Well he's hardly just a street fighter, though he is that.
He's well trained in MA and a particularly adept boxer.
I've always considered the two characters comparable prior to the reboot, in that they both have that intangible "heart".
I made this Versus months ago,
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=596913
referencing Marvel Two in One Annual 7 and Superman Vs Muhammed Ali.
In this case, DCnu Superman doesnt seem as skilled as other versions. Give him a few years.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah, I don't see why Ben would be favorite here. Clark beat the shit out of Wraith who was stronger than him while being heavily injured with his skills.Who has Ben beaten with his "skills"? Just because he is a street fighter doesn't mean much.
Ben is former military and he has participated in boxing compétitions since before he got his powers.
Originally posted by riv6672
Well he's hardly just a street fighter, though he is that.
He's well trained in MA and a particularly adept boxer.I've always considered the two characters comparable prior to the reboot, in that they both have that intangible "heart".
I made this Versus months ago,http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=596913
referencing Marvel Two in One Annual 7 and Superman Vs Muhammed Ali.
In this case, DCnu Superman doesnt seem as skilled as other versions. Give him a few years.
Originally posted by Bentley
Ben is former military and he has participated in boxing compétitions since before he got his powers.
I wonder though, who has Superman fought, the way Ben has...
By that i mean, with just super strength, skill, and invulnerability (the entire fight, with no other powers having been in play, not just a part of that fight), who has out classed him the way opponents like the Hulk and Champion have out classed Ben
...and how's HE done?
Originally posted by riv6672
I wonder though, who has Superman fought, the way Ben has...By that i mean, with just super strength, skill, and invulnerability (the entire fight, with no other powers having been in play, not just a part of that fight), who has out classed him the way opponents like the Hulk and Champion have out classed Ben
...and how's HE done?
If you use PF he has over a millenia's worth of fighting experience given his time in another dimension. While not depowered during that event, it puts him well above Grimm in terms of applying his skill.
Originally posted by riv6672
I wonder though, who has Superman fought, the way Ben has...By that i mean, with just super strength, skill, and invulnerability (the entire fight, with no other powers having been in play, not just a part of that fight), who has out classed him the way opponents like the Hulk and Champion have out classed Ben
...and how's HE done?
He beat the shit out of him via his skills.
How did that fight start though? Other powers were involved i'm sure.
@DS
Pretty sure its current versions unless specified.
A little late to throw PF in after 3 pages.
Pro Superman side is entitled to their opinions, but shouldnt pretend Superman (any version) goes into a fight, on average at the same level as Ben does. And i say on average to be polite.
Ben's best showings, whether he wins or not, are uphill battles with basic strength and invulnerability.
Superman, not that.
Originally posted by riv6672
How did that fight start though? Other powers were involved i'm sure.@DS
Pretty sure its current versions unless specified.
A little late to throw PF in after 3 pages.Pro Superman side is entitled to their opinions, but shouldnt pretend Superman (any version) goes into a fight, on average at the same level as Ben does. And i say on average to be polite.
Ben's best showings, whether he wins or not, are uphill battles with basic strength and invulnerability.
Superman, not that.
You are penalizing the character for his powerset.
If Ben had more powers he would certainly use them as most of his confrontations involve life or death encounters.
When you allow each character to have the same mindset as it would be here, namely both being restricted to their base form, Ben's advantage is dubious.
Originally posted by riv6672
How did that fight start though? Other powers were involved i'm sure.@DS
Pretty sure its current versions unless specified.
A little late to throw PF in after 3 pages.Pro Superman side is entitled to their opinions, but shouldnt pretend Superman (any version) goes into a fight, on average at the same level as Ben does. And i say on average to be polite.
Ben's best showings, whether he wins or not, are uphill battles with basic strength and invulnerability.
Superman, not that.
😬
Originally posted by riv6672
How did that fight start though? Other powers were involved i'm sure.@DS
Pretty sure its current versions unless specified.
A little late to throw PF in after 3 pages.Pro Superman side is entitled to their opinions, but shouldnt pretend Superman (any version) goes into a fight, on average at the same level as Ben does. And i say on average to be polite.
Ben's best showings, whether he wins or not, are uphill battles with basic strength and invulnerability.
Superman, not that.
Fair enough, I just wanted to say that DCnU has way fewer showings then PF. May sound a bit obvious, but hey.
The problem with Ben's best showings being uphill battles...is that you're comparing a low level brick (amongst the elite strongmen of Marvel) with THE top dog in strength and durability in DC. Of COURSE Ben will have tons of showings of him performing well - because he is usually outclassed. Superman? It's his opponents who are outclassed.