The only context is that he was fighting several villains before that and was tired.
Under the same writer regular Thor WTFowned Loki in h2h.
And Masterson was every bit as strong as Thor. It's just an outlier for Loki. In the previous issue Skurge was owning both Dargo Ktor and Masterson at the same time and he is class 90 at best.
Originally posted by Stoic
The feat happened. ignore it if you want, but that does not mean that it did not happen. It's not idiotic, it's denial that has gripped you.A class 50 isn't doing that to Masterson Thor. Stay away from those handbook strength entries, because Spiderman alone has done things that have surpassed the 50 ton range.
iirc the Thing was unable to even make Gladiator flinch with his best Sunday punch. This is something that should also be taken into consideration. Beta Ray Bill was busting planets, and even managed to scar Galactus when he appeared in the Storm Breaker mini. Loki was actually able to hurt him to the point of a KO.
Originally posted by TheHulk
Nothing to suggest that to be honest, but hey, it's a theory.
Originally posted by Stoic
Yes you are correct Loki would lose horribly, but so would Ben, and Captain Britain. Let's not forget that Loki is a great deal more agile than Ben as well. This has to count for something. Strength is not the end all and be all. Look at how many times the more agile character has come out on top of the slower but stronger brute. Comics, and their plots are the reason that Loki didn't win 90% of his battles with Thor. I mean he always preps for his battles, and there were a number of ways that he could have killed Thor in the past, but plot dictated that such was never going to happen. All the same Loki has enough strength to hurt Ben, and has the agility to stay out of range, not to mention the idea that he is ancient, and isn't a stranger to combat, as well as being vastly smarter than Ben.
Strength isn't the be all end all, you are right. But in this case, the strength of The Thing seals the deal here. Loki's agility doesn't give him enough of an edge to compensate for the massive physical difference between them. In this case, Loki is fighting the thing. If it was a question of avoiding some punches and fleeing using his agility, that might be one thing. But since Loki has to fight Ben here..well his agility is not enough to allow him to accomplish that. In other words, Loki needs his magic to stand any kind of real chance here. Though then of course it's a stomp in the other direction.
Though I will say I disagree with The Thing being a Class 100, but you don't need to be class 100 to have a vast strength advantage over Loki.
Originally posted by Stoic
The feat happened. ignore it if you want, but that does not mean that it did not happen. It's not idiotic, it's denial that has gripped you.A class 50 isn't doing that to Masterson Thor. Stay away from those handbook strength entries, because Spiderman alone has done things that have surpassed the 50 ton range.
iirc the Thing was unable to even make Gladiator flinch with his best Sunday punch. This is something that should also be taken into consideration. Beta Ray Bill was busting planets, and even managed to scar Galactus when he appeared in the Storm Breaker mini. Loki was actually able to hurt him to the point of a KO.
Originally posted by Surtur
Strength isn't the be all end all, you are right. But in this case, the strength of The Thing seals the deal here. Loki's agility doesn't give him enough of an edge to compensate for the massive physical difference between them. In this case, Loki is fighting the thing. If it was a question of avoiding some punches and fleeing using his agility, that might be one thing. But since Loki has to fight Ben here..well his agility is not enough to allow him to accomplish that.Though I will say I disagree with The Thing being a Class 100, but you don't need to be class 100 to have a vast strength advantage over Loki.
Ben was a confirmed CL100 in the Avengers Initiative
Okay so that is just someone saying Thing can fight Class 100's. The thing of it is..the Marvel class system is wonky. The higher the class is the less literal the number becomes. A class 5 can truly just lift 5 tons. A class 100 can lift millions upon millions of tons. So now with that in mind, you have to ask yourself..well okay, if someone like Superman or Thor would be a Class 100, what tier would Thing be? He can lift more then 100 tons sure, but he is not on the level of Superman, Thor, etc. Thus, you peg thing at around Class 80ish.
Originally posted by Surtur
Okay so that is just someone saying Thing can fight Class 100's. The thing of it is..the Marvel class system is wonky. The higher the class is the less literal the number becomes. A class 5 can truly just lift 5 tons. A class 100 can lift millions upon millions of tons. So now with that in mind, you have to ask yourself..well okay, if someone like Superman or Thor would be a Class 100, what tier would Thing be? He can lift more then 100 tons sure, but he is [b]not on the level of Superman, Thor, etc. Thus, you peg thing at around Class 80ish. [/B]
If they're only looking to teach them just the "tactics" to use against a CL100 opponent... And not trying to show them what it "feels" like to go up against a CL100 opponent... Why not use someone in their own weight class (CL1-CL20) that's fought CL100's instead of a complete "BRICK" (Pun not really...really intended, kind of though) that is nothing like any of the trainees and who out muscles them all by (per your version of Ben) 60-80+ tons.
Sorry it doesn't make any sense to me... How Ben would deal with CL100 character is completely different than how a CL20 would have to handle one... Am I wrong...?
A CL20 isn't going to go toe to toe with a CL100 which is how Ben would do it... And does do it.
Why not bring in someone like Beast, Zemo, Ms. Marvel, Bishop, Samson...Etc.
Just to name a few that are all 60-80+ tons closer (With your version of Ben) in strength to these trainees than Ben is and they all would have to try and deal with a CL100 threat in manners much closer to the trainees needed manners of doing so... Than to go toe to toe like Ben does.
If you look at the page carefully Ben says "Anytime rookies" "Show me whatcha got". They all rush Ben and he lets them attack him and he let's them do their thing and then he tosses them around a bit... Vance asks Ben if he was "having fun"? Ben says "You kiddin' Vance? This's just like our old days in the Unlimited Class Wrestlin' Federation".
Vance thanks Ben for "going easy on them". And calls it a day.
Clearly showing that Ben was there to allow the trainees to latch on to a CL100 threat and see what it felt like to do so.
I truly think to look at it in any other way is as Mr. Spock would say "illogical".
Hence Ben is CL100.
Originally posted by SurturThat's not how that works at all.
Okay so that is just someone saying Thing can fight Class 100's. The thing of it is..the Marvel class system is wonky. The higher the class is the less literal the number becomes. A class 5 can truly just lift 5 tons. A class 100 can lift millions upon millions of tons. So now with that in mind, you have to ask yourself..well okay, if someone like Superman or Thor would be a Class 100, what tier would Thing be? He can lift more then 100 tons sure, but he is [b]not on the level of Superman, Thor, etc. Thus, you peg thing at around Class 80ish. [/B]
Your gripes have the same merit as complaining that Thor shouldn't be a class 100 because Galactus is a class 100.
It's not an accurate measurement except from the people who orbit that strength gap, and it never has been. It doesn't need to be adapted to fit into people like Thor. It needs to be forgotten altogether at that stage.
Although, if your issue is with it putting Thing on the same wavelength of Thor, then how is 80 any better when it stops becoming tons? What Thing is only 20 off of Thor? Thor's just a 5th stronger than him? Thor is 100, but he's 100 and something on the scale that isn't tons anymore? How does this make more sense? How accurate.
It's a bell curve scale where the part where the curve sharply inclines is at around 100 tons. It's to separate the incalculables from the majority of the "just super-humanly strong" guys that made up like 70% of the comic universe like Iron man level guys and down, then on the other side of him it goes all the way up to guys like Thor who can move mass that can't be calculated on any type of scale so he is in the same bracket as Iron man even though we all know they're really not according to that old ass system
Superman is considered class 100 in the wiki so now it will make sense for a select few