Originally posted by cdtm
Wally could. Superman was in that group of heroes when Wally was lending speed and blitzing through Anti Monitor's armor, and nobody saw him.
Originally posted by Khazra Reborn
You can try to explain away all you want, and I'm not going to try and make that fight out to be more than it was, it was definitely very short and anything could have happened in the long run. But, from what was shown Orion clearly looked better, there's no dancing around that.
Originally posted by Khazra Reborn
How could you possibly call that a surprise attack? Superman hit Orion first.
Also he says that "Orion has surprised him twice". In the very next issue he tanked a continuous barrage of omega beams and even though he was far worse than when Astro force attack, he wasn't koed.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Byrne Superman who was vastly slower than current superman? And taking Wally at his highest showing ever? OK. If we play the same game to Superman, Wally would get oneshotted right as the fight starts.
Chain Lightning happened in 1999. Just because Wally time skipped back to the post reboot crisis, doesn't make it Byrne Superman. Different writer, different rules.
As a general Flash speed feat, this isn't the best.. Outrunning Death would be up there. Or how about crossing the universe as fast as it takes someone to teleport?
But the question is who could beat Superman in a fight, not who can beat him in a race... Wally doesn't need to be faster then Supes, when he could just permanently steal his speed like he did to Inertia, or vibrate organs out of how body (Even in his slower days, Wally was able to vibrate out of Supermans grip during that race Mxy forced on them..)
Originally posted by cdtm
Chain Lightning happened in 1999. Just because Wally time skipped back to the post reboot crisis, doesn't make it Byrne Superman. Different writer, different rules.As a general Flash speed feat, this isn't the best.. Outrunning Death would be up there. Or how about crossing the universe as fast as it takes someone to teleport?
But the question is who could beat Superman in a fight, not who can beat him in a race... Wally doesn't need to be faster then Supes, when he could just permanently steal his speed like he did to Inertia, or vibrate organs out of how body (Even in his slower days, Wally was able to vibrate out of Supermans grip during that race Mxy forced on them..)
Flash doesn't go around beating superman level guys. You'd to go picking showings in once in a decade for that to happen. I can show you ten showings where a superman level being beat the shit out of flash than vice versa. Just because the forum says best showings doesn't means we throw out 90% of a character's history. This is the guy who has trouble with Rogues FFS.
Wally can always self BFR him at the end of time. And ask for entire earth to run while he tries to absorb their speed.
Oh, we're taking one feat as an average and generalized every feat there is. Not to mention OOC tactics. Well, I said comic flash not CBR Flash, did I? In general Wally is more of a jobber than even j'onn. Even Geoff Johns, the biggest Flash fanboy there is didn't write Flash able to beat Superman. What does that tells you?
Originally posted by cdtm
When you put half the board on ignore, you're bound to miss some feats. Or in this case, all of them.
Didn't knew Flash was JLA's heavy hitter instead of Superman. Just like J'onn. Imagine my surprise.
Originally posted by abhilegend
[B]Of course it does. Byrne Superman fought in COIE as per the timeline. It's nonsensical to think otherwise.
1.Byrne Superman wasn't all that slow. Hal froze time froze Earth, and Superman as Clark Kent was still moving around.
2. This writer isn't Byrne. Different writers write difterently, duh. When Johns writes Sinesto in a flashback before coie, he doesn't write him as the clown of the era Ollie koed, he writes him as the baddass he established.
Flash doesn't go around beating superman level jiguys. You'd to go picking showings in once in a decade for that to happen. I can show you ten showings where a superman level being beat the shit out of flash than vice versa. Just because the forum says best showings doesn't means we throw out 90% of a character's history. This is the guy who has trouble with Rogues FFS.
Wally has the showings, as does Barry. Fights are less important then feats,, as they're often political. Many writers such as Starlin have said how DC orders them to treat their flagship character with respect.
Wally can always self BFR him at the end of time. And ask for entire earth to run while he tries to absorb their speed.
Speed manipulation is a completely valid, in character tactic for any Flash. Wally's done in to win fights, Jay's done it against Superman. And while time dumps.aren't in character, speed force dumps are.
