Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Ummm he clearly had discovered his powers, that is beyond question. He just wasn't fully aware of what he was capable of. Point is, he was CLEARLY and visibly struggling. Of that there can be no question. You can see support beams appear to bend some, but he was visibly struggling. Even if the beam remained totally rigid, wouldn't change his visible struggle with the weight. A weight, when all is said and done is his only quantifiable feat, and one he was struggling with. Hardly what I would call no. 1 impressive.
It's not a good example because Superman hadn't fully tested his limits yet, he couldn't even fly. His later feats are on a completely different level. Kurse was destroyed by a mini-singularity, while Supes overpowered a much larger one.
Ka-El>The Kurse>=The Incredible Hulk>The Mighty Thor.
Originally posted by FrothByte
Thing is, I believe Superman's strength was greatly enhanced by his speed and flight. When you look at his greatest strength feats, it was either aided by flight (gravity beam feat) or by speed (punching and charging at the kryptonians). Now if we were to remove his speed and flight then I believe Kurse and Hulk are actually pretty close to him in strength.
Also, concerning the World Engine, before he started flying the strength necessary to simply stand upright under a beam that was flattening skyscrapers (something a falling leviathan couldn't do) has to be considerable.
And let us never forget the oil derrick. That thing was huge.
Originally posted by TheGrat1
Ka-El>The Kurse>=The Incredible Hulk>The Mighty Thor.I took all of that into account but remember his mountain leaping before he learned to fly? That craps all over any jumping feats Hulk ever showed. His best was leaping to the top of Stark tower which (assuming he jumped from the street below) would be about 800-900 feet at best (it is considerably shorter than the nearby Chrysler building (1,046 feet)). Kal was well over a mile above his jumping points, especially on the last leap.
Also, concerning the World Engine, before he started flying the strength necessary to simply stand upright under a beam that was flattening skyscrapers (something a falling leviathan couldn't do) has to be considerable.
And let us never forget the oil derrick. That thing was huge.
Regarding jumping feats, I'm going to quote something that Robtard mentioned about Hulk's jumping in Incredible Hulk:
Rio De Janeiro to even the Southern border of Guatemala is around 3,800-3,900 miles. Hulk to have done that trip in a single night means his long jumps are many, many miles long.
As for the World Engine, IIRC it wasn't exactly flattening buildings with one or two shots. It took repeated pulses to eventually destroy the buildings. The leviathans were casually tearing up buildings by brushing against them. Falling unto a building is not quite the same as flying into it with intent. I have no doubt that had a leviathan flown straight down into a building that it'd have no trouble decimating the whole thing.
Then for that oil rig... let's be honest, Clark was seriously struggling with that one. You could see his strain. Even if the platform didn't collapse I seriously doubt he could have maintained keeping that tower aloft. Plus, the leviathan does look bigger and denser than that oil tower.
Originally posted by Psychotron
The Leviathan was one-shotted by Stark's missile, it can't be very tough.
Actually the Leviathan's armor was stated to be so tough that Iron-man could drain his battery dry before getting through it, the only time a missile of his had any effect was after the Hulk punched one and caused some of the armor to fall off.
Originally posted by Psychotron
That doesn't even make sense, the armor practically fell off on its own.
Hulk punched it so hard that its body structure was compromised. That's why the armor fell off. In any case, IM's arsenal had zero effect on its armor. Hulk punching that leviathan was a better feat than Superman struggling with that oil rig.
Originally posted by FrothByte
Hulk punched it so hard that its body structure was compromised. That's why the armor fell off. In any case, IM's arsenal had zero effect on its armor. Hulk punching that leviathan was a better feat than Superman struggling with that oil rig.
Well yeah, if you use Hulk's highest feat against Superman's lowest then Hulk wins.
Originally posted by Psychotron
That doesn't even make sense, the armor practically fell off on its own.
After the Hulk's mega-punch and the leviathan started to flip over, before then Iron-man couldn't even scratch them...the movie flat out stated Iron-man didn't have the power to get through their armor.
