Talzin, Maul and Savage vs. Vitiate, HoT and Satele

Originally posted by Nephthys
I know what you said.

Uh, no she didn't. Being telekinetically superior to Revan. Which doesn't necessarily put him above Sidious, but I mean Sidious [b]didn't use TK on her, that doesn't mean that he couldn't. And that's a speculative argument, TK can bypass such a shield if he chooses to simply throttle her. TK's not a bolt of energy.

And... that's impressive to you? I mean, it was probably a ritual iirc for one thing. And for another he was a defenseless captive. [/B]

Hahahahahahahaa, Your double standards amaze me. "It was a ritual"

When has Vitiate use drain outside a ritual setting? How was he Telekinetically superior to Revan again? And no, force barriers block TK bursts like Force pushes and pulls. Someone who can evaporate at will isn't exactly going to be hit by debris either.

When is Dooku ever going to be defenseless? It was a contest of the force, he wasnt defenseless at all.

Originally posted by Selenial
Hahahahahahahaa, Your double standards amaze me. "It was a ritual"

When has Vitiate use drain outside a ritual setting? How was he Telekinetically superior to Revan again? And no, force barriers block TK bursts like Force pushes and pulls. Someone who can evaporate at will isn't exactly going to be hit by debris either.

When is Dooku ever going to be defenseless? It was a contest of the force, he wasnt defenseless at all.

Not really, you don't see me using Vitiate's ritual shit here do you? If we're going that route he's infinitely superior for being capable of draining the galaxy. Totally legit.

I didn't say he had. I just questioned how exactly Talzins drain was so great considering its unverified that she can do it in combat against a resisting opponent. Or that she can do it in a corporeal state. Though as a disembodied spirit he fed on the death caused by the Revanites to return dunno if that counts. Plus he was draining Revan from across the galaxy as well as his Hands.

Vitiate's power is so great that Revan was unable to affect even an Imperial Guardsman drawing upon it with TK, as well as Vitiate smacking Revan around in their fight. Clearly indicating superior TK ability. And I'm not talking about pushes and pulls, I'm talking about Vitiate disintegrating her like he did T3.

Can Talzin still evaporate now that she's revived? I doubt it.

How was there any contest at all? Dooku didn't defend himself at all, just like every time Talzin sorceries him.

Waiting to hear how she'll defend against the greatest telepath in history tho.

Originally posted by Selenial
Not gonna bother with the rest, because lol.

But really, pushing Windu back makes her an expert swordsman.

It is obvious that Nighsisters do not practice martial arts in the same way like Jedi do. Pushing Windu back momentarily isn't such a big deal.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Not really, you don't see me using Vitiate's ritual shit here do you? If we're going that route he's infinitely superior for being capable of draining the galaxy. Totally legit.

I didn't say he had. I just questioned how exactly Talzins drain was so great considering its unverified that she can do it in combat against a resisting opponent. Or that she can do it in a corporeal state. Though as a disembodied spirit he fed on the death caused by the Revanites to return dunno if that counts. Plus he was draining Revan from across the galaxy as well as his Hands.

Vitiate's power is so great that Revan was unable to affect even an Imperial Guardsman drawing upon it with TK, as well as Vitiate smacking Revan around in their fight. Clearly indicating superior TK ability. And I'm not talking about pushes and pulls, I'm talking about Vitiate disintegrating her like he did T3.

Can Talzin still evaporate now that she's revived? I doubt it.

How was there any contest at all? Dooku didn't defend himself at all, just like every time Talzin sorceries him.

Waiting to hear how she'll defend against the greatest telepath in history tho.

You asked what her drain feats were. I'm not trying to use it here.

No, Vitiate's "power is so great" that on a Dark Side Nexus, a weakened Revan couldn't instantaneously rag-doll a guard that's trained to withstand force attacks. Oh how pro. And oh wow, totally conceding the debate right here. I didn't know Vitiate could Tk whole protocol droids!! 😱 😱 😱

That's a baseless and frankly hilarious argument, she can do everything in her revived form that she could in her original form. You do not seem to understand that her death occurred during the Jar Jar act, she had shown the ability to teleport and discussed it in the book of sith before that.

And surely that shows he can't defend himself? And you're using a pathetic argument with TP to be honest, for multiple reasons. Vitiate's best TP has all been done over time and with Rituals, the Children of the Emperor took years to condition. The only one you could even say was instant was the HOT, and even that is nothing but assumption.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Certainly.

It is obvious that Nighsisters do not practice martial arts in the same way like Jedi do. Pushing Windu back momentarily isn't such a big deal.

Because inhabiting someone elses body and using a Lightsaber with a completely abnormal hilt is a perfect showing of someone's combat abilities. Lol.

Beating Windu is incredibly impressive actually, there's not a single TOR Era combatant who could do it.

Revan.

Originally posted by Selenial
Because inhabiting someone elses body and using a Lightsaber with a completely abnormal hilt is a perfect showing of someone's combat abilities. Lol.

