Originally posted by -Pr-
Exactly.==
TBH, I find the whole "teach men not to rape" thing to be abhorrent, sexist, and borderline insulting. No, actually insulting.
But that's just imo, as I'm sure many will disagree.
The thing is, it feels insulting because of the idea it's needed, right?
But, the effectiveness shows it is needed, and the fact that men don't know this stuff is abhorrent and means there's sexism there already.
I mean, you're educated about consent, sure. But it's not something that just naturally occurs, and you shouldn't be offended by the idea that not everyone is taught it independently.
There's a lot of stuff we aren't taught and have to learn! We all learned stealing is wrong, after all. That's a taught thing.
Education being necessary is nothing to fight or be insulted about. If they already know it, great! If not, that's what it's there for!
And the idea that we shouldn't educate because guys will find it insulting.... well, I find that a much bigger insult to guys than any education on the matter could hope to be.
Originally posted by NemeBro
I agree. When a man rapes a woman, it's a man's fault, and when a woman rapes a man, it is also a man's fault. 👆
Rather shows how the patriarchal views on the sexes hurt everyone. Men are the do-er, men are the sexual beings, etc... and thus, the times it does happen, they have it denied, told they should be *happy* to get laid, etc., because part of rape culture is 'rape is a thing that happens all the time... to women.' So to the guys who do it, they think it's normal (an interesting statistic I learned from interviews with rapists in prison- Non-rapist men often think the number of men who are rapists is 1/100 or similarly tiny numbers, much less than the case. Convinced rapists gave numbers like one half of all guys), and to the guys who have it done to them, they're left isolated and often with little idea where to turn. They're victimized in a way they're told doesn't happen, often to their faces when they try and tell someone, or have it taken completely backwards as a (shudder) *good* thing.
The gender roles that feminism fights against, hurts women, but it doesn't hurt just women. Which is why many feminist sites will also point to male abuse victim hotlines.
Women get shamed and victim-blamed, men get told they liked it and wanted it, and society's attitudes on rape and consent need a fixing all around.
Originally posted by Q99
The thing is, it feels insulting because of the idea it's needed, right?But, the effectiveness shows it is needed, and the fact that men don't know this stuff is abhorrent and means there's sexism there already.
I mean, you're educated about consent, sure. But it's not something that just naturally occurs, and you shouldn't be offended by the idea that not everyone is taught it independently.
There's a lot of stuff we aren't taught and have to learn! We all learned stealing is wrong, after all. That's a taught thing.
Education being necessary is nothing to fight or be insulted about. If they already know it, great! If not, that's what it's there for!
And the idea that we shouldn't educate because guys will find it insulting.... well, I find that a much bigger insult to guys than any education on the matter could hope to be.
That's not what I was talking about.
I have no problem with education. I just think it should be aimed at both genders. Educate young boys about female bodily autonomy. Sounds good.
All I'm saying is, do the same for girls, because girls get pretty bad too, and can tend to have very similar "entitlement" issues. Actually no, entitlement is the wrong word. Disrespect is a better one.
We're all supposed to respect each other, but pretending that one half of the population doesn't do the shit it does, doesn't help anyone. In the long run, anyway.
Also, I should clarify: I mean the right kind of education. Not some of the weird shit that's been peddled of late.
Originally posted by -Pr-
The "enthusiastic consent" silliness, for example. It treats adults like children, which I find just plain weird.
Haven't heard that in a while. We had classes regarding the subject before i retired, sexual misconduct being a hit topic in the Army.
I remember one instructor kept repeating "It’s not just about not getting a “no”, people! It’s about getting a “yes”. Like a mantra.
Originally posted by marwash22
The Nail polish seems redundant, 'cause from what i understand, the female body has ways of shutting that whole thing down when someone tries to legitimately rape them.
👆
Originally posted by riv6672
Haven't heard that in a while. We had classes regarding the subject before i retired, sexual misconduct being a hit topic in the Army.
I remember one instructor kept repeating "It’s not just about not getting a “no”, people! It’s about getting a “yes”. Like a mantra.
Talking more about this: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/09/03/living/affirmative-consent-school-policy/
If getting a yes was where it ended, that would be fine. I mean, silence isn't a yes. They're just getting carried away.