever and one of the most powerful ever in Sith history in a grand total of six statements.

They are quazi equal....

But Don't feed on Revan featz, that'z nothing if you look hiz full potential. The power of encyclopedia make Revan more powerfull than you can imagine !!!

Originally posted by AncientPower
Kun has genuine strong feats against seriously high class opponents as a duelist. Malak is hardly a major duelist compared to the likes of Ulic whom himself is an exceptionally strong duelist with great feats of his own.

And yet Darth Malak became a much bigger threat to the Jedi Order then Ulic Qel-Droma. He must have great potential which he eventually realized and tapped into to become one of the greatest heroes of the Jedi Order during the Mandalorian Wars and later on proceeded to rule a Sith Empire with iron fist. Let us not forget that Darth Malak was the strongest Sith Lord in the Empire created by Revan after the latter's removal and his combat related accomplishments include victory over powerful Bastilla Shan in single combat.

So whenever we think about Darth Malak, we should ignore his embarrassing Alek history which doesn't do justice to the character who would rise to great heights in the future and represents his days of lack of decent experience and knowledge. Thanks to shortsightedness of some authors, Darth Malak's early history ended-up being mishandled. Mr. Drew might be a mediocre author but he does justice to his characters in his writings and I am glad that he took charge of Revan's story in literature after the disaster that was dubbed as Knights of the Old Republic comics.

Even if Darth Malak is supposedly lacking in martial aspects of combat (an assumption that I doubt personally), he makes up for such inadequacy with his command of the Force and raw power that he realizes during his later years.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Kun was unparalleled in his time and was drawing against Ulic using Ulic's own style against him. Kun has displayed high level proficiency in Djem So, even matching masters of that form. Ataru is another form he has shown use of, displaying high class acrobatic skill. He is a confirmed Niman master and has apparently hybridised the form in some way, almost appearing like a Juyo user.

He has statements in the guide to weapons referring to him as an unstoppable combatant because of his combat tactics and precognition:

The belief that Kun wins duels because of his opponents' unfamiliarity with the weapon, is contradictory to the statement that Vodo never stood a chance against Kun:

In not one other duel does he use his dual-phase saberstaff.

Furthermore Kun is stated to and has shown that he has beaten Vodo repeatedly before and not just once.

As far as Force prowess goes instead of just repeating the previously stated most powerful accolades I would direct people towards these Force feats:

So not only has Kun displayed that even Jedi as learned as Odan Urr cannot sever him from the Force but we have yet another statement referring to him as the darkest power in the galaxy.

Here Kun displays exceptional command over the Force using levitation, a feat replicated by very few.

Here Exar Kun demolishes nearly 30 Tuk'ata at the same time with his Force Rage.

Here Kun displays mastery over the strongest Force Defense variant with no apparent concentration or effort, insteadly merely walking forward.

Here Kun drains thousands of Massassi and then uses that to empower the Sith Apparatus, unleashing his deadly spirit in a display exactly like Vitiate's return on Yavin IV. This is a feat he has replicated beforehand.

Exar Kun easily freezes the entire senate which at this time had over 10,000 members, this assembly was stated to be full. Inferring that Kun effortlessly froze over 10,000 beings before demolishing Vodo Siosk Baas.

There is much more and I am not even going to go into his spirit feats but Kun is an exceptionally powerful and skilled being.


Exar Kun have always been admired for his legendary dueling skills and power.

However, some of his accolades no longer sit well with the latest developments in the lore, which is a problem that the character's fans are not coming to terms with. Exar Kun can no longer be regarded as the most powerful Sith Lord in the galaxy and darkest power in presence of Emperor Vitiate.

As for Revan, he arguably surpassed every Jedi in power in history during the Mandalorian Wars:

Though the Mandalorian fought valiantly, in the end he was no match for the Jedi Order's most powerful champion. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

NOTE: This accolade implies that Revan is the most powerful Jedi of his era and have possibly surpassed all Jedi in power throughout galactic history. He could be above the likes of Ulic-Qel Droma and Nomi Sunrider at this point.