As for her clash with Windu, she conjured a magical sword (bristling with flames) which she swung widely at Windu; no technique or skill apparent, as noted by Sidious. She pressed Windu because of strength factor and the flammable sword may have confused Windu a bit but the battle was interrupted.

Originally posted by Selenial
Beating Windu is incredibly impressive actually, there's not a single TOR Era combatant who could do it.

Windu isn't impossible to defeat.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
My point is that Talzin is not an expert of lightsaber dueling arts which I proved with evidence.

As for her clash with Windu, she conjured a magical sword (bristling with flames) which she swung widely at Windu; no technique or skill apparent, as noted by Sidious. She pressed Windu because of strength factor and the flammable sword may have confused Windu a bit but the battle was interrupted.

And you know this how?

Windu isn't impossible to defeat.

That's merely the style of the show. Ventress swings with absolutely no skill in her duel with Grevious, neither does he. Neither does Eeth Koth or even Windu, TCW was terrible at showing lightsaber skill. That's like me saying Vitiate gets speedblitzed because he's slow as **** in all the Cutscenes he's in.

Her Sword won't have "confused him". No Jedi survives what Windu has survived if they almost get beheaded due to being "confused." A Bounty hunter electrocuted Windu with a baby strapped to their chest and he still reacted fast enough to save his own life...

Is there a reason Vitiate can't just mind control all of team 1 by himself? Not sure you can argue the Dathomiri have a stronger will then Revan.

As for beating them in other ways...my favorite question is 'how much prep did Vitiate get?'

He gets enough prep to not suck and not need a nexus to accomplish a vast majority of his feats

Originally posted by Angelalex242
Is there a reason Vitiate can't just mind control all of team 1 by himself?

That being said, Team 2 takes this.

When the hell did Talzin "beat" Windu. All she did was miss him with wild swings and then blade lock him. Hardly enough to call her even a half decent duelist.

Originally posted by ILS
When the hell did Talzin "beat" Windu. All she did was miss him with wild swings and then blade lock him. Hardly enough to call her even a half decent duelist.

Poor choice of words, I stand by my original statement that she forced him on the defensive. And that is impressive none the less.

Again, Wild swings is just their style, like here: http://youtu.be/ZF97aJO7MuM?t=50s

lol Selenial's at it again with her unbelievably illogical posts.

Originally posted by Sinious
lol Selenial's at it again with her unbelievably illogical posts.

Well OK, by your infallible Logic:

Vitiate can only move at a maximum of 2mph.
Trips over his own shoe laces.
Struggles to get off his chair.
Has no Strength abilities.
Knows nothing more than two lightsaber moves.
Moves at a slower pace than my near-comatose grandmother during combat.

Yay for Sinious logic, I'll have to use this next time we have a debate on Vitiate.

Originally posted by Selenial
Poor choice of words, I stand by my original statement that she forced him on the defensive. And that is impressive none the less.

Again, Wild swings is just their style, like here: http://youtu.be/ZF97aJO7MuM?t=50s

The difference being Ventress has on plenty of occasions demonstrated high levels of skill, precision and intricacy, whereas Talzin just has this one showing of swinging wildly at Mace and getting nowhere. I don't know where to place her in terms of skill but certainly nowhere near Windu.

Actually, I wonder...how much prep DOES Vitiate need to be at 'standard operating levels' off nexus? Do we have a time window?

Originally posted by Selenial
Well OK, by your infallible Logic:

Vitiate can only move at a maximum of 2mph.
Trips over his own shoe laces.
Struggles to get off his chair.
Has no Strength abilities.
Knows nothing more than two lightsaber moves.
Moves at a slower pace than my near-comatose grandmother during combat.

Yay for Sinious logic, I'll have to use this next time we have a debate on Vitiate.

Pumpkin I was referring to your earlier posts.

Besides, you accuse people with having double standards but I don't see you declaring Vitiate an expert swordsman for being able to duel HoT for a decent amount of time.

Originally posted by ILS
She didn't really force him on the defensive. She didn't demonstrate any great level of skill against Windu, all she did was swing at him. He moved back, they blade locked, and that was that. Nothing too outstanding.

The difference being Ventress has on plenty of occasions demonstrated high levels of skill, precision and intricacy, whereas Talzin just has this one showing of swinging wildly at Mace and getting nowhere. I don't know where to place her in terms of skill but certainly nowhere near Windu.

I'm not even remotely saying she's Windu level, don't worry.

But Windu's Vapaad would honestly allow him to speedblitz anyone who hasnt mastered blade combat in seconds, Similar to Sidious' speedblitz, except Windu's would be done through skill.

The fact Talzin had at least forced him back and shown her ability to push the attack long enough to stop any retaliation at least proves she's not a mook, where Vitiate really is. With a lightsaber of course.

Originally posted by Sinious
Pumpkin I was referring to your earlier posts.

Besides, you accuse people with having double standards but I don't see you declaring Vitiate an expert swordsman for being able to duel HoT for a decent amount of time.

He didn't though, he summoned illusions and used Lightning and shit, depending on how you look at game mechanics. Even in the cutscene vitiate doesn't even have his blade out...

He used the force.