Originally posted by Psychotron
Well yeah, if you use Hulk's highest feat against Superman's lowest then Hulk wins.
Yeah but like I said, name me a better strength feat of Superman that doesn't have him utilizing flight or speed?
This is not me dissing Superman or anything, I know it's unfair to ask a feat where he doesn't use flight and speed as these are very natural to him. However, we also can't just assume that his highest end feats directly show his strength when his flight and speed were a big part of it.
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
The simple could hard facts are that Superman didn't have a great, good or really decent quantifiable strength feat in the entire movie. we can try and pretend like that isn't so, but it is.
Are you joking? Nam, who is weaker than Kal, was capable of tossing entire trains, which Supes tanked. Zod, also weaker, was moving satellites. A collision between Zod and Kal created an crater in a skyscraper from the shockwave. Supes is definitely the strongest out of all listed here.
Originally posted by FrothByte
Regarding jumping feats, I'm going to quote something that Robtard mentioned about Hulk's jumping in Incredible Hulk:As for the World Engine, IIRC it wasn't exactly flattening buildings with one or two shots. It took repeated pulses to eventually destroy the buildings. The leviathans were casually tearing up buildings by brushing against them. Falling unto a building is not quite the same as flying into it with intent. I have no doubt that had a leviathan flown straight down into a building that it'd have no trouble decimating the whole thing.
Then for that oil rig... let's be honest, Clark was seriously struggling with that one. You could see his strain. Even if the platform didn't collapse I seriously doubt he could have maintained keeping that tower aloft. Plus, the leviathan does look bigger and denser than that oil tower.
Actually as soon as the world engine hit it completely disintegrated the building right in its beam, which would be considered ground zero. Then the expanding gravity was crushing the larger area around ground zero.
A large flying mass flying through buildings crashing through buildings to you is more powerful then the world engine, or equal in power? That actually makes zero sense..So then a small object such as Clark flying through the world engine and building would be much more impressive.
So basically what you are saying is a beam of light that took out part of the city with basically gravity is less impressive and powerful then the leviathan flying around through buildings and somehow the leviathan is more powerful now?
Clarks struggling versus what? Are you taking Quan's stance now?
The oil rig scene proves nothing more then that was his first test of strength and he saved the people and the frame gave way beneath his feat.
Originally posted by Inhuman
I did watch the movie and what I said happened. What movie were you watching? I do realize he was learning his power (that was one of the many dumb points/parts in the movie btw)
There's context there, Superman still hadn't mastered his powers, and the whole platform gave in.
Originally posted by FrothByte
Yeah but like I said, name me a better strength feat of Superman that doesn't have him utilizing flight or speed?This is not me dissing Superman or anything, I know it's unfair to ask a feat where he doesn't use flight and speed as these are very natural to him. However, we also can't just assume that his highest end feats directly show his strength when his flight and speed were a big part of it.
He still has his striking feats, but I don't see why flight is a big deal. Like I said before a flightless Zod managed to overpower a flying Superman. It just doesn't seem like flight adds any strength. Also, Superman still had to stand up in the gravity beam before flying up, so that counts.
Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
The simple reality is this guys... Superman displayed no quantifiable feats that were remotely even impressive. The gravitational beam feat is meh and unquantifiable. It was mostly a durability and flight feat, much more than a strength one.
And which quantifiable feats did Thor or Hulk possess. You have no idea the weight of the leviathan and since it was under anti gravity, it makes it essentially weightless. On the other hand you have a gravity engine that has so much power by amplifying gravity it crushed the city and was going to turn earth into krypton. Hows that for quantifiable. 😆
IIRR Thor had to get saved from being crushed by a space ship, which had that not happened he would not be getting up from that measuring how screwed up he was after Kurse tossed a boulder on him. Clark on the other hand was having trains, gravity beams, oil rigs, and other Kryptonians beat down on him without so much as drawing blood.