However, Revan exponentially grew in power afterwards:

In their last meeting he had overwhelmed Revan completely; it wasn't even fair to call it a battle. Revan had grown since then. He was far more powerful now, but was he a match for the Emperor? (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

This exponential growth in power explains why Darth Malak stood no chance against Revan even after being fully prepared to tackle external threats on Star Forge and same goes for Darth Nyriss who was also one of the most powerful Sith Lords in the galaxy and easily defeated Lord Scourge and Meetra Surik in single combat, both of whom who were highly accomplished warriors and legends in their own right. This exponential growth in power also explains how Revan was able to cope with torturous situation spanning centuries and his capability to hold his own against some of the most capable and dangerous Strike Teams ever assembled in galactic history to eliminate fearsome threats. Revan was even able to dominate a Strike Team comprising of powerhouses such as Satele Shan and Darth Marr with his raw power, which is one of the greatest feats of power demonstrated in combat situations ever, apparently surpassed by only Emperor Vitiate throughout galactic history.

All are indications that Revan > Exar Kun

Originally posted by AncientPower
You keep stating that but have yet to show why.

Also that accolade is quite obviously talking about at that time, if you read the full context. None of them matches Exar Kun being once the most powerful ever and one of the most powerful ever in Sith history in a grand total of six statements.


That is not an era-restricted accolade, that is a creative liberties oriented accolade which have the flexibility to cover history, not just an era.

Below is an example of an era-restricted accolade:

"Luke Skywalker is still the most powerful Jedi in the galaxy. I think we should assume he has a plan."

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
As of Revan, he arguably surpassed every Jedi in power in history during Mandalorian Wars:

Though the Mandalorian fought valiantly, in the end he was no match for the Jedi Order's most powerful champion. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

[B]NOTE: This accolade implies that Revan is the most powerful Jedi of his era and have possibly surpassed all Jedi in power throughout galactic history. He could be above the likes of Ulic-Qel Droma and Nomi Sunrider at this point.

However, Revan exponentially grew in power afterwards:

In their last meeting he had overwhelmed Revan completely; it wasn't even fair to call it a battle. Revan had grown since then. He was far more powerful now, but was he a match for the Emperor? (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

All are indications that Revan > Exar Kun [/B]


Truly excellent point here. 👆

Revan as of TOR 3.0 is solidly above DE sidious, yoda, and even Luke in terms of direct combat feats. He was Force folding, force storming, and TK'ing the galaxy's most powerful force users all simultaneously in a 8v1 fight.

There is no other combat feat on this level as of current lore, and hate TOR or not its canon as they are all scripted game mechanics.

Originally posted by Board Walker
Revan as of TOR 3.0 is solidly above DE sidious, yoda, and even Luke in terms of direct combat feats. He was Force folding, force storming, and TK'ing the galaxy's most powerful force users all simultaneously in a 8v1 fight.

There is no other combat feat on this level as of current lore, and hate TOR or not its canon as they are all scripted game mechanics.


Emperor Vitiate have a feat of one-shotting an entire Dark Council, which is the only feat I can think of that outshines Revan's most impressive direct combat related demonstrations.

Lol.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Lol.

Your butthurt is most amusing. 😈

Originally posted by deathslash
I'll gladly retract both of those statements if you can prove to me that kun is better with sabers and revan is better with the force. Also, I'm assuming that we're talking about normal revan and not revan redeamed, darth revan, or dark revan. If we're talking about one of those three, then his stats would clearly change.

That'z true.... Revan a bit better than Kun with the force but that'z more complicate than the light zaber part with Revan zuper battle mazter level zkill wich izn't enough againzt Kun dirty bitchy ztyle.. Even Reven have alzo hiz own unorthodox methode learned from Krei and her Makazhi... Yhea becauze Makazhi alzo = Non enzlavement to the form, and ingeniouzity invention and that'z Kreia told uz about Revan gnégné zhe waz her firzt mazter etc philozophy... ANd it'z really linked to kreia phylozophy...
If you ztuddy Revan Djem zo and zhien zo learned by himzelf... You zee?
Zo it won't zuprize revan az it zuprized vodo....

Anyway Force combat iz more complicated, becauz Revan iz more a force maztery, inzanly powerfull in all force ability and a little in zith zorcery...

Where Kun iz the quazi total oppozite....

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Emperor Vitiate have a feat of one-shotting an entire Dark Council, which is the only feat I can think of that outshines Revan's most impressive direct combat related demonstrations.

I can think of another one.

Spoiler:
Defeating Revan. 😐

Lol