Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
If we "even" things out as you say, Steve most definitely has enough strength to KO him. Using one showing against Juggs and disregarding consistent showings of him getting KO'd by less is not evening things out. Wolverine has been KO'd multiple times by forces less than Steve can exert. And multiple times = consistent showings, not low ends.Re-watch the movie, and so not the implication I was making. There was one, but it is that Logan needed the adamantium upgrade to beat Creed, considering Creed kicked his ass before that. Not that he KO'd him the first time they fought after he got it.
Logan knocks his ass out during their second fight, after tackling him through a window, while they are at the Weapon X facility. He delivers a straight blow and knocks Creed out. We literally get shown it happening. Or is a guy lying there unconscious and unmoving after getting punched in the face no longer a KO?
I asked you why you said his "skills" make him more so and asked you to show evidence of him being more skilled than Cap or Bucky. Because you listed skills as one of the reasons you believe him to be more formidable. And you did not do that.
No one ever said Logan didn't land a hit. Please quote me where I said he never landed a hit, and then you can call me wrong. Logan was landing a few blows here and there, but overall Weapon X was dominating him. And again, Logan would have lost without assistance. He did not beat Weapon X one-on-one, which is what people asked you to post feats for.
No he wasn't. He was literally being killed until someone interfered. And the only impressive thing about SS was his swords. People asked you to post fights where Wolverine beat people above Cap in the various areas listed. Not land some hits before almost getting killed, only to have someone else aid him.
Honestly, I find it astounding how you won't acknowledge that Cap was keeping up with and holding his own against Ultron, in other threads, when he fought him for an extended period of time, took all his hits and blasts, and was still standing and fighting when Ultron left, but you use two examples of fights where Logan would have died without help to claim he was "holding his own".
So you are making things up with zero onscreen proof to back it? Gotcha. Until we have actual proof that Logan can beat a future sentinel one-on-one, all it is is your wishful thinking. And please, we both know that beating a past sentinel doesn't mean anything compared to the future ones. Not to mention when we actually see him fight one in the past he gets knocked on his ass and then Beast jumps in.
We can't just invent feats based on what we think might have been the case. Or anyone on Cap's side can start inventing feats of things he might have done in between movies, while working for SHIELD.
Your initial post was that Wolverine has [B]beaten
better people than Cap, to which Froth asked you to post examples. The only person you listed who Logan beat legitimately, on his own, through sheer skill and ability, is Creed, and he has no feats putting anything except his healing above Cap's.Well, guess we are disagreeing on who holds the advantage. Because Cap has all the stat advantages other than healing, and healing is only going to become a factor (get it? 😆 ) if the match gets drawn out. [/B]
That isn't the only showing though... There are multiple showings where he's taken blows stronger than what Cap could deliver and wasnt' KO'd. When he was sent flying by the Rocket and took out the chopper... The force he would've landed at was more than Cap could deliver and Logan wasn't kept down long enough. Same with the jump out of the speeding airplane in origins. You combine those with his other showings, and no, it's not very likely he'd be KO'd
Oh okay... I wasn't sure what you were referring to and thought you meant the first fight. I'd saw that's a low showing for Creed considering what he's taken as well. Point is, his ruthlessness... claws and Regen make his as formidable as fighting Cap, which was my original premise
You direct quote about the Weapon X fight was this " He was totally outclassed and getting his ass kicked. He was just about to lose his head when Creed interfered. Let's not pretend like Logan had a snowball's chance in hell of beating Weapon X on his own." That si a far cry from how you just described the fight. He wasn't totally outclassed, in fact he was holding his own. Again with somebody well beyond Cap or Bucky. The reality is if you're keeping up with somebody you're keeping up with somebody. Wolverine was keeping up with Weapon X more than Cap was keeping up with Ultron. Sure, Wolverine might not have won in the end, but him dong as well as he did certainly logical indicates to me that he could keep up with or beat somebody inferior to Weapon X.. Cap
No he wsn't being killed at all... he was tackling him down stories ... landing blows...dodging.. outmaneuvering him. This was no stomp. The only real time the SS gained the advantage was when Wolverine ws hanging from the window and he landed a cheapshot and cut off one of his claws. Before that, it was a back and forth fight. I think you should watch it again.
Let me ask you this... Do you believe it's logical to assume Logan never once killed a future sentinel at any point or that he likely killed at least one (likely vastly more, but let's just say one)? Which do you think is more logical? We know they had Mystique's DNA for sometime.. we know the war was going on for sometime... Yet you expect me to believe in all that time Wolverine never killed one? Come on Vault, you know it's logical he did. I understand your point, so this is a tenuous one I agree. Not even saying it's strong evidence since it was never shown. I'm simply saying it's very likely